11mo and 4am starts - it's breaking me

[donkeyhottie]

11mo had been sleeping until about 6am until a couple of weeks ago. Not always straight through, but pretty good nonetheless.

About 2 weeks ago the 4am wake ups started, and he just won't resettle. Nothing in his day routine has really changed.

I'm just about managing but I'm going back to work next month and I just don't know how I'm going to cope with the lack of sleep.

Help! Is this a phase?

My 3 year old still does this, I just go to bed at 9pm!!

is their room super dark?

What's sleep schedule?
Along with feedings and food?

@OnceuponaRainbow18 he has blackout curtains but he's always slept with a nightlight too.

@ChittyBang1987
Typical day at the moment is usually:
4am wake
5am bottle: 5-7 oz
7am breakfast: a good portion of porridge or 1.5 weetabix
9am morning nap if he makes it that far. This morning he was down just before 8. Usually about an hour and a half
12pm lunch. Usually a sandwich and a large portion of Greek yoghurt, some fruit.
2pm ish afternoon nap. Usually about 1.5 hours again.
5pm dinner. Again, good portions. He likes his food!
7-8pm bedtime, with another bottle but he doesn't always finish that.

It's more usual that he falls asleep between 8 and 8.30. Wake ups don't seem to be affected by an earlier or later bedtime, or if he's had longer or shorter naps in the day.

Mine were like this, nothing we did changed it. Now at 11 they're still up at 530.

It's brutal, I ended up going to bed at 2030 just to be able to cope and function.

If you give him the morning bottle immediately when he wakes up, will he go back to sleep? We found DS would do that at a similar age.

@nearlyspringyay No! I don't want to hear this! 😂

I don't go to bed late, but I need to get jobs done and I need to unwind just for a minute. I have no evenings as it is. Meal is a rushed affair and just perfunctory and depressing. I feel I'm just existing at the moment.

I feel your pain! I have a 8 month old who does similar. My friend is a sleep consultant and advised this-

Leave in cot until 6am (when waking at 4-30) only if they are obviously not in distress.

Don't feed them until 6.30

Drag out the morning nap until as close to 8.45 as possible

This is based on waking at 4.30 am, it seems to be about making the morning as boring as possible so they don't feel any incentive to wake early. By not having the feed so early and waiting longer for the first nap they seem to think oh this isn't much fun etc. I was very sceptical and thought surely this was the opposite of what you should do as they would end up over tired and hungry but it has a worked!

Also make sure they are warm enough as apparently this can be a key time for waking due to the Cold.

Good luck!

@mynameiscalypso I've tried that. He's only dozed off again on me after a bottle once. Bottle is usually at about 5 because I just can't get out of bed immediately. I've tried getting up to him straight away but it doesn't make any difference so I try to doze for a bit longer.

@Vendeevola he'll only tolerate being left in his cot for about half an hour. 45 minutes max. I don't know what I'd do with him that's boring if I tried not to feed him until later. I'm like a zombie at that time so it's hard enough as it is. If I try to lie down and cuddle him he just squirms and eventually gets pissed off. He's not very steady on his feet so if I tried to leave him to play then he'd need picking up every few minutes.

Room temp is fine.

@Vendeevola how did you drag out the morning?

They are little monkeys aren't they? It's so frustrating when you know they will be grumpy all day!

Hope you manage to find something that helps, I've noticed with my son there's little logic to it. Is there any chance he's overtired? My son napped poorly yesterday and this morning was back to the early morning wake. I'm hoping that's why it is anyway! 🙈

I dragged the nap out by adding an extra ten minutes or so of awake time. I was putting in into nap at 8am but my friend explained if you see it from their perspective ..

They wake early
Get more play time
Get food earlier then if asleep
Then get a nice nap so the next day do the same.

But if they don't get the feed so early and the nap then they seem less inclined to repeat.

I didn't think it would work as my son woke that early for weeks but by being consistent it has. At first I would also be awake until 6 when he came out the cot (usually he would bite the cot, play with the sleeping bag , whine etc) so it seemed pointless but something seemed to click and he started sleeping in later (5.30) so not much difference but it feels a lot more civilised!

I had one like this! Now he will sleep in a bit (but still an early bird!) but I can't! I wake up at 5.30am (which used to be a lie in).
I resisted going to bed early for so long, but when I finally gave in to just getting up earlier it gave me a lot more peace (and sleep!)
I used to leave everything the night before and go to bed as early as possible, then get up at 4am intentionally (yeah, I know 😱) and do the dishes, have a bath, scroll on social media, watch TV, do laundry, etc. Just flipped the routine round.

In that case, definitely stay dozing! Hopefully it is just a phase that passes soon. It's a bloody nightmare isn't it? I have no idea how DS survives on such little sleep sometimes!

Are you giving snacks in day?

As another person said. I wouldn't be getting them up at that time. I woudlnt be feeding. But I would potentially be adding some extra food in. I read somewhere they get to 12 months and they go through a big spurt. Must be something to do with walking etc.

And drag that morning nap for later. Go for a walk or do anything else you can think off. Chuck them in the garden if need be. I would be capping that morning nap too.

@ChittyBang1987 I haven't been giving him snacks because he seems to eat a lot for his age! His portions are pretty big. Plus, he doesn't always finish his last bottle so I assumed hunger wasn't an issue. But he is much more active now so maybe snacks would help.

This morning's nap was a bit of a disaster. He woke after about 40 minutes, which he does sometimes & I assumed was the end of a sleep cycle. I got him back to sleep expecting another 30 minutes or so, but he stayed asleep! I ended up waking him at the 2 hour 20 mark. He was sound asleep so god knows how long he'd have gone on for.

I'm going to try to leave him for as long as I can in the morning, not feed him until later and add in a couple of snacks.

How long would you cap the morning nap to? Is it better to have a short am nap and a longer pm nap?

My lo is big for her age to. Highest percentile for height and weight age 2 to 3 clothes. ( shes 14months) Hv never concerned, as long as its the right food and snacks she said.

With snacks I kind of follow what nursery do. If a kid is eating and putting it their own mouth I always take it they need it (obviously not like a pound of chocolate for snacks) so since about 12 months we done this.

730am breakfast porridge. If she has cereal we have to add toast of yoghurt it doesn't fill her up like porridge. Even with porridge she wud have half a slice toast about 830am or 9am with mummy. I know some still having milk after breakfast and that's fine but we have a milk hater

930am to 10am when nursery give snack. They give a carb like toast and fruit. At home bout 10 to 1030am give cheese a babybel, a baby fruity bar thing or like baby crisps.

1230pm approx same time as nursery. Lunch. For example we give crumpets, a meat of some kind, cheese if haven't had earlier (she loves her cheese) and yoghurt or custard just before her nap to ensure she has full belly. A lot of people still do milk before nap.

330pm to 4pm. I give a bicotti thing or something. Nursery usually give a early dinner about 430pm. My lo always starving when home so told them to give her a snack now.

530pm dinner from what I read this is meant to be carb meal. I always add protein and lots of veg. If my lo eats anymore cauliflower I'm sure she will turn into one.

630pm sometimes a digestive biscuit, I know not great but she loves them and gets them maybe 2 times a week.

My lo likes her milk in 2 sittings about 7pm and 730pm. Only bottle she had since 12 months takes 5 to 8oz.

I read somewhere that a baby's intake of carbs increases at 12months.

For naps.

I did 9am to 10am. Or 930am till 1030am depending how my lo was on the day. I always woke her after an hour after i saw she fell asleep on monitor.

1pm to 130pm pop again to sleep. I have always left her to sleep as long as she needed if possible. I start disturbing her if it gets to about 330pm.

Bed 730pm asleep by 8pm.

This is almost like the 234 routine. But with my own version of my lo awake times.

I have no idea if it's right but it works for us when we did it. Some people say lo is better with a longer morning then afternoon nap or vice versa. It depends of your lo.

How many bottles are you giving? And how close to dinner?

As lo woke at 40mins Mark, I would definitely say lo is overtired. May be a reason for early mornings.

Another one, make sure room is blackout to prevent waking at that time.

Sorry I have waffled 😆 🤣

@ChittyBang1987 no waffle, that's all so helpful!! Thank you so much for taking the time to share that. It's really given me a lot to think about.

Up until now, I've really just tried to go with the flow, but with returning to work looming I really feel I need to try to get a handle on it.

He's only on 2 bottles a day. Morning bottle is about an hour before breakfast and bedtime bottle is usually about an hour to two hours after tea, depending on what time he goes down. He doesn't always finish that one.

Your welcome. I certainly felt like I was waffling.

Nothing wrong with the flow, I do that more now as we're between nap transitions 2 to 1. So things can change on the day. I think babies do thrive on routine though.

Have a jiggle and see what works and doesnt work. It's about what suits everyone, and when you go back to work it will be a bit disruptive but I found a routine really helped in our circumstances as I was able to pass it to others.

Good luck and let us know how u get on

We had this as did a lot of my antenatal friends. It wasn’t quite as bad as 4am, but DS regularly woke between 5 and 5:30am from about 10-14 months. What semi worked for us was making the morning nap brief (30 mins tops) and making the afternoon nap a bit earlier and longer. But to be honest it only properly fixed itself when DS dropped to 1 nap between about 14 and 15 months (same with most of my antenatal friends - one is still battling on at close to 2 with 2 naps and an early wake). Within a week or so he was sleeping in past 6:30 consistently. It was an awful couple of weeks when we transitioned to one, but life got immeasurably better when we did. I think it’s really difficult at ~1 year old. 1 nap isnt enough but 2 is too much. Hopefully when you can drop to 1 nap it gets better for you too.