very bad sleep problem and deep rooted

[mumsville]

This is for a mate -I feel bad that I can't help as I'm a first time mum with a very easy going ds.

Basically her ds whos 1 has never slept through night. She's at wits end as she works full time commutes over 3 hours a day, partner doesn't drive and to top it all is the carer for her very large and disabled mum. Basically she's never been able to get ds into routine as mum sleeps until 2pm every day and can't be disturbed. They've managed to get him off milk at nights but he's waking for juice and I think that's the same thing. He's never slept in his cot.

I think ds is so used to being seen to as soon as he opens his mouth (to avoid disturbing his gran) and fed as a way of pacifying him (I've fed him he wants about three sips every 5-10 minutes!!!!!! ).

I honestly thought that a routine would come when friend went back to work at 5 months and he was in nursery - but no so.

Any advice?????????? So I can advise her?

I personally think get him off any night feeds and sleeping through night and then tackle sleeping in cot? But how?

I feel so bad for her and I wish I could help ie bring her to stay with me for a week and try and help get her ds into routine, but I also work and she lives an hour's drive away.

bump - really do need advice on this one.

if he doesn't sleep in a cot, where does he sleep?

when you say off milk at nights, does that mean formula or bm.

Does she want advice mumsville, or will she see it as interfering and you trying to tell her that she's doing things wrong?

Also wondering where he does sleep. Is she co-sleeping with him?

I'd be worried about the juice at night thing - terrible for his teeth!

Right to explain

He's bottle fed - I think she felt that he should be sleeping nights so it's a big step that he doesn't wake for milk now. Just for juice!

He sleeps with mum in her bed - daddy sleeps on the sofa. If someone told me it's normal for a kid of 1 year old to wake nights and then fall asleep after juice then I'll tell her (mine doesn't).

I'm convinced that he's not getting enough in the day as he snacks (has from birth).

Also she tried controlled crying but had to abort as her own mum was disturbed and that sets her off (ie likely to fall out of bed get quite nasty etc - and friend as to physically care for mum).

I'm wondering if she needs to take time of off work ie a week and try something drastic - but what. If he could sleep most nights it would make her own mother more rested and stop some of the problems there. She could also probably cope better all round with the odd night sleep.

He's teething - I'm persuading her to give her ds something to help with pain to sleep nights?

I juts think sleeping good and bad gets into a habit and her ds has got very bad habits.

Could the nursery help more, if so, how?

Yes, she does want help. She's kind of admitted it now - in fact she's emailed a freind who called me late last night from la (so my poor ds ended up having a late night as I was mid bedtime routine!). But I'm so concerened.

She must feel so alone. Imagine - not one second of the belongs to her - she's such a lovely and kind person - i feel crap not being able to help more.

If someone told me that it could be done in a weekend I'd suggest she come stay with me (dh would have t oput up and shut up) and try and sort this out here. But I'm not sure it would.

I might be wrong butin her attempts to stop her own mother being disturbed, she's attended to the baby's every whim and could her ds have picked up on this and is playing on it? Ie the minute I open my mouth mummy with come running?

Who looks after her mum whilst she's at work? Could they look after her for a few nights whilst she does cc - it really should only take a few nights to do, although I'm not sure that cc would work if she's co-sleeping - they are a bit opposing! I'd be inclined to put him in a cot, give him a few days to get used to it, and then do cc. Surely the grandmother could catch up on sleep during the day if she's disturbed a bit at night?

I would stop the juice at night immediately! If your friend really wants to give him something, then water only. Hopefully he will then decide after a while that it's not worth waking up for.

Does he nap at nursery, and if so, for how long? As long as his naps there aren't excessive (or non-existent), then I doubt that there's much more that they could do.

Hi her mum has physical needs and the medication she takes affects her personality making it difficult for others. It's not her fault but it's hard work.

The mum has on call care ie if she falls over she presses the panic button she carries. Don't know about any other care she has.

So it seems controlled crying is the way to go - I reckon she'll need a week but just needs to negotiate how her own mum will deal with it.

Thats excellent. Thanks so much. She has email at work - I'll try it monday (she was off most of last week as ds had a horrible bug).

I might even try cc with my ds - he's due to go into a big bed within the next four months (he's young but very tall and has outgrown his cot) and I'm sure it will be fun and games.

Thanks again.

Can she contact SS and get some rest by care for her from her mum? even if it is just a weekend? I would have the first weekend to chill without the extra responsibility then I would tackle the son the 2nd weekend of restby care. SS are very good for this! Also is she getting a carers allowance? There are quite a few support groups available. Maybe her DS is also waking as she spends a lot of time caring for her mum iykwim? and he wants attention and the only way he knows how to get is....just a thought...

My mum used to do emergency restby care for children some where the parents had special needs or maybe one sick child and needed a break... it is worth looking into, she sounds like she needs some time for her as well.

Lyn

thanks so much for that. She's had ss assessment for her mum - help at home and I know that mum would sometimes get angry and get rid so friend would have to reapply over and over again.

I sent my pal and email today (with trepidation) with lots of ideas and a strict order for her to call me(!) and I'm looking into respite care for her mum just so she can get baby sleeping.

I've been so chuffed at the response - thanks so much _ I now feel like a mate who has some better advice.

No doubt I'll be posting asking for advice about my 18 month old who's developing tantrums - I'll see how I get on and post when all else fails. Thank god he's slept through the night since 8 weeks old - not my technique but sheer luck!!!! Phew!