Can Ferber method work if baby isn't in her own room?

[CoffeeAddict81]

Due to pandemic our 9.5mo is still sleeping in our room as her 'nursery' is now a home office. Job hours mean there's no way of moving her till we are back in the office.

She's been waking up every hour after midnight for the past few weeks and it's been hell for me - zero sleep! Naps are also getting harder. Pretty sure it's the 8 month sleep regression as it hit at 8mo exactly. Before that she slept through.

I'm ready to sleep train. We already did the trust method back at 4mo but now she's not responding to that, and her separation anxiety is full on so the picking up constantly is sort of fuelling it iyswim? Also my back is nearly broken.

I was recommended the Ferber technique which I think is the same as gradual retreat? Has anyone
a) ever done this successfully during 8/9 mo sleep regression
and
b) ever done this with baby sleeping in the parents room?

Her cot is over in the corner but she can still see me when I'm in bed. I saw someone on here recommending using a screen for this. Has anyone done this successfully?

(Obviously it would work for bedtime and naps as I'm not in the bedroom at those times, but come the middle of the night she sees me sleeping in the same room).

Ferber method (controlled crying) is completely different to gradual withdrawal.

I think from your post you are planning on doing Ferber (controlled crying). It can't realistically work with you in the room and no, a screen would be a terrible idea (I can just imagine the confusion that will create in an already very stressful and confused time for baby).

I'd suggest gradual withdrawal.

Let's start at the beginning. How does baby go to sleep when it's bedtime and naptime? By that I mean from when baby is fully awake and ready for a sleep, until being fully asleep. What happens? Does the same thing happen at night wakes? Does the same thing happen for daytime naps?

What is her daytime nap routine?

Does she have night feeds? What is her daytime feeding routine (With solids and milk feeds)?

Thank you @FATEdestiny

She is eating 3 meals a day, so after dinner and some calming play like reading, she has a bath at 7pm every night. This takes 5-10 mins. Then into pyjamas, then into dark bedroom and into sleeping bag. Then bottle and I sometimes gently talk to her about her day or sing. Then put down drowsy but awake.

The same thing for 2 day naps but no pyjamas. Still sleeping bag and darkened room though.

Getting her down is still ok on the whole and we have always had an evening. But now she wakes after midnight repeatedly. She is rolling around a lot and seems to cry out when she ends up on her tummy / all fours, but she knows how to roll back over into her back- she just doesn't do it at night so we have to put her back down. We weaned her off night feeds a while ago on HV advice, so we don't offer anything at night expect a sip of water occasionally.

What do you think?

What are you currently doing when she wakes up? You could try just offering verbal reassurance with your voice from your bed but not picking her up?

On most occasions verbal assurance, or even patting isn't sufficient to calm her. She wants picking up. As soon as I pick her up in my arms she drops back off.

My eldest was 9-10 months when I used a gradual retreat approach. I was shocked how well, and how quickly (about 3 nights!) it worked. She was in her own room though. I think you'll see enormous benefits from trying it, but your own sleep may still be disrupted by 'normal night noisiness'. I found it a relief when mine went into their own rooms around 6 months or so, because I was still reacting to any sound they made but most of those noises could be safely ignored.

Best wishes.

Why would they advise to stop fluids at night? Surely when you wake you need a drink?
Leaving a child to cry whose brain isn't developed enough causes the child to loose trust in their parent coming back, wonder what they ever did wrong to deserve being left and is only taught in western cultures.
There's also no such thing as regression, people have growth spurts and are often hungrier then too.
Rather than listening to anyone else, listen to your baby. They cry to tell you something, how awful that Ferber told so many parents to not trust their gut.
Your baby was able to crawl, say words etc without training, they will sleep without training too.

@B1rthis

They didn't advise to stop fluids? Just to stop milk. We offer water, as I said.

Also, whilst your opinion is valid, the majority of scientists would disagree with you.

Plus my baby needs sleep, and she needs two parents who have slept.

And in any case, if you do totally disagree with any form of sleep training, why would you jump on a thread specifically about sleep training? Just to tell me I'm damaging my child? No thank you.

@FATEdestiny any ideas?

Hey @CoffeeAddict81 , full sympathies. Not sleeping is dreadful. I’m not sure on your specific problem but I would recommend actually reading the Dr Ferber book. He has lots of helpful advice on sleep and from my memory of reading it, the controlled crying advice is the last resort advice after trying to identify other ways to resolve the problem. I did read it when only getting 45mins sleep at a time before having to breastfeed an 8 month old back to sleep so my memory may be hazy 😅 but I remember it being very helpful overall. I hope you get sorted soon and you all get some rest!

Something is making your baby wake after midnight.
Sometimes it is too much or too little daytime sleep. What’s her routine like?
Also do you snore? That might be waking her if she is room sharing.

I would have fed mine and brought the non-sleeper into bed with me as that was basically all he wanted.

I gave mine a nice warm bottle, nappy change and back to sleep! I think this is terribly frowned on these days (mine are still at primary!) But it worked for me.

No point feeding - we tried that when we were getting desperate and it bakes no difference. She still wakes up again and again between about 1-5.30.

@LapinR0se she has two naps, around 1.5 - 2hrs total. Last nap ends no later than 3.30 but normally 3. Bath / bed routine starts at 7pm for around 30mins. Wake up at 7am.

Co-sleeping also didn't work for us and I'm not happy doing it. I'm keen to help her self settle in her own bed.

You will have to do what you think right but I'm really unsurprised about a baby under one waking several times to feed in the night.

she has two naps, around 1.5 - 2hrs total

That's not much daytime sleep for this stage. I'd be wanting 3 to 4 hours. Could you lengthen either nap by resetting?

I'd be wanting either two naps of 1h30-2h or a morning nap of 45 mins and afternoon nap of about 2h30.

I would also suggest you fully seperate feeding and sleeping. This us so that you have to develop a way to get baby to sleep in the cot when no milk is involved.

So start doing your bedtime milk feed downstairs during your quiet time, before bath and pyjamas. Likewise move the time if day you give the milk feeds so they are not just before going to sleep. You could, for example, feed when waking up instead.

Then at bedtime and naptime, put baby into the cot fully awake. Bend over into the cot and do all of your settling in there.

Can baby physically go from standing to sitting to lying down without any help? If not yet, these motor skills will develop shortly. Once baby can do this, start teaching instruction following rather than doing things for baby. For example put her in the cot stood up, tap the mattress and tell her to lie down. So she does it herself.

In the cot, a firm hand in baby's chest can be good for this wriggling around phase. Some babies respond patting, others like stillness. Some a shushh sound, others silence.

The idea (of gradual withdrawal) is to give as much reassurance that baby needs, then have a plan over several weeks/months to reduce how much reassurance is given in a gradual way.

So it may mean starting leaning into the cot, patting if distressed, but shilling hand when calm. But bending in to the cot at all times until asleep.

Then after a few days/weeks hand on chest to calm when distressed, but remove hand when calm, but stay bent over cot all the time until asleep.

Then hand on chest yo calm if distressed, remove hand and stand next yo cot when calm. Stay until asleep.

Then hand on chest if unsettled, stand facing away from cot when calm. Go back yo hand on chest if distressed, withdraw when calm. Stay until asleep.

Then hand in chest to settle, sit on your bed when calm. Then lie on your bed. Then wait by the door, and so on.