Feeling like a failure. Can’t confess toddlers routine in RL!

[crazychemist]

I’d love some suggestions/handholding. My DD’s sleep is a train wreck....

I nurse her to sleep. There were medical reasons for keeping up breastfeeding as long as possible, but these are now past and I’d like to break the habit. She doesn’t nurse all the way to sleep and usually wiggles out of my lap and snuggles down onto her tummy to go to sleep once she is drowsy, but I feel like i have to nurse her to stop her going bonkers and getting overtired. I sort of have a plan (nursing her in a chair instead of bed, trying to rock her to sleep etc, and then follow this plan www.ahaparenting.com/Ages-stages/toddlers/helping-your-toddler-learn-to-put-himself-to-sleep). I’m terrified of starting though, I’m so tired and worn out I don’t feel like I’ve got the energy for the initial worse nights that I’m anticipating. At least when I’m spending an hour trying to feed her to sleep I’m sitting down in a dark quiet room!

Her routine is an absolute disaster. She’s in the process of dropping the nap, but I just can’t get it right! A couple of days ago she didn’t want her nap, but fell asleep at 6.30 (I was aiming for a 7pm bedtime). But then she was up again and wide awake at 9.30. Whatever I do, she’s not properly off until 2am!!!!!

I’ve had advice like “just stick to a 7-7 routine”. It’s not bad advice, but I just don’t get how to implement it. If she’s not been asleep till 2am, there’s no way she can go without a nap if I get her up at 7am. But if she has a nap (even a really short one, nap shortening didn’t work for us at all) then she’s up till 2am again and the cycle continues.....

Help! Should I work on the getting to sleep independently or the routine first? And how do I find the strength to get started? Feeling like a completely crap mum, and I have no energy to be a better one.

My kid has always been early to bed so cant advise on your little night owl but I did have a boob lover so can tell you what worked with us for weaning. I had a night away from him, we were busy the whole day and he slept at grandmas and didnt pick him up until evening. He went down with a cup of milk and then woke 4 times that night. I offered water and a cuddle each time and he did fall back to sleep. It was more difficult in that my body was desperate to feed him more than he actually wanted it! After this he started sleeping through.

Then about a few months later I was getting a bit fed up of lying with him for an hour before getting to sleep. The process was taking so long and he wriggled about the whole time so my husband (who was putting him to bed that night) just put him in the room and said good night and closed the door. We couldn't believe it that he fell asleep, he had been such a clingy needy baby that we didnt realise that he was ready to start settling himself. Since then he goes down in 5 minutes, there have been no tears about the process. It's probably nearly a year since then and obviously there are some nights he shouts for attention (which we do go in and give him a cuddle) but generally he goes to bed very easily.

You don't say how old she is. If nursing is what helps calm her down at bedtime, why do you want to stop it? You can do it as long as it works, just for bedtime. No rules to say you can't!
My advice is to keep offering nursing, but start introducing stories, as this was what helped both mine fall asleep in a way that wasn't on the boob or being carried in a sling.
My youngest is now 3 and probably 50% of the time still falls asleep nursing but I'm happy as it's incredibly reliable! We have never had bedtime tears or tantrums. The other half of the time it's reading or just snuggling and sucking her thumb. Stories also mean that she has happily gone to sleep with DH at bedtime for a long time now.

DD will be 3 in September. I don’t mind continuing nursing (to be honest, I really wouldn’t mind stopping, but I want to take things slowly as it’s a great source of comfort to her and it’ll take her time to learn to be comforted in other ways). BUT she’s been waking a lot at night and latches on to settle back to sleep. It’s purely for comfort, she doesn’t need a feed during the night, she just latches back on for a minute or two and then nods off. I’d like to get her self settling sometimes so that she can be out to bed by someone without boobs! And also hopefully not need me so much at night.

I was also happy to continue when it meant a nice calm bedtime. But sometimes now it is actually annoying her and stopping her sleeping because she sleeps more comfortably on her tummy rather than being held as she’s too big to be comfy on my lap. How did you introduce stories? I’ve tried that, but no luck so far, DD starts crying and pulling at my pjs when she is getting really tired as she knows that’s how she goes to sleep.....

@InFrance2014 I’d love to think I could do that with DD. She’s never had anyone but me for bedtime and I’m just not confident with trying that. I bet she’d go to sleep for my mum eventually, but I don’t want to ask that favour as it’d probably be really hard on my mum

First of all the routine doesn't sound that bad at all!! The bits you are happy with, even if not what the books say, are fine. You don't need to change them.

With my dc I fed them till very drowsy then unlatched and read to them as they dozed off. Sometimes it worked. Sometimes they woke up very angry!! But in time they got used to it.

Routines chop and change anyway, honestly with the nap dropping it is always a rough month or two when they don't always need it. Give it time and it will sort itself out.

@badg3r, I might try your suggestion as a first step. I think DD will be quite angry, but I guess I’ve got to start somewhere! I did try to get some story books about giving up night nursing, but she got angry when I tried to read it to her and shut the book.

I think when you say the routine is fine you missed the part where I said she goes to sleep between 1 & 2am! . That’s kind of hard to deal with when my alarm goes off before 6 on working days.... it’s not great for her either I’m sure.

I think the nap transition is causing a lot of the issues, but I had no idea it could get this bad! I’ve never heard of a toddler being up so late. I darent tell people because I know I’d face a lot of judgement for not being able to get her to sleep earlier. She CAN’T be getting enough sleep!

It sounds like she needs to lose the nap completely. My DC (just 3) has just dropped the nap completely and is totally exhausted in the evenings so sleeps fine again now. Before we stopped the nap there was playing up at bedtime, getting out of bed at night and waking early.

I’d wake her at 7am whatever time she goes to sleep, keep her up for the morning and give an early lunch and then a 30m nap from about 1230. That should get her through the day bearing in mind the 2am sleep time. She will be knackered by early evening but keep her up till about 1830.

Once she has done this for a few days (or until the 2am sleep time has stopped), you should be able to phase out the nap completely.

At nearly 3 she is probably old enough to understand that she is tired because she isn’t sleeping enough at night. And that you’re keeping her up so that she sleeps better. I’d explain this to her. (I explained it to my DC. I also said that the situation was self-created because DC hadn’t been sleeping when DC should have been. In other words I wasn’t particularly sympathetic to comments about being tired during the day.)

@crazychemist you need to stop the BF or she will be constantly looking for the comfort from you at bed time! My DD is also 3 in September, she still had a dummy till very recently and would scream if I tried to put her to bed without it but when I started to notice her teeth changing I just said enough was enough and let her cry, it lasted 2 nights and not been mentioned since.

But then she started wanting me in bed with her to fall asleep I made the mistake of doing it so that was another thing I have now had to stop doing! Don't get me wrong she is still a bad sleeper 10.30 pm-7/8AM but she falls asleep without me or her dummy now because I just shut the gate and let her cry checked on her now and then & tucked her in gave her a kiss etc and walked out again! She got used to it after a few nights.

If you don't break the cycle now she will be looking for some form of comfort in 2-3 years time still, 3 is more than old enough to learn she needs to fall asleep on her own as hard as it is for mum xx

To reassure you, I have heard if toddlers bring up that late! (Not my own thank goodness, you have my sympathies). Advice about explaining why she needs to stay up/sleep at certain times is good I think, she is old enough now. Any chance you could get the 6.30 nap to be bedtime? If she is really struggling to stay up then maybe early dinner and pjs by 6.15 is the way forward. If she is so exhausted by then she might even be easier to settle without feeding.

Thanks for the advice, all.

I'm working on night weaning. Not going perfectly, but we're making some progress. Last night she went to sleep semi-independently. I lay down with her and she asked me to sing to her for a while, but she was still awake when I stopped singing and just wriggled around for a bit then fell asleep. She didn't ask for a feed during the night either, she woke once to use the potty and I just rocked her back to sleep as she was too grumpy to just lie down and doze off (she hates having to get up for a wee). It's gone very much better than I thought it would - for anyone else that is not sure about how to nightwean we read "Sally weans from Night Nursing" and had a talk about it, and DD pushed the book away aand wouldn't listen the first time, but the second time we tried it she was OK about it and was ok not to nurse to sleep (which honestly I was starting to think she'd never ever ever stop!)

The nap issue is unfortunately still ongoing. If she naps, bedtime is after midnight. If she doesn't, bedtime is between 7&8, but then she is overtired, has to be fed to sleep and wakes a lot. So a partial success, but not there yet. I did try cutting the nap all together, but by the 3rd day she was in pieces. So not ready for that yet.

Thank you to all of you for your advice, it has really helped. I was feeling like I was a complete failure for getting into this situation, but it sounds like dropping the last nap is always tricky. Hopefully she'll be past it before she starts preschool in September.

I introduced a story, a song to msle a routinr and then it was milk in a sippy cup (well dh did, I went out so she had no choice). I assumed she would go crazy, but didn't seem to even notice!