anyone accessed help via NHS/private on older child's sleep

[Stormyisland]

Hi everyone,

Just wondering if anyone has any experience of getting help with sleep problems either via NHS or private services?

We have an 8 year old DD who has never been able to sleep on her own. We have always allowed her in our bed because trying her in her own bed has always caused her to panic and cry and shake until she hyperventilates. She says she is scared but gives vague reasons like worth about someone's coming from the woods and staring at her through the window. Up until a couple of weeks ago she was falling asleep at 8 in her own bed with one of us sitting next to her until she fell asleep. She then runs into our bed at midnight and spends the rest of the night there. Two weeks ago I was on night shifts and she started struggling to fall asleep. Since then it has taken her an hour and a half to fall asleep and we can't leave her in that time.

It's obviously causing tensions between me and my husband and better us and her. Especially my DH loses it and shouts at her at bedtime and he has started saying he hates the bedtime so much he feels like he doesn't like her anymore and wishes he wouldn't have to come home from work. He can't see that she's a child who needs help with an issue that's difficult for her but totally just blames her for it and resents her. Their relationship has always been quite a tricky one as he can be quite critical of her. Apart from this sleep issue and very persistent thumb sucking she is a bright, happy, energetic child who makes and keeps friends easily, does well at school and seems like a happy, confident child to me. She can be quite clingy and needy at times and competes for attention with her brothers and likes to wind them up. But I don't feel like she has any more seriously problems like depression etc. Any tips or experiences would be hugely appreciated.

Is there space in your room so that when she comes in she can sleep on the floor and not in your bed? That may give you a better chance of sleep. When she does come in.
Another suggestion is to try a relaxation, mindfulness exercise at bedtime.
Is her room really dark? If it’s too bright it will affect the production of Melatonin, also if she is anxious at bedtime itself that can also affect melatonin.
If she does need a light on, a red bulb in the lamp or red fairy lights would be better.
I’d be tempted to have a chat with school about how anxious she is at night and they may have some suggestions too or may have a member of staff who has had some extra training.

Sounds like she's always had your comfort in the night and always needed that.. do you think she's able to sleep without your reassurance? If she was younger you'd be think of helping her to learn to sleep by herself by removal of the comfort in place of another (in little ones it's often feeding to sleep or dummy we try to remove).. for your DS it's you being there.

I guess it's what you want to do about it.. I don't have an 8 year old but I'm thinking something like gradual retreat with her involved in that and explaining it to her before bedtime. You could make up stories about it too.. like the princess who learnt to sleep in her palace alone?

I guess it goes without saying getting cross isn't going to help.. and you'll need your partner on board too. You can't instil this problem in DS it's something you've all been a part of so think of it as a shared problem.

In terms of nhs service, I'd think school nurse would be your best place to start.

Thank you for your replies. We've tried the mattress.. made her become totally hysterical begging for us to let her in bed and eventually forcefully climbing over us into bed and it became almost like a wrestling game trying to get her back onto the mattress. She doesn't wake up once if she sleeps next to us so the waking is not so much of a problem. Her sleeping next to me is not that big a problem either, she lets me sleep well. The trouble is just that with three children who all want to sleep with a parent our bed is not big enough for everyone and we have to split ourselves into "mummy's bedroom" and "daddy's bedroom" and children then take turns in terms of who they sleep next to. We would rather share a bed and make it clear that mummy and daddy want to sleep next to each other too but it's just not happening. Night lights, mindfulness, massage.. we've tried it all but it doesn't really work because the problem is she can't self soothe and settle to sleep without an adult cuddling up next to her.

We've started the chair technique. We've also made the bedtime routine stricter. She's often ended up watching TV all the way up to bedtime. Now all screens are switches off an hour before bedtime and that hour is calm things, bonding playing cards or chatting with one of us or writing or reading etc. Then it's bedtime story which we haven't done for ages because she always asked for ten minutes extra watching TV rather than a story. Then a kiss, a bit of back scratching and after that we sit on a chair near the bed and there's no talking or touching. She loves routines and predictability and this seems to be working well so far. Once we've got this established I'll start asking her to stay in her bed in th nighttime too.

I also spoke to her teacher today. They said she can be a bit nervous (which is the last thing I'd describe her as) and that she needs a lot of praise and reassurance around her school work. They gave me the school nurses number and asked me to keep them updated on what happens with it all.

That sounds like s great place to start, keep us posted

Just wondered how you're getting on? Hope things are improving.

He can't see that she's a child who needs help with an issue that's difficult for her but totally just blames her for it and resents her. Their relationship has always been quite a tricky one as he can be quite critical of her.

This rang alarm bells to me. Sleep can be a massive psychological issue, I struggled to sleep until I was 10 for various reasons, one of them being my relationship with my dad.