controlled crying - is 8 months too young?

[potatofactory]

We have just started trying controlled crying with our 8-month-old baby. She has got into a habit of having episodes of escalating crying at night (sometimes for hours). The key thing for us in making our decision to try controlled crying was that she was getting in a state anyway, and kept crying whether she was being cuddled or not - presumably because she is tired.

We have only done one night but it has been traumatic so far. Is she an ok age to try this? Are we going to undo all our good work so far in making her feel happy and secure? We have always had a policy of not leaving her to cry up until this point.

All advice eagerly received..

Another thread under the sleep topic (I think)

There is a long running thread called 'Sleep is for the weak' or somesuch populated by people with non sleeping babies who share ideas and encourage each other.

here in fact

thanks very much! Off to study said thread carefully...

potatofactory, well done for sticking to your guns
but 3 hours (and no improvement over 2 nights)
is really a very long time and might suggest
that there is something else happening unrelated to sleep.

Not sure whether you've already answered this but
could she be ill? Ear infection?
As far as you can tell does she show any signs
of illness during the day?

If you can bear it and you are positive that health-wise she is fine,
give it one more night.
There is a chance that she just has not 'got it' yet
and it would be a shame to confuse her by throwing in
the towel after 2 nights.

If you want to soften things why don't you incorporate
a PU/PD into the CC routine? For example:
Start CC, check after 2 min, check after 5 min,
then pick her up, cuddle her, lots of soothing words and gentle kisses until she is
calm (or as calm as possible), then put her down again,
followed by 2 minutes CC, 5 minutes CC, PU/PD and so on.

Hi - it sounds do-able - as long as you're not picking up, only staying in for 2 mins max and not leaving lo for more than 10 mins (or so - I always fell asleep!) you're doing all the right things. Give it a go tonight and see.

Really grateful for advice - will try tonight and see what happens, but there is no way I'm going to be able to stand another 3 hours - def won't let it go on that long, as if it looks like it might, she is clearly not ready / not going to respond / being traumatised or all three..

Thanks all

x

I am sure she isn't ill, or I wouldn't be attempting this. She will be teething soon though., no doubt, and then I may have to start all over again anyway once she's over that!

potatofactory you have my utmost sympathy as one night of 3 hours was enough to test my sanity. I posted about this next day and someone said there LO did it for 4 hours for 5 nights!!!!!! had never heard such a thing!! I think there are probably many reasons why it doesnt work, including, there being an underlying problem with LO (has she any other symptoms during the day, eg. wind, tummy troubles, separation anxiety); timing (sometimes they are just not ready) and possibly emotional readiness of parents (although I'd have to say that it is incredibly difficult to be emotional ready for this) You are probably beating yourself up about this as now you've started, you feel you need to finish (we felt that) but dont beat yourself up as you are trying your best and if you need to give up, it doesnt mean that you cant revisit it, several people also posted and said it hadnt worked at a certain point but worked month later or so. Do you think you're Lo would settle quicker if you sat with her stroking her head until she went to sleep instead of leaving or would that make it worse. Or what about DH cuddling and then leaving (this also worked for DD1 as she got it quicker when it wasnt me) I hope you get some sleep tonight!!!!!! Just dont feel bad, you are trying your best to help her, it just doesnt work out the way we hope.

Hi Potato - how did it do?

How did it go last night?

I hope things are better for you XX

Hi Potatofactory, I'm the one whose DS cried 4 hrs a night for 5 nights, and who cc didn't work for. We now co-sleep and things are getting better, but he's a lot older than your dd. Happy to describe how it went for us if you are interested, but just letting you know that although almost everyone will swear cc is the solution, it doesn't work for everyone. That said, hope it works for you

We caved!!! It was obviously going to go the same way, and I stopped once she started to get REALLY upset - I didn't want a baby phobic about going to bed at all (as I said yesterday she cried anywhere near her cot yesterday). She slept with us, in teh end, which was ok, but she was exhausted. She may slip back into having long episodes of crying like she used to - we'll have to wait and see.

Greenglass giblin - really good to hear your comments, as it helps me think that maybe there's a chance I haven't done the wrong thing. I really do want her to sleep in her own bed though... with your co-sleeping does your DS go down on his own while you have youR evening first?

Overall I feel better that DD didn't cry inconsolably for hours again last night, but am aware that the problems are not solved! May try CC again when she's older..

TRhanks to all of you for your comments.

x

giblin? GOBLIN. Sorry!

Pevie and Daddyj - thanks for supportive words xx

Hi again PF, I'm glad you've reached your decision, but sorry things didn't work for you. Our DS does go down in his own bed, and if (when, groan) he wakes in the evening we resettle him in his own bed. It's usually just a pat and a shush. We've been able to do this since about 7-8 months old, I think. After midnight (or 11.30ish if I'm feeling weak) either DH or I will take him to the spare bed to co sleep. As he's got bigger, it is not unknown for him to sneek into our bed unnoticed... He sleeps very well now, provided he's not alone. Important to note, I think, that while I would prefer DS to sleep alone, I am a bit of a soft hippy, and believe that if he needs to co-sleep, so be it, so haven't tried to break the pattern since our CC debacle. If you want things to change, I think you have to keep going, trying the training whenever you feel your DD is ready.

Thanks GGG. I did feel a lot better knowing she was secure and not crying. She certainly looked contented...

We'll see...

I am sorry it did not work out, potatofactory
but you are certainly right to try something else.

I wish I could tell you (and GGG) why it has not worked.
I remember reading that about 20-30% of CC attempts fail
but unfortunately nobody seems to have systematically
analysed why they fail.

The main thing is that you and your lo get a decent nights
sleep and if that means co-sleeping - no worries at all!
Whatever works is good.
No evidence that co-sleeping makes dcs more clingy and needy.
No evidence that CC/CIO does any 'damage'.

I keep my fingers crossed!

Thanks so much, DaddyJ. 20 - 30% significant I suppose. I had the impression it worked, as long as you could stick with it, so it's quite a comfort to know it really may not have (it didn't look like it was going to), makes me feel better about the whole caving thing..

This was the first thread I have ever started, and I really valued everyone's comments, thank you.

Just thought potatofactory, there are lots of other techniques you might want to try eventually, like gradual withdrawal. I'm certainly hoping that we will find a technique that works for us eventually as like you although we do some cosleeping, I'm not that fond of it. I'm too restless for a start. Interesting about it failing sometimes, as I used to also think that if it didnt work then people must be doing it wrong!!!! But now know that some LO's just dont respond very well. May do if you were prepared to listen to screaming for hours on end continuously, but I reckon very few of us are. I've seen a few people mention Tanya Bryon's technique which is to only do it for half an hour, where can I find this?

i havent read all posts but I am sure there will be a mixed bag. Jsut to say that after months of torturous sleep deprivation with a baby who woke every 1.5 - 2 hrs EVERY night , I resorted to cc. It went against every maternal bone in my body but I was desperately unhappy, dd was desperately unhappy, dh was getting bored with my complaints about tiredness and my poor 8mo ds was cranky for most of the day on and off. It was hard, hard, hard but once I had started I had to continue. Within a week he was a different baby. Happy, well rested, secure, full of the joys of spring. I don't receommend it but I am so glad I did it when I did and not when ds as any older. I also did it for his naps which he would only take in the buggy or the car. Worked a treat!

Hi cruisemum - really interested in what you say - I'd like to know what kind of sessions you had in that week - we had inconsolable, heart-breaking trauma for three hours first night, then more like 4 hours the second. I didn't feel like there was a breakthrough imminent, and caved the third night....

What was your experience?

Thanks Pevie - I'm going to look into less harsh methods - I wonder what Tanya Byron recommends when you have done it for half an hour, and it hasn't worked so....what then? I'm going to try and find out?

potato - so sorry to hear of your hard time of it, not to mention lo's too. . my ds responded quite well. the first night it was about 50mins, then again in teh night. Following that it took about 4 - 5 more nights but it did get progressively less and less. Teh hardest actually was teh night waking ones. I felt i had perpetuated his waking by bf back to sleep on demand and felt wracked wtih guilt that I was now withdrawing that comfort. As my mother pointed out at the time though, the very thing that was sending him back to sleep was the very same thing that was waking him. It was kind of like weaning from dummy (plus cuddles though). Bvut he soon got it and we have not looked back since (he is now 16mo). Maybe cc is not for your lo. You could try again when you feel stronger though. Sending sleepy thoughts your way

Hi Potatofactory - sorry may have not read the whole thread properly but how much does your lo sleep in the day?

What kind of routine is she in, ie feeds etc?

Hi Crusemum1 I agree that it looks like CC is not for my daughter, yet anywya. I could definitely have coped with 50 mins - she only slept when she was so exhausted she had no choice, but clearly she had not learned anything useful, except to cry even harder the next night (which she did do). She even reacted to being put in her cot during teh day for a nap - bad. I thinkg I'll wait for now (she is still spensding a lot of time awake, even in bed with us) and then try again, but maybe not - I didn't feel good about it, having spent 8 months trying to make her feel happy and secure...

Thanks for sleepy thoughts!