11 week old advice needed

[whatty]

Our baby is 11 weeks, and being very tricky at night. We are not following a routine yet, but he appears happy during the day, and mostly feeds, has a kick around/ his awake time, then a sleep which varies in length and could be in his crib, the car seat, buggy or sling. His feeds (breast fed) during the day are roughly 3 hours apart- but could be a little longer on occasion when he sleeps longer.
In the evenings, I feed him before and after his bath so he is, in theory, really full, but he just will not settle in his crib or cot. We try for up to 45 mins- which involves picking him up when he cries, shushing and patting his bottom until he is asleep, putting on white noise and putting him down again. We then give up, bring him downstairs, and he is awake/ feeding downstairs for the next few hours.
My husband then gives his a bottle between 9&10 so I can sleep for a few hours, and he then brings him up round midnight/1am, when I feed him again. From then on- he feeds possibly every 2 hours- but this could be more often. When he wakes, I try and give him the dummy or wind him rather than immediately feeding, but this doesn't work, and I end up feeding him again. I am trying to ensure I sit up to feed, so he isn't snacking whilst we both lie down and he feeds.
Can anyone help me see what I am doing wrong? I have a few friends with similar aged babies who are also breast feeding, and all of them seem to be getting longer stretches during the night- especially that first bit of the evening. I am a bit broken to be honest- and have two older children who I am struggling to spend time with/ do reading etc because I can't settle him in the evenings, and I am also feeling completely wrecked from the broken nights.
Apologies for the essay- any help gratefully received!

Solidarity, I have an 11 week old too and whilst we're not totally cracking it. I've been reading a lot of advice and tips and some things are slowly getting better for us.

We are feeding more frequently and bigger feeds during the day. I'm making sure DD properly wakes up for her daytime feeds and takes a decent feed. We've settled into a bit of a cycle in the day of feed, play, sleep, nappy. Depending on where she sleeps the sleep part can be anything between 30 mins and 3 hours. I'm trying to make sure the first nap or two are in her crib/Moses basket so they're generally shorter so she has feeds closer together. I also change nappy, undress her even lay her down before the feed to make sure she's properly awake and takes a big feed.

Next I try to make sure she's stimulated for her daytime awake time. Hard going with a tiny baby! Easier when it coincides with my little boy's swimming lesson or going to the super market! But when we're at home we look at lights and windows. More interesting than toys apparently. Hold her facing outwards while I potter around the house.

Afternoon naps are always in the sling. She's getting more fussy by this point and won't settle anywhere else.

Controversially we're not doing a bedtime routine with her yet. The evenings aren't too bad for us and I feel like it will take up some of the precious time I get with my 5 year old DS. DD generally feeds 6ish while we're eating tea. Once she finishes her awake time DH has her in the sling while I get to spend time with DS doing his night routine from about 7. I get him into bed then me into bed and give DD a last evening feed about 8. DH then has her again while I sleep. He gives her a bottle of formula at 10 or 11, let's her fall asleep on him (with white noise on) and when she's properly asleep transfers her to the crib next to me (bringing the white noise, we leave it on all night). 5 days out of 7 we'll be lucky and she'll stay asleep until 1,2 or even 3. Then I'm well rested enough to wake up when she wakes and make sure she has a proper feed. Usually switching breasts when she gets sleepy is enough, but I even wind or change her nappy if I feel like she's not taken a decent feed. Lights always low though and no taking. Then let her fall asleep and transfer back to crib. I usually get 2-3 hours from that. And repeat. And then it's morning and time to get up.

Sorry, that got epic and I don't know if it's of any use, but mostly seems to be working for us.

No answers but I wanted to say you are not doing anything wrong. This is babies unfortunately, it's what they do. There are things we can try to improve things but you are not doing anything wrong. Please dont blame yourself. I've been there and its awful

Thanks both- your responses are super helpful 👍

Hope you managed a bit more sleep after posting. Feel like I've been up most of the night with ds who is 5 weeks so I feel your pain.

From what you write your baby takes more of his calories in the evening and through the night than the day time. He is having more of his sleep through the day. You can gradually switch this around by waking him and feeding him more often in the day. This should make him more tired and less hungry over night. Does he sleep in his cot for day time naps? Try letting him fall asleep in his cot when he is sleepy but awake during the day time, so he gets into the habit of self soothing in it.

A tip that helped me to reframe this tricky time was to not worry about ‘nights’ and just go with the baby’s natural rhythm. You can impose a routine at any point down the line

My baby is exactly the same! 19 weeks. He definitely has a super long feed around 8pm before bedtime, we only started bedtime routine at about 14 weeks. Mine cluster fed all evening until then, sounds like yours is doing that now? Mine wakes every 2 hours for feed and I believe he is genuinely hungry as tummy rumbling and he feeds well. I think what you describe sounds totally normal albeit hard! I can’t be bothered with trying to get him in crib though, too much faff and the stress of it wakes me up! Can you bedshare? We do except mine has reflux so a lot of feeds I have to sit in a chair and hold upright (often for many hours each night) but that’s another story!!!

It may not be any consolation at all, but this is completely normal. Babies aren't designed to sleep for very long periods of time as they need to feed and are programmed to feed more at night than during the day. Some babies sleep for longer stints at night but that is really not the norm - you just hear about them more because their parents are so grateful for the sleep!

Thanks for these helpful replies- you've all made me feel lots better about our situation. Will try and relax about things- and not listen to those who have these miracle sleeping babies. An additional reason (I keep telling myself) is that he is still small (only 4.5kgs and 2.4kgs at birth...)