early mornings ... yawn ... zzz ...

[prefernot]

Dd has recently started waking at 6.15am instead of 7.15am. She's done this now and then in the past but now it's been going on for about 2 weeks. Do you think it's a permanent change or can I fool myself it's a 'phase'? She's 23 months by the way and goes to bed at 7.30pm and sleeps 1 / 1/5 hours in the afternoon from 12.30pm.

I'm totally exhausted.

i don't know if this will work for you but whenever my dd (2.10) wakes earlier than desired, we treat it as a nighttime waking... tiptoe in, whisper, 'it's still night, go back to sleep', maybe offer some water, and then back out again quietly. it worked for us: she might sing for a bit or chat to animals, but she doesn't really object and usually goes back to sleep. if you get them up at this point, then i think the battle is lost: they think they set the timetable, rather than you.

DS3 aged 18 months is doing the same, only worse, waking between 5:30 and 6:00. Goes to bed same time as yours (or slightly later) and has similar length nap. It's a nightmare isn't it?
As he No. 4 (and last) for me, I am just going with the flow. I try to be asleep between 10 and 10:30 and just accept I will start the day early. Actually, he will lie in bed with us for a while so it is not as if I am up at 5:30.
I expect it is a phase with your dd but couldn't say what will break it. If you discover the secret, let me know.

bakedpotato (you are my favourite food. I might eat you) I've tried that occasionally but she clearly feels deeply cheated. I'll give it another go though.

Lonelymum, I do something similar with dd. I go to her room with some milk and get her to lie with me on the fold-out bed while she drinks it and at least that way I get a moment or two's peace to properly wake up. Occasionally she dozes a bit but mostly she 'plays' at going to sleep, doing very comic 'yawns' etc.

It IS a nightmare. It's inhuman to be up at that time.

How I would love DS to wake up as late as 6.15am every day! Sorry, not much help to you.

your dd may well feel deeply cheated at first -- but hey, you're being cheated too, of much needed zzzzes. i urge you: stick to guns! however, i guess if she's having milk and stuff, it's going to be a bit grim to knock it on the head... cc etc. how strong are you feeling? how much do you want an extra hour in bed?

don't feel tasty in the slightest, but glad i've given you some supper ideas at least.

oh, and as it gets light later and clocks go back, the darker mornings might keep her quiet in bed. (how light does it get in her room? might this be a factor?)

don't want to sound doomy, but just thought, if you're giving her milk, there's a danger she's starting to wake up NEEDING it? and then the early start will be really established.

bakedpotato, thanks for the reply. I don't think she's got a milk 'habit' in the mornings as this has been a very recent thing, the last 2 weeks or so. Prior to that she was waking at 7.15 which was blissful. I wouldn't choose to do cc just for the mornings I don't think. If it was all her sleep that was being affected I'd do it (had to do it at 15 months and it worked but I didn't like the process much at all). I would accept (with a big sigh) that she no longer needs as long a sleep as she did but she's clearly very tired as today she just fell asleep at 9.30am for an hour which she hasn't done in over a year now. And she still wanted an afternoon nap. This last couple of weeks when she's been up earlier she's seemed to me to be constantly lethargic and tired. I'll be interested to see how she sleeps tonight as she was much better rested today.

I ate you for tea tonight. Sorry.

Oh, by the way, her room's very dark. We've got blackout curtains which only let in a tiny bit of light in the morning.

This morning she woke at 4.50am!!! So I went in with a drink of water, spoke v. briefly to her and she went back to sleep until 6.30am. I was tempted to try the same thing at 6.30 but she was much too awake at that time for it to work.

Hi prefernot - good to meet you today. With dd, I always have left a cup/bottle of water at the foot of her bed where she could reach it if she was thirsty. Obviously, the water needs to be in something that won't leak all over the bed if she accidentally kicks it over. I always check/refill the cup before I go to bed at night. I also kept a few books/soft toys at the foot of her bed so she could entertain herself on her own for awhile if she woke too early.

When dd has gone through those early morning phases, I simply go into her room (to acknowledge her calls), quietly tell her it's too early and she needs to sleep some more, rearrange her blanket, tell her goodnight, and leave immediately. She cries for a bit, but soon settles - whether it's to sleep again, or to play with the things in her bed. I won't get her up before 6.30....by the way this is virtually impossible to enforce now that she's in her big girl bed and can get out by herself! I know those early morning "wake up calls" are exhausting, and a crying child is not a nice way to start the day. Good luck.

Thanks earlybird, lovely to meet you and your lovely dd today too.

I think I can sort of get away with telling her to go back to sleep pre-6am but later than that and she's just way too awake. She will chat and play briefly in her cot but I don't leave that many things in there as if I do she chucks them all out before she'll go to sleep!

sounds like we're all fighting to have the worst sleeper doesnt it!ha ha
my dd is a nightmare sleeper and i cant remember the last time she woke me up at 6.30 and shee was in her own room! i end up in the spare bed with her anytime from around 2am!i try to settle her and put her back to bed but this can be done numerous times and half the time i give in, get into spare bed with her and settle for a 1/2 sleep full of kicks and moans.
but i can sympathise as i vaguely remember non parent sleep and know how hard the mornings are, especially when we're up before the sun.
hope it is just a phase for you and things settle down soon..me ill be enjoying the dreaded controlled crying after our hol!!

So, this morning she woke at 6am and I gave a drink of water and told to go back to sleep. She stood calling me til 6.30 when I went in with her milk, lay on the bed with her and she went back to sleep til 8am!!! Can't remember the last time I wasn't up before 7.00am. I feel like a totally different human being today after such a good sleep.

Glad you got a better result with the lack of sleep. Thought of you when dd arrived in my room at 4am this morning asking asking if I would turn on the telly! Finally got her to sleep again around 5. Luckily, we can have a lazy/tired day today as there are no firm plans. Let you in on a little secret - neither of us is dressed yet!

Hi Prefernot. Glad you had a beter time this morning. I hate to sound hard after admitting I am going through the same thing, but on reflection, if your dd is waking up and then going back to sleep after you have gone in to her and maybe given her some milk etc, it seems to me that she is getting into a bad habit. My ds practically never goes back to sleep so I know that his 6 am wake-ups are for real and I just have to resign myself to them. Your dd seems to need more sleep - afterall, until lately she was sleeping until 7:15 - not likely to suddenly need less sleep. I think you should try not to give her anything in case it becomes a habit you can't break. I am beginning to think bakedpotato's idea of going in to her and telling her now is not the time to get up yet is a better option. She will cry a bit to begin with but she will learn to settle again (especially when it is darker in the mornings as it soon will be) or she may learn to entertain herself in her cot which would be a brilliant thing for her to do as you will want her doing that when she is older anyway. Is it not worth a try anyway?

Lonelymum, I've tried just going in to her and telling her to go back to sleep for ages, I only resorted to lying in the bed with her so that I could have an extra half an hour to wake myself up in the morning! She never cries when I go in to tell her to go back to sleep, she just stands up and calls for me and tells me it's morning and to get up etc. I really don't think she will go back to sleep unless it's before 5.30amish as she seems too awake at any later hour. Today was a fluke, she never usually goes to sleep with me on the bed, she usually lies down quietly while she drinks her milk then plays at going to sleep and eventually just gets up.

Oh, Earlybird, 4am!! What a nightmare. At least she went back to sleep again. Don't blame you for not getting dressed til mid-afternoon. It sounds rather cosy to me.

prefernot, oh good, you sound like you've worked out she really does need more sleep -- so the battle is halfwon really.

as for the milk thing -- if it's not a habit yet, it might turn into one quite soon. could you perhaps try giving her a smaller amount every time, cutting an ounce or two ounces, so in the end she's not really getting enough to wake up for? that might be easier than coldturkeying?

i'm glad you're feeling better on more sleep. here's hoping you get lots more soon.

Well, Bakedpotato, I don't think she wakes up FOR milk so much as because she's sort of mostly awake. I don't know how many ounces she drinks because she's been on a cup of full fat milk for months now but I guess out of the bottle she only drinks about 2 or so then asks me to put the bottle away. then she lies with me and dozes a bit or plays around and occasionally like today goes back to sleep.

prefernot, what happened this morning?

i've been puzzling over this. if you think that she wakes regardless of milk, why not hold it back until breakfast time? ie, even if she's not having much, by giving her it you're still giving her permission to start the day earlier than you'd like it to, whether she goes back to sleep or not afterwards. it's a bit of a signal, no?

from what you've said, you've got lots of factors in your favour ie, you don't believe she's waking for milk, and you do seem reasonably confident that she needs sleep than she has been getting recently, because of going back to sleep/needing to nap earlier so it does sound to me like she's just got into a pattern. well, it doesn't have to be permanent.

i think you have to decide what is acceptable, let her know, and stick to it.

but if you don't believe in your heart that she will be able to go back to sleep, then i guess that's an end to it -- your day is going to start earlier from now on.

Funnily enough, bakedpotato, I didn't give her any milk this morning, but I did lay on the bed with her as she woke at 5.30am and wasn't going back to sleep on her own. She went instantly to sleep when we lay down together, until 7.30am! Weird, isn't it?

Hello prefernot it was lovely to meet you on Saturday - and you too earlybird if you're still across this thread. Our dd usually manages to sleep until 0630 but this morning she was wanting to get up at 6. I crept in and told her it was too early and that everyone else she knew was still sleeping (named a few of them). She kind of accepts this and will try to sleep again for a little while or will chat to her animals for a bit. Either way we are trying so hard not to get her up before 0630. It's hard isn't it

Hi welshmum - great to meet you too. Sorry we didn't get to speak more, but there will be another time.

DD slept until 7 this morning, but I think it was a combination of factors - no nap yesterday, and a dark, gloomy morning. I've just had the Great Little Trading Company catalogue through the post this morning, and it has one of those bunny alarm clocks in it. Bunny's eyes stay closed, and ears down until it's time to wake up, and eyes open/ears go up when it's time to wake. Audible alarm is optional and can be switched off. I've heard other mums talk about it being a good technique for little ones who can't yet tell time, but need to understand when it's too early to awake.

We've got one of those but there's one thing I've never understood...if you've got blackout how can the poor things tell if the bunny's ears are up or down? I may be missing something here.
We're ended up using it for when she comes into our room instead.

Hello Welshmum and Earlybird (I have faces to go with your words, how exciting!).

I've wondered that too Welshmum re. the dark rooms and clocks. Dd sleeps in an almost entirely dark room, doesn't like it any other way, I once tried a night light and she called me to turn it off saying 'too light, mummy, can't sleep' .

I'm in two minds about what to do really. On one hand if it means she (and I) get another hours sleep (which we both desperately need) then I don't see the harm in lying down with her although I know 'on paper' it's not what you're supposed to do. I really have tried many times to do the going in and encouraging her to go back to sleep on her own but it's never worked unless it's well before 5am.

I guess I'll just stick with what I'm doing for now and see what happens.

Oh, and earlybird, do you remember me telling you she'd refused to sleep in her cot in the day? Today she's gone to sleep there like a dream and is having a thoroughly good nap as I write. It's the first time she's done this in over 2 weeks now. I hope it signals a change for the better. How are you coping with no naps for your dd? Are you sticking to a v. early bedtime? Still having tears at bedtime?

Love to you both and hope to see you again soon xxx

My dd was another one who liked to wake up at ungodly hours of the morning - she did get a bit better once she gave up her daytime sleep - a couple of months ago. At first I really missed the hour in the middle of the day to read the paper etc but now I'm glad of a (slightly) later start to the day.
Prefernot and Earlybird - would you like to meet up again? seeing as we all have dds they might like to play together? (excuse for us to chat....)