Sleep training not working - please help!

[therunawaytrain35]

I have six month old twins and started sleep training a couple of months ago. We originally did CIO and within a couple of nights my daughter was falling asleep calmly, usually within fifteen minutes, and sleeping through besides a dream feed. My son also sleeps through but he cries nearly every night before falling asleep and I'm not seeing any improvement nearly two months later.
I have tried different methods with him, sticking with each one for two or three weeks before concluding that it isn't working. These include cry it out, pick up put down and playing with his wake times to see if longer or shorter wake times would help him.
The weirdest thing is that he consistently goes down well for his naps and falls asleep within twenty minutes, usually calmly and occasionally a bit whiny. He also sometimes has an amazing night where he is super calm, sucks his thumb and falls asleep within minutes, but I can't see any pattern in the good nights at all.
He has a dummy but we have never replaced it and he falls asleep for naps either with or without it - the vast majority of the time it falls out within a couple of minutes of him going down and he is absolutely fine.
I am so desperate with how to help him fall asleep easily at night and I feel completely stuck. I don't know what I am missing or why he is so upset and I am so unhappy every night that he is upset. As I write he has been crying for 40 minutes 😢.
OH doesn't seem to care at all and is completely fed up with me wanting to discuss it. He wants me to shut the bedroom door, turn off the volume on the monitor and that's it.
Please be kind when you answer and remember that we are all just trying to do what's best for our children. If anyone thinks they can help me I would love to hear your advice.

I haven't been in this situation but if I was you I think I would stop the sleep training for your boy for a few weeks and get him to sleep yourself and then after a while get him drowsy with a cuddle or whatever works for him and then put him down very tired then redo the sleep training.
Hope it all goes well very soon

Honestly I think it's too young. We started with DC1 at 14 months and DC2 at 9 months. If you started a few months ago I think they're crying for a reason? I don't mean that in a shitty way just incase it comes across as so. I have been in your shoes but I do think it's too young for CIO.

I done little ones sleep program with my second and it was a godsend.

Just had another thought. Could he be teething? My LO started teething early and was always chewing hands etc. Maybe that's why he's more unsettled at night?

4 months was absolutely too young for CIO. I’d try again in 2 months or so, when he’s 8 months old or so.

And when I say try again, I mean with a much gentler form of sleep training.

Yeah agree with @RiverMeadow did it at 14 months with Dd and will do earlier with DC2 but not before six months. We roughly used Ferber chart and the book says not to try before 6 months.

I would take a break from it for a wee while and try again when a bit bigger. At that age I had to do a combination of co sleep albeit reluctantly and lots of resettles.

Yikes. You used CIO ona 4 month old???

You're going to get slated.

I also think it's too early for sleep training. They're still so little and need reassurance from you, to know that you're near. I left sleep training until DS was 14mo and in the meantime I accepted that he needed me and I'd be tired. It will pass, I know it doesn't feel like it when you're getting up god knows how many times a night but it does pass eventually.

It's not working. He literally just wants to be held. I know it's hard op but it doesnt last forever. Just pick him up! Babies are wired to be with their mums 24/7 to feel safe. It's normal!!

I'm not going to be kind because anyone else reading this who thinks that ignoring a crying baby at 4 months old is in any way acceptable needs to hear that it isn't. As others have said he has no idea if he's safe or if you are ever coming back at all at that age, just think of what you are doing.

It's totally normal for babies to wake multiple times at night in the first year.

@MyDarlingWhatIfYouFly

I'm not going to be kind because anyone else reading this who thinks that ignoring a crying baby at 4 months old is in any way acceptable needs to hear that it isn't. As others have said he has no idea if he's safe or if you are ever coming back at all at that age, just think of what you are doing.

It's totally normal for babies to wake multiple times at night in the first year.

👍

No offence op but you have had two babies. I get that it's hard but why people feel the need to have babies they can play with and enjoy all day and then ignore them and keep them in the dark at night is beyond me. They're babies and this is what they do. They're not playthings and I wish more people realised this.

You need to stop expecting them to sleep like adults. Who, btw, can get up and sort themselves out for any issues they have. Your babies can't.

Twins must be really hard, I can’t even imagine. But they’re miles too young for sleep training. The idea of a 6 month old baby crying for 40 minutes makes me feel sick. I would scrap it completely and try again around 8-9 months with a much gentler approach. Good luck

Also I would be happy that he’s sleeping through once he finally goes down! My 18 month old often takes an hour to get down then wakes multiply times a night!!

I can only echo what others are saying. Far too young for any kind of sleep training. Your babies should be with you, and not in their own in bedroom for safe sleep.

Please go and pick your crying baby up, and leave sleep training until 11 months plus.

OP, I really feel for you. I found it tough with one non-sleeper, so having the stress of him waking up your other baby must make it much more tense! A friend of mine has twins and had great success with Gina Ford, might be worth a little read? I know it’s cliche, but this won’t last forever and although it feels really difficult right now you can handle it.

Twins must be horrendous, but this is way too early for sleep training. Under a year old is prime attachment formation time; if they don’t know that you’ll respond to their needs they’ll become even less independent.

Honestly, I have very much the opposite of a ‘attachment‘ parenting style, but I would never try anything this before 12 months.

And yes, I have experienced a non-sleeper.

Please follow the wonderful advice you've been giving and stop letting a four month old CIO. I don't know what country you're in but in the U.K. it's recommended they don't sleep alone till 6 months plus let alone leaving them to cry it out.

Agree they are too young for CIO. What are you trying to achieve with sleep training? Falling asleep independently or less night wakings or both?

I used a modified PUPD quite young (def less than 6mo) to encourage DS to fall asleep without being held but we sat on our bed next to his bedside crib until he no longer needed PUPD then did some controlled crying after he moved in to his own room at 6/7months. This only helped him fall asleep independently, I believe we responded to his needs in a controlled way that made him still feel secure but he learnt a new skill.

For night wakings, there is a need that you need to fulfill. It might be hunger, it might not. I night weaned DS around 8months but I cuddled / rocked / soothed back to sleep during night waking to compensate for lack of milk. This was after he had slept through several times on his own and was eating well in the day. This only took 3 or 4 nights and he was sleeping through, and by that I mean 7pm ish to 5am ish.

This worked for me, I'm not saying it will for you but I, like a PP, am the least attachment parent out there but they are way too young for CIO.

Please go and give your baby a cuddle. 40 minutes crying? This breaks my heart. My LG is just 8 months. She was going down for bed (had been for just 3 weeks) until she was unwell a couple of weeks ago and now she won't again. So I just bring her downstairs. She will get it when she's ready and I'm not going to stress about it. I want her to know I am here if she needs me and feel secure so I respond to her straight away if she cries

OP I understand why you need to get a routine with twins it’s very hard. I’m not sure if you’re in the UK but the culture there is very different. In France we expect babies to sleep through early and encourage and work towards this- by 6 months we would expect sleeping through. I don’t feel it’s helpful for babies to be waking up multiple times until a year old + - for the parent and also the sleep is so important for brain development etc. If he sleeps through I’d be prepared for the some level of cuddling/soothing to sleep in the evening.

I'm sure you are trying your best and want what best for your baby, but you cant let your son cry himself to sleep. He is so little and he needs you so please go to him and stop trying to get him to sleep through in this way. I've got 3 children with a 13 year age gap between 2 & 3. I was lucky that DC1 & DC2 (12 month gap) naturally went to sleep from 12 & 16 weeks by themselves. DC3 is a different child altogether and didn't consistently sleep through until nearly 2. It was difficult at times but we did what he needed us to do and comforted him until he slept. He slept through when he was ready too and we dont regret it as he is a happy boy with secure attachments. They are only little for such a short time so please dont leave him upset at his age, he is such a small baby. Maybe trying sleep training when he is a bit older. Good luck.

I don’t feel it’s helpful for babies to be waking up multiple times until a year old + - for the parent and also the sleep is so important for brain development etc.

I don’t feel it’s helpful for babies to cry alone in the dark because they need human contact, a feed, a soothing voice, a rub on the back, reassurance their mum/parent, who is their entire world and the only thing they rely on to be ignored. We know more about how healthy attachment is formed all the time now and it’s obvious to anyone who’s met a screaming distressed baby that the natural human urge is to comfort them. Good attachment is good for brain development.

Parenting doesn’t stop because it’s night time or you’ve decided it’s bed time. I’m amazed that French babies are unique, who knew?! Is this the same France where women continue to smoke and drink while pregnant? And where breastfeeding rates are low because boobs are for husbands not babies? Not much to brag about culture-wise.

Cuddle your tiny tiny baby to sleep! That’s my advice.

I’m never sure if this posts are really anymore. Just give them a cuddle. The fact their sleeping through is amazing