Waking 90mins/2hrs after going to bed

[Regularhumanbartenderr]

My 8 month old has never been a great sleeper but now wakes 90mins/2hrs after going to bed screaming and can take the same amount of time to get back down. Coupled with then still waking every 3/4hrs at night we’re both completely exhausted - we can go to bed before 9 and still not get any sleep! All night I’m on edge and even if he does go a bit longer, I’m so full of adrenaline I can’t sleep.

His routine has always been the same, bath, book, milk, bed and post 4month regression he was just waking once for a feed around 2am. Now it feels like we’re back to newborn nights.

He’s transitioning from 3 to 2 naps and this is clearly a factor but this wake up seems habitual now - he doesn’t need feeding/changing and it sets all of us up for a rubbish night.

Does it suggest he’s overtired? undertired? Just waiting for the fun of it? I’m so exhausted - any recommendations or ideas? We tried gentle sleep training but this is a stubborn little boy who will scream for as long as it takes us to pick him up!

Hmm, you say he was never a great sleeper but then also say that he used to only wake once for a feed? That's a great sleeper!

Typical for sleep to be rubbish at this age. 7-10 months is commonly the very worst sleep in the first year, but many parents make the mistake of thinking sleep development is linear. It is not. It's normal for babies to have periods of terrible sleep after periods of better sleep. Things are likely to start improving by around 11 months on their own. Until then I would advise to just go with the flow. Let him nap when he's tired, and adjust bedtime accordingly. It's difficult to say whether he might be undertired or overtired since both present similarly, so you may need to just experiment a little - extend his last nap with some contact and see if that helps, try an earlier bedtime, try to distract him and stretch his awake time and a later bedtime. One of these might work, or none of them will.

https://sarahockwell-smith.com/2017/07/24/the-rollercoaster-of-real-baby-sleep/

@GinnyBee True! That only lasted a couple of weeks though - but then I guess that’s about the length of time between sleep regressions really isn’t it!

What time does he go to bed, get up, is he in nursery ?

If he’s not needing a change or feed maybe he’s needing to be close to you? Does he calm down and sleep when you hold him? If so it would be understandable why sleep training would backfire. Does he sleep in his own room? Some babies just need a lot of closeness - my boy definitely did. Around 9ish months is key for separation anxiety. If you accept he’s a mammal that needs physical proximity to feel safe, what could you try? Put his cot in your bedroom perhaps? Try safe co-sleeping?

Also it could be regression before a milestone - every time they’re building up to learning something new like sitting, crawling, walking, that could cause sleep regression.

Thanks everyone, lots to think about!
yes he’s in nursery two days a week and has been for about 6 weeks - initially slept brilliantly afterwards!

He’s been in his own room since 6months and slept much better as we were waking him up every time we moved.

Sometimes he settles next to me, sometimes he just thrashes around and carries on crying. Tried safe co sleeping in the past and it didn’t really work for him. I do wonder sometimes if his tummy hurts as sometimes he’ll do this a couple of times before he finally poos and then settles well.

good to know if nothing else it’s ‘normal’ and will hopefully get better.

What’s his routine?

Sounds like usual 8-10 months sleep madness, was the hardest period of the first year with my son. One to just get through I’m afraid.

https://sarahockwell-smith.com/2015/11/18/what-the-heck-goes-wrong-sleep-wise-at-8-10-months/

It’s also not ‘stubborn’ for a baby to cry when needing parental help and being ignored. It’s a basic survival instinct. They need us.

@BuffaloCauliflower No of course, I just mean that advice from the HV has always been to ‘put him down awake’ and try not to pick him up - not even worth attempting!

@LapinR0se bath, book, milk, bed - tends to go to bed around the same time dependent on last nap and how sleepy he’s looking.

Sorry I mean what times are his naps and meals

Ha, yep! The whole first year is one big regression! I’m convinced that all parents who report that sleep got better at X months except for illness or teething or learning new skills are just saying they had maybe 8 good nights between 5-12 months 😅 mostly they’re just ill or teething and learning stuff!

@GinnyBee that sounds much more accurate! makes it somehow easier to deal with if it’s normal - I’m sick of people telling me he should be sleeping through by now! (and when he does sleep too long I get worried and want to go in 😂)

@LapinR0se breakfast around 7:30, lunch 12 and dinner 5 - milk with and/or between these, depending on how hungry he is. Tends to wake at 5ish, babble a bit, then settle himself back down for another hour or two most days. Naps are all over the place - atm, he has 30mins around 9:30/10, then either a long lunchtime nap of about 90mins, and then no more - or another 30/40mins and then another 30mins or so around 4.

Oh HVs always say silly things like this. Most babies need support to fall asleep, ‘drowsy but awake’ suits such a tiny number. Some babies can self settle but it’s the exception not the rule, and there’s no evidence being able to self settle for some sleep means fewer night wakes either.

My son didn’t start sleeping through the night until 20 months, and at 2.5 still wakes in the night about half the nights.

@BuffaloCauliflower
you can tell he’s our first 😂 thank you - talking to actual people makes me feel much better about it!