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Sleep training success and my thoughts

43 replies

wellrestedmum · 09/10/2023 21:51

Sleep training - just my experience (success!) and thoughts
So I’ll start by giving my back story on how my thoughts on sleep training have evolved.
I’ll preface by also saying that I’ve had an extremely difficult motherhood journey after experiencing a neonatal death with my first child.
I’m lucky enough to be blessed with another child who is now 2.5 years old.

Before the birth of my second child, I spoke to a few friends who were already mums about the baby sleep thing. I had no idea what to expect but I vaguely knew there was such a thing as sleep training and “cry it out”, I didn’t know much more.
You hear all the time about babies and children not sleeping and I remember thinking “it can’t be that bad”, as I have always suffered from a bit of insomnia from time to time and manage quite well on little sleep. (Boy was I wrong!)

A couple of my friends said they wouldn’t ever consider sleep training, branding it cruel, unethical, unnecessary, that it “didn’t work” and how could anyone ever possibly leave their baby to cry themselves to sleep???!
I absorbed these comments - eager not to do anything whatsoever to “damage” my new baby.
Anyway, baby arrived, we got through the first few weeks where I was extremely anxious given that my first baby got an illness and passed away within the first month.
My new baby slept for 2 hour stretches during the night maximum, if I was lucky. I was breastfeeding round the clock as lots of new mums do.
The level of sleep deprivation after a while was just awful. When I say 2 hour stretches I don’t think it was even that.
It felt like I was up constantly and baby would not be put down anywhere, least of all the next2me crib we had carefully chosen. If he did go in it I could guarantee he’d wake up within 40 mins.
People kept telling me it would get better, the longer stretches would come. But when?? 8 weeks went by, 12 weeks.. 16 weeks. When were the longer stretches meant to be coming?
I think we got to about 17 weeks, perhaps in the midst of the 4 month regression - although I didn’t notice a regression as sleep was so bad anyway.
I knew something had to change.
I felt at breaking point and no longer able to safely function as a person.
We enlisted the help of a sleep consultant / sleep trainer.
I was reluctant to do any kind of controlled crying but felt I had no other choice if I wanted to survive and not dread every single day and night. We did a modified Ferber with short “check ins” every 5 mins.
I couldn’t believe it, the first night we did this he slept for a 6 hour stretch. Things just got better from there and soon we had a restful full nights sleep. My baby was no longer crying on waking all the time during the night and I was much happier and more patient, just an all round better version of myself than I had been previously trying to function on little sleep. I noticed my baby was happier in the day as well having had a full nights sleep. Naps were trained too and at last I had some space from the endless contact naps, able to do some bits around the house or go to the toilet without a baby strapped to me.

I had questions about the sleep training so decided to go digging and researching myself. Had I just “broken” my baby?? Had we caused some sort of mental or emotional damage that would be discovered years later? I wanted to find some answers. At this point it was already done so I accepted that even if there was a negative consequence of training I justified it by thinking that I would rather that than the intense sleep deprivation that was pushing me to the edge and potentially he could have ended up with a suicidal mother.

The more I read the more I came to realise that there is so much misinformation around sleep training.
The big studies (with good methodology) point to no difference in parental attachment between sleep trained and non sleep trained children. No difference in mental health outcomes,
IQ outcomes etc.
There are studies quoted by the “anti sleep training” crowd which do not have good methodologies and I think it’s really hard for the general public to distinguish “good” studies from “bad” studies and that’s where a lot of the misinformation comes from. Not all studies are equal.
I have a science degree and still found it confusing the amount of information and studies available. It’s only when I started reading more in depth and looking at the studies critically that I started to understand where a lot of the misinformation had stemmed from.

In summary, I did a complete 180 from my initial stance on sleep training once I delved into the research.

The “pro” sleep training crowd do acknowledge that there is an argument that cannot be disproven to say what if it does affect them later in life and we haven’t been able to quantify it with a study. I mean that is a possibility but it seems unlikely, all things considered and all studies that have already been conducted. It’s also something that is extremely hard to disprove.

There seems to be a whole generation of parents who have been told that teaching a child sleep independently is damaging somehow. These parents are convinced (as I once was) that the only way to be a loving parent is to keep cosleeping or assisting their babies / toddlers / children to sleep. Any kind of crying is neglectful.

There is absolutely nothing wrong with assisting your child to sleep if that’s what you want to do and are happy with how things are

What I’m saying is there are options if you are not happy with the amount of sleep you and your children are getting.

The anti sleep training crowd seem to be very vocal and accusatory, and of course no parent wants to think they could be damaging their child.
I see so many forums and so much content on social media that seems to be on one side or the other.
The thing is people who are into sleep training are mostly saying “hey, there’s this thing you can do where you leave your baby to settle themselves / another sleep training method and if you get their daytime schedule on track you can actually have a pretty good shot at some decent sleep. Don’t worry if not though”
Whereas the anti-crowd are generally (not always) name calling, telling parents they are abusive: neglectful etc. so many passive aggressive comments like “I could never!!!!!!”.
There’s lots of buzz phrases they use around sleep like “biologically normal” - yes it is biologically normal for young kids to wake up a lot but there are a lot of “biologically normal” things that modern life has overcome, and possessing the knowledge we do, we know that there are certain things that can be done to improve sleep. Sometimes even daytime schedule changes can have a significant effect on nighttime sleep.
What about children who naturally sleep through the night very easily early on, are they not “biologically normal”?

I have a friend who has convinced herself that she’s not sleep deprived but her sleep is “fragmented” which I think is another buzzword from the anti crowd. She sure sounds tired and sleep deprived, assisting their 12 month old to sleep throughout the night because they want her to feel “safe and secure”. I feel like the implication is that she thinks sleep trained babies don’t feel safe and secure going to bed.
My toddler seems very happy to put himself to sleep in his own bed and we have the most amazing and loving attachment.

The anti crowd also argue that things will get better eventually without training. And they will. Of course they will. Eventually most children will sleep through the night on their own.
And like I said earlier, if you enjoy assisting them with their sleep and are happy with that, then you go Glen Coco.
If you’re miserable with sleep deprivation then I hope you’re open to some sleep teaching, it can be life changing.
It does seem to be a bit of a lottery as to when your kid magically sleeps through on their own without any intervention and I do know parents with older toddlers/school age kids and have heard of parents with children up to 8, 9, 10 years old who still need lots of help either getting to sleep or during the night. (Again fine if you’re ok doing that, nothing wrong with it!). Some parents like to feel extra needed and treasure the nights they are up comforting their kids, that’s totally fine.
Personally I am happy not to do this on a regular basis. I do of course go and tend to my child if there is illness or anything causing them to wake unusually. However 99% of the time he is content to sleep soundly through the night and wakes up in the morning happily chilling in his bed for a little bit.

The argument about sleep training “not working”.. let’s talk about this one. There might be instances if your child has a medical condition or potentially some neurodivergent children will absolutely not respond to sleep training. However the vast majority of children DO respond to it. The problem is largely when parents are not consistent with the method they are using. They give up too quickly or send mixed signals - settling the child sometimes and then other times expecting the child to settle themselves. Perhaps they aren’t aware that daytime sleep is linked to nighttime sleep and the child is inadvertently getting too much or too little daytime sleep. Or they might be using a method not suited to their babies temperament- some kids find frequent check ins over stimulating and it doesn’t allow them the space needed to settle themselves. Perhaps the check ins are too long and again over stimulating. Most of the time check ins are meant to be very quick just to let baby know you are still there.
I also acknowledge that training methods differ by age and what works for younger babies doesn’t necessarily work for older babies/ toddlers.

Sleep training is also not just a “one and done” thing. Often there are times when children might need retraining such as after illness when they might have been up a lot in the night and of course you should comfort and do whatever you need to do with kids sleep when they are ill. Perhaps you’ve been on holiday and sharing a room, you might find that baby has become used to this arrangement and will need a period of adjustment to go back to their own room on return.

There’s so much information it can be difficult to get it right. That’s why there’s a multi million £ sleep industry with sleep consultants raking it in! I personally think the information should be free and available to all, in the uk I think it should be on the nhs. My health visitor offered me an appointment with a sleep clinic but only at 8 months!!! There’s no way I could have coped for that long on such little sleep.

So in summary, if you are a sleep deprived parent and wanting to change this and are on the fence about sleep training, I implore you to try it. The absolute key to it all is consistency so make sure you have a plan and stick to it, and if you have a partner make sure you are both 100% on the same page! If you have the budget for a sleep consultant then do it if you feel you need it, the support and hand holding can be invaluable. If you don’t have money to spend, get on some free resources, FB group “evidence based sleep training” - is a really helpful group with so much info.

If you’re sleep deprived and don’t want to change anything / dead set against sleep training then scroll on by.
If you think I am a neglectful parent for letting my baby cry for a few mins at a time to settle themselves to sleep and want to roast me for it then Fuuuuuuck you a million times over, you big bag of judgemental arseholes. I have absolutely zero regrets.

OP posts:
testy1997 · 10/10/2023 08:43

@wellrestedmum I'm where you are right now! What age did you sleep train? So much mixed into on if 4/5 months is too young but I know they do in the US..

Cincills · 10/10/2023 08:51

We did it with DC1. It was the hardest decision we ever made, for the reasons you have stated, but the best one we made! All 3 of us were soooo much happier within days! My only regret was not doing it earlier and letting us all get to rock bottom first.

I always try to pop on to any sleep deprived threads and highlight the scientific studies on the topic so that mothers can make an informed decision.

Firsttimer1125 · 10/10/2023 09:20

I’m at rock bottom now, planning on starting tonight.

when you say modified Ferber, is that just that you did 5 min check ins and didn’t increase or anything else?

when you did the check ins what did you do? Sshhh pat or include pick up put down? I know my baby will be hard… I tried once and he cried so much he was sick! That’s why I’m thinking to include pick up down but he’s 8 months now

BurrosTail · 10/10/2023 10:02

i reached the bottom when I became suicidal because of lack of sleep. Opened curtains and cried because the day was too beautiful for me to enjoy it because I was so exhausted. Cried because baby needed nappy change and I couldn’t function or change it. I cried every time when the baby woke up and I wanted to walk in front of a train.

Sleep training worked for us after a couple of nights, it was amazing. Some nights baby slept through, some nights only woke up a couple of times which is still amazing because he used to wake up every 15mins, 45mins, or hour, and literally NEVER slept more than two hr stints. This lasted 6-7 months. The reduction in waking up was AMAZING. I didn’t even mind the couple of night wakes, and my mental health went back to normal. I still rocked him to sleep if he was ill, and then sleep trained for one night and was back to the hood new normal.

Now I’m thinking if I could sleep train my second baby much earlier. I feel I was not a good mother when I let myself get so far with not functioning. I want to do it earlier this time.

it’s important to play it by the ear, extending the time I was away by 2-3 mins each time worked much better for us as opposed to regular 5 min. He’s now a toddler. He associates the bed with sleeping, instead of rocking, nursing or mummy’s presence. If he wakes up at night time I don’t sleep train then but I’m happy with knowing that it’s only once or twice a night, and a lot of the nights not even that. In the evenings, when we go to bed, he’s so used to the bed being the sleep cue that he’s about to knock out and I can just leave him in there awake and he falls asleep. He gives a cute smile and looks happy so no distress at all.

wellrestedmum · 10/10/2023 10:16

testy1997 · 10/10/2023 08:43

@wellrestedmum I'm where you are right now! What age did you sleep train? So much mixed into on if 4/5 months is too young but I know they do in the US..

@testy1997 4/5 months is not too young and the evidence points to it being fine. Some people sleep train or get into good sleep habits right from birth

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wellrestedmum · 10/10/2023 10:22

Firsttimer1125 · 10/10/2023 09:20

I’m at rock bottom now, planning on starting tonight.

when you say modified Ferber, is that just that you did 5 min check ins and didn’t increase or anything else?

when you did the check ins what did you do? Sshhh pat or include pick up put down? I know my baby will be hard… I tried once and he cried so much he was sick! That’s why I’m thinking to include pick up down but he’s 8 months now

@firsttimer1125 pick up put down only usually works on much younger babies. At 8 months you're looking at Ferber or extinction as your best bet. Checks ins if you do them should be super quick, just popping in to reassure baby. Less than 30 seconds. Some babies get wound up even more by check ins so depends on temperament.

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PinkRoses1245 · 10/10/2023 10:22

You’re right; you are enabling sleep and teaching them that they are safe and will be responded to if they do need it. So much better for parents and babies if everyone sleep well.

PinkRoses1245 · 10/10/2023 10:23

I can never see how picking them up will help as you’re disturbing their sleep and they need to start learning to self settle within their cot, in the knowledge that you are around and nearby

wellrestedmum · 10/10/2023 13:48

Cincills · 10/10/2023 08:51

We did it with DC1. It was the hardest decision we ever made, for the reasons you have stated, but the best one we made! All 3 of us were soooo much happier within days! My only regret was not doing it earlier and letting us all get to rock bottom first.

I always try to pop on to any sleep deprived threads and highlight the scientific studies on the topic so that mothers can make an informed decision.

@Cincills yes I wish we had done it sooner too, I might have enjoyed the first few months rather than being a sleep deprived anxious mess. I have coached a friend to get into good habits early on and her 2 month old baby is pretty much sleeping through the night!

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PurplePetalPip · 10/10/2023 19:19

Thank you for taking the time to write this. It's exactly what I needed to hear. We have sleep trained in the past and have hit a bump in the road with our 2 year old. I sometimes feel guilty revisiting the sleep training when this happens because it's easy to listen to the anti brigade who are so vocal. But you are completely right and it is the best thing for all of us.

Labradoodlie · 10/10/2023 21:04

With DD1 I almost fell down the stairs carrying her I was so tired, and at one point started hallucinating.

I absolutely sleep trained. She screamed when I tried to cuddle or feed her to sleep anyway, so sleep training was actually less crying.

Anyone who wants to judge a) had an easier baby and b) can fuck off.

She’s now a perfectly well adjusted 3yo.

girlmummy25 · 10/10/2023 21:27

Amen

testy1997 · 11/10/2023 09:42

@wellrestedmum what age did you do this

Luxembourgmama · 11/10/2023 09:43

Totally agree

Springbaby2023 · 11/10/2023 13:27

This is such good timing for me. My baby is five months and I’m really struggling, spent most of the past two days in tears due to sleep deprivation. We have a good routine and a good sleep environment and I’m driving myself mad trying to change things in the hope he will sleep. I left it way too late with my eldest as a result of the anti sleep training pressure and I really regret it as it meant my Mat leave was miserable!

SirWalterElliot · 11/10/2023 13:32

Sleep training was wonderful for us and my child. But I am very careful who I talk to about it because some people have very strong views against it (had my fingers burned once or twice, and I'm very much 'this worked for us, but you do what you feel is right' and only when asked!)

wellrestedmum · 11/10/2023 13:34

@testy1997 we trained about 4-5 months old

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wellrestedmum · 11/10/2023 13:38

@SirWalterElliot yes I totally get this and I am also careful due to the strong "anti" movement, hence being anonymous on here. But I think it's really important to talk about given the mental health implications of sleep deprivation on parents (usually especially new mums). I am hopeful that one day the parenting trends will change again or there will be a shift towards sleep training being seen as an equal option, not something that is in any way considered negatively.

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HappierTimesAhead · 11/10/2023 13:43

I made myself ill putting off sleep training. I got so absorbed in instagram pages that are vehemently anti sleep training. They call it child abuse. I have never been so depressed in my life as when my son was 13 months and still waking every hour. Co-sleeping did not work. I was numb, nothing could make me feel happiness. I sleep trained, I started getting a full nights sleep and the depression lifted. I felt happy, energetic, I started laughing again. I feel quite angry that those pages influenced me so much.

wellrestedmum · 11/10/2023 13:43

@Springbaby2023 best of luck to you on your journey with your second! I hope my post has helped you to be confident around your decision to sleep train

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HappierTimesAhead · 11/10/2023 13:46

Springbaby2023 · 11/10/2023 13:27

This is such good timing for me. My baby is five months and I’m really struggling, spent most of the past two days in tears due to sleep deprivation. We have a good routine and a good sleep environment and I’m driving myself mad trying to change things in the hope he will sleep. I left it way too late with my eldest as a result of the anti sleep training pressure and I really regret it as it meant my Mat leave was miserable!

I feel for you so much right now! Remember, you are a loving mum and your baby feels that. Sleep training will not change that. It's your decision but if I could go back I would have done it earlier so I could have enjoyed my mat leave.

SeaToSki · 11/10/2023 13:50

I sleep trained once they had ‘found their hands’ which was around the 4 month mark as I felt they could then actually self sooth. But I did have a solid routine going from the day they came home from the hospital which definitely helped regulate their sleep during the first weeks

wellrestedmum · 11/10/2023 13:52

@HappierTimesAhead so sorry this was your experience and 13 months is a long time to be sleep deprived! Yes I get angry at those pages too, and all the things I listened to at the start. Trouble is it's all so emotive and makes you feel so guilty that you would even consider your own sleep needs. You are in such a vulnerable position having become a new mum, I felt even more vulnerable given the trauma I had been through losing my first baby.

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wellrestedmum · 11/10/2023 13:56

@Labradoodlie we also experienced less crying overall when we had implemented sleep training. It's funny how the "anti" crowd seem fine with all the crying when babies are waking through the night, yet they make out it's absolutely barbaric for a baby to cry for even a few minutes to settle themselves when you're not there.

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HappierTimesAhead · 11/10/2023 13:58

I am so sorry for your loss. I cannot imagine what you have been through and I feel really sad that you were in such a vulnerable position and felt paralysed by the fearmongering (because it really does put the absolute FEAR in you that you are somehow damaging your child and that you are a bad mum). I cried endlessly about it all. Also, it is so hard to think logically when you are so sleep deprived! I can look back at it now with a very different perspective because I get 8 hours of sleep a night!