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Sleep

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Original poster

Is CC when they are in bed with you as bad as if they're in a cot?

21 replies

blob2be · 29/05/2007 09:52

I posted yesterday saying that I would never do CC.....but after reading some messages in reply to my post by MNers who have had success with CC (even though it clearly hasn't worked for everybody), and after a particularly bad night, I've suddenly changed my mind! But I think I will fail if I leave him to cry in his cot. I've tried it before and have cracked very early on in proceedings. So I thought that, as he co-sleeps for most of the time anyway, I would leave him to cry when he wakes up next to me wanting to suck my boob back to sleep. If I'm there, right next to him, then he will of course get angry that I'm not giving him what he wants - but surely he won't feel abandoned? I'll be there cuddling him after all. I just cannot keep feeding him every hour every night. I feel bad for him that he can't self-settle. Any thoughts on this idea would be much appreciated. If people think it could work I would start it tonight.

OP posts:

purplemonkeydishwasherwhatwhat · 29/05/2007 09:54

i wouldn't class that as CC since you are there with him cuddling him.
I say this to make myself feel better. we did that. after the feeding all night got too much. it does work. and they do cry. A LOT. but you are there so some how it's not so bad.
how old is your LO?

Original poster

blob2be · 29/05/2007 10:04

He's 7.5 months Purple Monkey. Interesting to hear that that's how you did it - how long did it take you before your LO stopped crying? how many nights and how long each night? did they start sleeping through? Just a few hours continuous sleep would do me - sleeping through just seems impossible!

OP posts:

purplemonkeydishwasherwhatwhat · 29/05/2007 10:07

well, mine was 19mo when we did it. the first night he cried for an hour on and off. but it got less and less.
eventually he did sleep better. but when he wakes up and cries and won't go back down we know tht he is thirsty and he gets a feed.
it's hard though. and we constatntly have setbacks.

goingfor3 · 29/05/2007 10:08

That's not controled crying. He will get used to not having your boob, you just need to be consistant because if you give in to one night feed ytou will be back to square one. The problem I found when I treid this was that DD would latch on wothout me realising as I was to tired to notice!

lilysma · 29/05/2007 10:34

I was pretty much in your shoes and did this, more or less for a month or so, but although she did settle with cuddles in bed, she didn't stop waking up and in the end I couldn't cope with that either, so I did cc. Hasn't stopped her waking up yet, either though ! But every baby is different and I'm sure i've read messages on MN previously that have said the LO stopped waking at all when cuddled instead of fed for a few weeks, so it's worth a try. My dd (6 months) only cried for 5 mins or so with the cuddles, but she kept doing that really. Good luck!

FrannyandZooey · 29/05/2007 10:39

Yes I think there is a big difference between leaving a child in a room on their own, and having you there cuddling him. He may still feel frightened and sad, at not being able to have his milk, but feeling frightened and sad with your mother cuddling you, is an entirely different proposition to feeling frightened and sad on your own.

You might like to try the No Cry Sleep Solution, as well?

purplemonkeydishwasherwhatwhat · 29/05/2007 10:42

franny - did your DS still feed at night while you co-slept?

FrannyandZooey · 29/05/2007 10:46

Oh indeed yes he did

I tried to change things a couple of times but he was just not ready. The prospect of not having milk when he wanted it was not just upsetting to him, it was really deeply frightening, and it was easier and kinder just to wait for him to grow out of the need for it.

purplemonkeydishwasherwhatwhat · 29/05/2007 10:48

i'm afraid to ask this...
til he was how old??

MissGolightly · 29/05/2007 10:49

My god if you can do that you are a stronger woman than me!

Out of interest, if your DS is still co-sleeping how will you prevent him from feeding? I don't co-sleep full-time but when DS is in our bed he just climbs over me and helps himself!

MissGolightly · 29/05/2007 10:50

oh, just seen he is only 7.5 months. IMO that is still quite young - he may need the nourishment...? DS started sleeping through of his own accord at 11 months.

purplemonkeydishwasherwhatwhat · 29/05/2007 10:53

i have to wear a long nightgown (so he can't lift it up) and a jumper that zips up to the neck (so he can't pull it down)...DH makes fun of me. he always asks where my parka is!

FrannyandZooey · 29/05/2007 10:55

PMDW he was 3 years old before he moved to his own bed and at that point he only occasionally woke up for milk.

He's 4 now and he self-weaned all by himself a few months ago

FrannyandZooey · 29/05/2007 10:59

MissG is right 7.5 months is quite young....for some reason I thought he was older

IMO many babies this young do actually experience hunger in the night time. I would experiment with different ways of dealing with this, rather than stopping night feeds altogether.

Original poster

blob2be · 29/05/2007 12:19

I do think he will still need to feed in the night and I would be very happy to do this two or even three times. But he is waking, crying, sucking weakly for a minute or sometimes less - it's the comfort more than anything else. Can't he learn to be comforted just by cuddles? When you say 7.5 months old is still young, do you mean as in still might want nightfeeding or too young to be left to cry? FrannyandZooey, I have got the NCSS book. I have already tried the 'Pantley pull-off' which doesn't stop him wanting to suck. I would do gradual withdrawal with rocking him but I have a bad back at the moment and DS weighs 23lbs. DH can't help as he works long days and gets up very early. So many people, friends, family and HV, are telling me that CC will work. The temptation is overwhelming, although I do know I couldn't do full on CC. To be honest the worst thing about it all is the response I get from people when I tell them what a bad sleeper he is. They react as though there must be something developmentally or emotionally wrong with him. This really upsets me and then makes me even more stressed out when he wakes at night. Maybe I just need to stop listening to these people! But then again, what I wouldn't give just for one night of decent sleep!

OP posts:

MissGolightly · 29/05/2007 12:32

I meant that he's still young enough to need a feed in the night. i don't know what age I woudl say they are old enough to be left to cry - DS is 13 months and I still can't do it!

hmm... I see what you are saying about the constant sucking though... it is difficult. IME when DS is in our bed he pretty much wants to suck the whole time - if the boob is there, he wants it. When he's in his own bed he wakes for hunger and I can put him back down and leave.

Sorry, I realise that's not very helpful, just thinking aloud really!

I do know exactly what you mean about people making you feel as though your child has a sleep disorder or something. When DS was 10 months and still waking I HATED people talking about it. They all seemed to imply that if a baby wasn't sleeping through by 4 months they never would and that I was somehow damaging him by continuing to feed him in the night. I think the problem is that CC is so difficult that people need a lot of encouragement to do it, and that kind of gets turned around into implying that if you DON'T do it you are a bad mother. I almost got to feeling that I was harming DS's prospects of developing a normal sleeping pattern by not doing CC.

Don't listen to anyone else - do what feels right to you. If you are happy with your approach that's all that matters.

Original poster

blob2be · 29/05/2007 12:45

MissGoLightly, that is so true. Also, my friends, with babies and without, tell me that if they were in my position they would either go mad or become very depressed - almost makes me feel as though I SHOULD be depressed! I admit that I don't enjoy sleepless nights particularly, and I do get stressed if I try something and it doesn't work (I get especially upset when I realise that my cuddles aren't enough to comfort DS, that only the boob will do). But I'm not depressed. I'm not chronically sleep deprived either. It is at a level I can tolerate. The thought of being able to go out for the evening is lovely, but I do think that I've made my proverbial bed, maybe I should just lie in it (with DS squawking for booby at my side!). Maybe need to reassess this...........

OP posts:

kiskidee · 29/05/2007 13:01

if you are willing to co-sleep, and seeing that your child is still quite young, maybe you could go to bed with her try out something like this. hope it doesn't ramble as it is my not really thought through method.

if she is waking every hr or two, try to pat her down with one waking but feed her at the next if you manage to pat her down. if patting down doesn't work in say a minute, yes a minute, or even half a minute, because you don't want her to wake fully, then just feed and try to pat her down at the next one.

i found when i was really sleep deprived, even 10 secs felt like a long time and just fed her but tried to pat her down the next waking. I think i remember patting her down in combination with the 'pantley pull off' when i just gave in and fed.

from there you can incrementally increase her sleep time between wakings. using this method i got dd from hrly wakings to a whole 5 hrs.

if you are really sleep deprived, try napping with her during the day in the short term and maybe also going to bed an hr or two earlier than you normally would want to in order to have some presence of mind to pat her back at stupid o'clock.

Mellin · 30/05/2007 02:58

Blob2be my baby is around the same age and at about 5 months old she started regularly waking during the night crying. I soon found myself feeding her many times a night (sometimes for only a minute or two) just to get her back to sleep.

Things have changed slowly over the last month after I realised the constant night feeding wasn't helping her (or me) sleep better.

What I did was similar to what Kiskidee suggested, worked on another way of getting her to sleep that didn't involve the boob. What works for us is holding her hand and sushing very close to her face. It took awhile to figure out what worked (I found out she hates being patted or rocked). It did involve some crying as she wasn't happy at first that the boob wasn't immediately offered. In the beginning when she woke I always tried the sushing for a few minutes first before resorting to the boob. Once she accepted the sushing I set a goal of not feeding before midnight (and making sure the feed after midnight is a big one).

That's pretty much what I'm still doing now, she still wakes around 3-4 times a night but I only feed her 1-2 times, other times she will be sushed to sleep. We are still a long way from sleeping through but it is much better than it was. It's easy enough to formulate a plan in the light of day, the hard part is carrying it out in the middle of the night when you're knackered. But it can be done. Good luck xx

Mellin · 30/05/2007 03:02

By the way, I am not up sushing at 3 in the morning. I am in Australia!

twentypence · 30/05/2007 04:36

The way I see it is this.

He wakes - you feed - he goes back to sleep, you go back to sleep. All done in 20 minutes.

Or you don't feed him, he gets hysterical, vomits - you clean up vomit, still hysterical, you feed him, he goes to sleep you stay awake for the next 2 hours feeling wired and crap, then you are a zombie the next day.

He's still very little to not feed at night at all, and if sometimes he gets fed and other times not - then how will he know unless he wakes up and tries each time?

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