Help me get my 3 year olds sleep back on track

[Bramblecrumble]

My just turned 3 year old is exhausted. She has been going to sleep well by 730 every night since dropping her nap over 6 months ago. But for the last 10 nights she's been in bed for about 2 hours falling asleep any time after 9, most nights not long after 9 but one night after midnight. So she's been having tantrums in the day. She was potty trained at 23 months so it's not that. She's been sleeping well at night since 18 months, so half her life but now she seems to have regressed. Anyone in the same boat?

And she gets up the same time in the morning, now will nap on most car rides but I'm reluctant to let her.

What time is she getting up in the morning?

Is she in a bed or cot and has that recently changed?

What happens in that time between going to bed and going to sleep?

Finally, you mentioned potty trained. It's usual for there to be a tear it two gap between dry and night and dry in the day. Is she in a night nappy still?

She gets up around 7 every morning. She moved to a bed from a cot over 6 months ago. We do the bedtime routine ending in a story with her lying in bed. Then a kiss goodnight. Usually she'll be quiet, chat with teddies for about 20 minutes. Then call. Sometimes because she wants to tell me a story, have a drink, give me a cuddle. I'll leave and she keeps calling me back, varying intervals, eg 1 minute to 30 minutes. We have been firm about staying in bed, she sometimes cries herself to sleep.

She was dry at night before daytime so we did day and night training together, she had has only a small number of bed wetting in her life, and none for over.a year at least. Sometimes she'll go to the toilet after going to bed, about 9pm, but not always. She doesn't ask to but its sometimes what she needs.She doesn't ask to go at night. It's often an argument for her to use the toilet when she gets up.

Have you tried an earlier bedtime? My 3 year old seems to take longer to go to sleep and do more getting in and out of bed when he goes to bed later (even when he should be absolutely exhausted). Maybe she is overtired.

The calling you back at bedtime essentially comes down to her feeling anxious. She's making excuses so that you don't leave her on her own.

Are you going downstairs once you've put her yo bed?

Have you tried keeping her door open and promising to stay upstairs while she goes to sleep? Then keep popping by her door So she can see/hear you nearby.

Today was a bit different as we had an event an hours drive away from 3-7. Our hope was she'd fall asleep in the car, as she does still stay asleep during transfer but now awkward. Unfortunately she napped on the way there and not home so she's gone to bed not long ago. I do agree it's anxious, and I had insomnia anxiety when pregnent so can relate. the anxiety does seem to come after she's been trying to sleep for about 20 minutes.Tomorrow we will try again.

Note,.she actually went to bed about 40 minutes ago but I've been popping up and down stairs it took a while to write this.

She might be a bit young for this but you could try the oh I forgot method. Essentially you pop in and out every few minutes so she doesn't feel that you aren't there ... So sit with her for a bit then say oh mummy forgot to have a wee or whatever you like then back in after a few minutes. Sit with her for another few then say oh I forgot to pull the chain - back out for a minutes and repeat. You are trying to lengthen the time out over each interval but don't let her cry or get upset as you risk making her anxiety worse. It's not a quick fix

If she tries to get out bed to follow you I would consider abandoning that attempt because you risk forcing her back into bed, she might get very upset and then you've got a bigger mess but it does depend on the child

The ideal scenario is that you pop in and out and by a few attempts she's fallen asleep and then she should fall asleep quicker and quicker but don't expect it to be within a week

Thing is she doesn't follow me out most of the time. Just some of the time. One night she told me to leave. Often she'll lie in bed for a few minutes then call me. She doesn't have obvious separation anxiety. Last night it was 10:30 sleep and we did give her suspension parecetomol to help her sleep at 10pm. Maybe she had a headache....she had a lie in until 830 this morning (just as I was leaving for work) so that's something.

Yesterday asleep 5-7 pm. (I was working DH hoped she'd sleep through she has before from 5 when exhausted). Then dinner a bath, two stories back to bed around 9pm Settled with the star projector for 10 minutes, then happy with a teddy for about 15 enough for me to water the garden. After it goes dark she keeps calling me. we watched the sunset and I sand her 3-4 star/moon songs. She Settles then fireworks perk her up. We tried a variety of different lights. She went to the toilet again. She needed her window closed due to shouting outside so got a fan out. Hoped the white noise and cooling would help. She loved it and sat in frount of it. She called a few times. I gave a warning, then removed the fan. I told her it's the last time I'm coming up until bed. DH goes up and she screems at him for mum. We tried to watch a half hour program on TV. Gave up at 11. Losing our temper at this point. Went to bed, DD wanted to sleep on me. Gave liquod parecetomol and piriton at 11:15. At one point I thought DH was falling asleep, stayed in DD room, her lying on me. She poked my eye when I closed it so I reacted angrily. She told.me to apologize. I went to bed when she was settled but awake. She kept calling. DH decides to drive her to sleep at 12:15. He was holding off as she loves a drive and petrol is expensive at the moment. They came back half an hour later.and she was carried to bed asleep. It's too f* hot for this, we need a babysitter.

Yesterday asleep 5-7 pm.

This is the total cause.

Sleep between 3pm-7pm is like a cardinal sin at this age. Never, ever allow it - it absolutely will fuck up your night every single time. Huge mistake.

I remember from 6 months -2 years ish, never nap at 5. My heart sunk a bit when I got the text last night. He was hoping she'd stay asleep all night. Big gamble. However, this has been the only time she's slept at that time in the past 2 weeks. If she has napped in the car on days I had her I woke her up. She's been horrible and groggy waking her up. So one day, around 2pm I put her to bed from the car messaged my husband and he said 'noooo' so I woke her and didn't have time to myself. I think no naps at 3 years old is what we need. However with this heat wave maybe napping through the heat, playing in the evening and getting a routine back when it's cooler is best. Shrug.

Fate/destiny. From experience if I go downstairs, she sleeps. Normally, the only time she has fallen asleep (at bedtime) with me in the room since she was 15 months is if I'm asleep first. I could say I'll pop in every 10 minutes, but to be honest I'd worry about distracting her when she's nearly asleep. She says she's frightened some nights but I don't know whether to believe her. First time she said it, I stopped being firm, quick and gental and sat with her to talk about feelings. Night after that she said she was frightened, didn't look frightened, more bored, then asked to tell me a story. Another night she said she's scared and when her dad asked what of she made something up. You could tell from the way she paused.

I would put her to bed and then have 20-30 minutes worth of upstairs jobs to do.

Out washing away, tidy up, clean bathroom. Or even just lie on your bed and scroll on your phone for half an hour.

I would want to be upstairs while she goes to sleep, for reassurance, but not in the bedroom with her. Then periodically walk past the bedroom door (left open) and make enough noise while littering around upstairs, so that she knows I'm there.

Littering = pottering (autocorrect)

I'll try that tonight

It would need more than 1 night to make a difference. 2 or 3 weeks of consistency is needed to see differences for most changes.

Another thing you could try is an audiobook on at low volume (so she has to lie still to listen to it). This worked on my DS at a similar age. And agree with avoiding early evening danger naps! I remember the sinking feeling when I went to look for the toddler to give him his tea and found him asleep face down on the floor...

My sister suggested an audio book but she got very demanding and emotional about it, then threw the speaker....

She was a little confused about the consept of an audiobook and told me we can stand the book on frount of the speaker so she can see the pictures.

:-) toddler logic! Well it was worth a try anyway. In that case I'd go with sorting the laundry nearby or similar then!