Feel so conflicted - sleep train vs co-sleep and roll with it?

[Jr9901]

My daughter is 6.5 months old and has been waking between every 40 min - 2 hours since she was around 3.5 months old. There seems to be absolutely no sign of things improving...very occasionally she will do a 4 hour block at the start of the night but usually she first wakes after 2 hours.

My husband is self employer and doesn’t start his next project until September so for the last couple of weeks we’ve been alternating the night shifts as I was a total mess..previously doing all of them and exclusively breastfeeding. He now gives her formula on his night just so I don’t have to pump 24/7. This is helping but it means we spend zero time together and never sleep in the same room. We’ve barely had sex since we had her as we’re both so shattered and have no alone time together..fortunately we’re getting on great and both on the same page about that though.

Each to their own but I don’t think controlled crying or any kind of crying is for me so I’ve been trying more gentle sleep training methods..I no longer feed, rock or hold to sleep..I put her in her cot (still in our room) and she falls asleep herself but she can’t seem to continue doing this in the middle of the night. Usually around 3am I bring her into my bed because it’s easier than getting up constantly. She doesn’t sleep any better or worse in my bed but it’s easier for me at that point.

We have a trip to stay with the in-laws next week and I’m dreading it because we’re both barely functioning and it’s going to be so stressful being up all night in someone else’s house with paper thin walls, waking everyone up. They live far away though and haven’t really seen her since she was born so we have to go. I feel embarrassed and like we’re failing...I don’t know anyone else who has been through this at this stage..all my NCT group mums are sleeping pretty well etc (I know shouldn’t compare). I really miss the closeness and intimacy of sleeping in the same bed as my husband...I go to bed at 7pm when she goes to bed to try and get as much broken sleep as possible and because it seems pointless staying up when you’re constantly watching / waiting for her to wake up quickly after being put down.

Strangely she is an amazing daytime napper! She takes two 1.5 hour naps then one 45 min nap pretty consistently every day.

Sorry this has turned into a bit of a long rant! She is otherwise an extremely happy baby during the day..she herself doesn’t seem to be suffering from lack of sleep at least and she’s thriving weight wise etc on the 90th centile - she just wakes a lot!!

I feel so conflicted by all the information out there..I feel torn between doing some stricter sleep training vs is sleep training a load of bollocks and she just needs to get through this phase in her own time? If it’s the latter should I just co-sleep and feed to sleep to make my life significantly easier ..have people done this and had the sleep cycles lengthen naturally or will this delay her learning to settle? I’ve tried co-sleeping and feeding to sleep when she was younger and she still didn’t sleep for longer periods but I felt more rested myself as I could stay half asleep...I’m just worried doing this could make it harder to get her comfortable in her own bed and room.

Personally we rolled with it and I co-slept. I continued to put DS to bed in his cot but co-slept from first wake up. We tried night weaning at about 8m but it was worse (endless ssh pat). I think at that point we moved his cot into his own room, although still mostly co-slept. Things started improving slowly at around 9/10m and he was sleeping well by 12m (sleeping 11hrs at 13m in his cot). We repeated night weaning at about 11m, which led to some crying but whilst being comforted.

It's tough to know what to do. We tried being 'stricter' earlier on, but it was too tough, and much easier later. Do what works for you, but personally I hate the 'rod for your back' idea. I think you can work on sleep habits at any point, and sometimes it's easier when they are a bit older.

Great thanks for your reply, it’s good to hear things can start to improve with co-sleeping! I also hate the ‘rod for your own back’ mentality but most people in my family and friends groups with babies definitely take the stance...I get the impression friends think I’m being soft / bringing it on myself but that could be me being over tired and sensitive! When you tried night weaning again at 11m were you still co-sleeping after the first wake up or did you keep him in his own room while doing this?

I can't remember exact timings, but at around 10m we got to the point where he was sleeping most/all night in his cot. I would feed him and put him back in the cot, unless it was after 5/6am when I would occasionally co-sleep as he was hard to resettle then. Then when we tried night weaning, DH would go to him and resettle him with cuddles, patting etc. We tried twice before unsuccessfully and gave up for a while. It was a gradual process, in that for quite a while DH had been resettling if he woke before 10ish. We were also putting DS down awake at the start of the night by then. Tbh we didn't do things in a very textbook way, but muddled through. We successfully night weaned and then 3 weeks later ended up reintroducing one feed, which he dropped by himself again a few weeks later.

I did read about an alternative weaning method whilst co-sleeping e.g. starting with not letting them fall asleep feeding (possibly Jsy Gordon?) but I was far too exhausted for that!

People can be quite judgemental about sleep, and if they have a better sleeper, assume it is solely because of what they did, rather than recognising there is a large luck element too! DS is my second and DD was much better. (Not amazing, but often waking twice a night, compared to DS's 6-10 times). I was so irritated by a friend telling me they 'had done their research' which was why het child slept better!

Good luck deciding what to do, and fingers crossed it will improve sooner rather than later.

I rolled with it too with my DD. Co-sleeping, very half hearted nudges in the right direction. I don't give out sleep advice as a result because my approach was "this is a bit shit but I CBA to change it"😱.

What I did do was work on good habits for first sleep of the night- putting some sort of structure in place there, trying to get her used to falling asleep without me. That used to then buy me and DH 2-4 solid hours to hang out together and then be in bed by 10/10.30.

I used to catch up on sleep in the morning. DH would take baby from 5am or so and do breakfast feed while I had a rescue hour of sleep. Then he'd have another 20-30 mins snooze before shower and work. I used to then sleep with DD for the first nap of the day.

It worked for us.

I did also get very comfortable with lying about her sleep habits to all and sundry to avoid relentless advice I had no intention of heeding.

We do have a super king bed though so DH and I managed to spend most nights together even if there was a baby in there too- or at least we'd fall asleep together . The spare bed was for sneaky "together" time immediately after DD had gone to sleep because if we left it any later than that we were both too knackered!

It's crap but it really does get better even if you do take a more relaxed approach.

We did similar to Red with bedtime, so we had a bit of an evening together. Also it helped that DS was my second so people were less bothered about talking about sleep at length!

Looks like I'm in the minority - cosleeping meant i never got to sleep next to my husband, and didn't ever really get any good sleep. We did CC at 6 months, it took 3 days and she sleeps through the night unless she's teething. And she definitely still loves us and knows we're there for her!

Firstly, major sympathies because I have so been there. My first son was exactly like this and he didn't reliably sleep through until he was two We coped by co-sleeping mostly plus night weaning and sharing the wake-ups BUT I now have twins and I've done a heap of things differently with them that might help you.

First thing, what is your schedule? Your DD's naps sound top end of day sleep for her age. My twins are 7 months and we are just dropping third nap but before that they were awake 2 hours, 2 h 15 and 2h 30 before naps. Maxing out at 3-3.5 hrs sleep per day. Longest awake time before bed so they are tired.

Second thing, how is weaning going? I find a good dinner really helps get a stretch of sleep going at the start of the night. Protein and carbohydrates. My two ate several egg & cheese muffins, yoghurt and apple purée for their dinner tonight followed by a breastfeed. Breastfeeds happen before story and settling so they do not expect it before sleeping.

Thirdly, it's GREAT that she's going down by herself in the evening. Are you actually out of the room? Or at least not shushing/ patting her to sleep. Any sleep association which involves YOU being there will result in frequent wake-ups. What is your means of settling in the night? Since you mention your DH giving formula, I'm assuming you're doing at least one feed. Or is it multiple? You can create a reliance on bf to sleep. My two sleep fairly reliably 7-10pm and then I do a dreamfeed when I go to bed. This usually buys me until 2-3am before I need to feed again (one of them, the other sleeps through thank god). I will attempt multiple resettles before I will feed before 3am. Then not again till morning. This gets me a couple of decent stretches of sleep.

Fourthly, do you use white noise? A comforter? A dummy? All super helpful in getting her to sleep longer in her cot.

Are you consistent for naps as well and do the same as you do at night?

Sorry, lots of questions but these are all the areas I struggled with my eldest looking back. I fact, I was still rocking him to sleep at 6.5 months so you're way ahead of me already. If you're happy to co-sleep, fine, but it can be a long road and very tricky to wean a determined toddler out of sleeping in mummy and daddy's bed. Personally I would try what you can (short of crying it out, which I couldn't hack either) to improve cot sleeping first.

We did do some gentle sleep training with the twins aged 5 months once all the routine etc was sorted. Can share more info if you wish. Good luck!! 6 months is the WORST 😩 but it does get better.

I think that every person who co-sleeps must be on MN because truly I think I know 2 people IRL who actually happily cosleep. I know a few other people who tried it and realised very early on that it actually causes more issues than it solves.

I am firmly in the sleep training camp. DS was breastfed to sleep for the first 3 months and woke every 45 minutes ALL NIGHT EVERY NIGHT. By 3 months I was a shell of my self and honestly couldn't take it any longer. He was tired and miserable. DH & i were tired and miserable. We had no quality time together and we were at our wits end. We did very very gentle, no cry sleep solution by Lucy Wolfe (she says start at 6m but I was recommended by lots of friends, all of whom did it before 6m and it worked for them). Within a week he was sleeping from 7-11, had a dream feed and slept from 11:30-7:30. We weaned at 6m and he then slept 7-7 from 6.5 months. Every. Single. Night. So to those who say "some babies are just bad sleepers" - I absolutely beg to differ.

Sleep training doesnt mean crying. It doesn't mean leaving your child to scream for 2 hours non stop, and jt doesn't mean your child will never cry in the night if they need you. TRUST ME, if DS wakes in the night and needs me, he will let me know. What he doesnt do, is wake in the night and cry because he doesn't know how to get himself back off to sleep. What he does do, like every human alive, is wake in the night sometimes, however, ive given him the tools to happily drift back off to sleep without my input. Everyone in my house is happy, sleep training changed our lives.

We did both. Do-slept until 9 months and I was about to go crazy with the contrast night feeds and wake ups. I started a routine - a schedule for feeding, day naps and bedtime. It worked wonders. Once that was in place I did some gentle sleep training. It was amazing and I now have a fantastic sleeper who loves bedtime.

Fan of CC here, for both kids at 7months of age. We have a very small age gap so it was important to us that they and us sleep!

They now sleep 7-7 (ish) and if they do need us in the night they definitely let us know.

Good luck, do what's best for you and your family- everyone is different.

Just to say, we DID try gentle sleep training. We persevered but it didn't work. It just led to a baby crying for two hours in the middle of the night. I really wanted it to work, I really wanted some sleep! There were some challenges e.g. with a second baby there were school runs that couldn't be moved around a nap time, but it just wasn't for DS. I say well done to those who successfully sleep trained (by whatever method) and would encourage OP to give it a go if/when they are ready, but it's worth remembering it doesn't work for everyone. I have friends who sung the praises of CC but had to do it multiple times after each illness etc.

I agree with mrsmummy, I’d sleep train, mostly for her benefit.

I would (and did) cosleep. I also think she needs longer naps in the day. 1.5 hours at a time is not a lot.

We co slept and they quickly learned to latch on with me barely waking (I preferred to feed lying down anyway). I started them in their cots though, bit of private time!

I have never managed to train anyone to sleep, so the only thing I can say to cheer you up is that this stage doesn't last forever.

But your story rang a bell as I have a young colleague who was in the same situation with a small baby who never slept for longer than half an hour - not in the car, not in the pram, not at night. After several months, they discovered that he had something called internal reflux, I think, which meant his stomach was throwing back his milk, although he wasn't actually being sick. Within 24 hours it was sorted - I don't know how, but I think with medicine. It was a health visitor who spotted it and knew immediately what it was.