7 months - if not sleep training then what?!

[MummyNotMommy]

My just turned 7 month old DD has gradually turned into the sleeper from hell and I’m not really sure which path to take. Please help!

She was an amazing sleeper (10/11 hours straight) from 6 weeks to 3.5 months abd its all gone downhill from there.

She started waking a few times a night but still had a decent 6 hour stint, usually from 7pm-1am. I long for this now!

Recently she is going down at 7pm ish and might have a couple of hours before the waking starts. She wakes crying every 45 mins - 1.5 hours and wants feeding back to sleep.

She’s been EBF, has always refused a bottle and has been BLW for the last month but still isn’t really eating anything. I feed her to sleep and now this is what she expects, but I’m not sure how much she actually needs to still feed in the night.

She still has 3 naps a day, 30mins in the morning, 1-2 hours over lunch and another 20/30 mins around 4pm. Sometimes I feed her to sleep for naps and transfer to the pushchair but I’ve been trying to take her for a walk to break that habit. Ive got a 2.5 year old so when he’s with me it’s not always possible to walk her to sleep.

What can I do to improve the nights? I’m absolutely shattered and she’s just getting worse!

I have no idea if this is of any use to you but we recent had sleep problems with our ebf 5mo so not sure if this will help....

In a week he has gone from not napping anywhere but on us or in the car to napping in his cot

Last night I had the first stretch of 4hour plus sleep in months and months!

It may even be coincidence and nothing to do with what we did but here goes...

He was waking up every 90 minutes to feed back to sleep so last weekend we started trying to teach him to self settle. Started by putting him down for naps and when he protested, tried to comfort him in his cot rather than picking him up or feeding him back to sleep. We tried the 'shush- pat' (Google it if you're not familiar) which seemed effective and the last couple of days I have kind of guided his thumb to his mouth to suck to comfort him and kept my hand on his chest and stayed still for ten minutes while he feed to sleep. Now, if he wakes us after 40 mins (in a light phase of sleep) he immediately starts sucking his thumb to put himself back to sleep again.

As for night wakings- I noticed that he was waking for feeds but actually feeding (as in I could hear him swallowing and not just sucking) so figured he must be hungry. I had been trying to feed him so often during the day in the hope that it would stop him feeding at night that I think I had the opposite effect. He would take the breast whenever I offer it but if not hungry, would only have a small amount and then suck for comfort. I figured that he was only getting foremilk rather than the satisfying fatty hindmilk and that might be why he was so hungry. So instead of offering him loads of feeds I waiting until he was actually hungry so he would actually take a decent amount of milk. He went 5 and a half hours without a feed yesterday afternoon with no complaints! This also meant his next bed time feed was a big one too. He then woke up at 11.20 (again for a proper feed with swallowing etc) and then went through until 5.20 so six hours.

This tells me that he was actually hungry and that in a 25 hour period, he can have two pretty good sized gaps between feeds - they just need to be over night rather than during the day.

I'm going to carry on today only feeding him when he is hungry today and just make a note of the times.
Then I'm hoping I can try and devise a schedule of some sort! So if he needs 5 or 6 really good feeds during the day I can try and see if I can get him to have those feeds during daytime!

I firmly believe that they will learn to self settle at some point but that if we don't give them the chance to learn (i.e. always feed them to sleep) then they will never get it. Its difficult to break habits at first but takes about a week for them to get used to a new habit.

I was also trying to settle him at night before feeding him (again with the shush pat or a hand on his chest) and sometimes this worked but when it didn't, it's because he was genuinely hungry

Sorry for the long post!

My phone has littered that post with spelling mistakes and auto correct fails. Let me know if it doesn't make sense!

Thank you for replying, that must have taken ages!

I’ve been doing the same, trying to feed as much as possible in the day so it’s interesting to hear that you’ve found reducing that helps. She definitely snacks now, as opposed to having really good, sustaining feeds.

I have tried to calm her in her cot but she is a proper screamer and it just seems to wind her up more! I sent DH in last night and he managed to rock her to sleep but she screamed solidly for 10 minutes while he was doing it, and then woke again 40 minutes later anyway!

I’m not opposed to a bit of controlled crying, but I don’t think I can do it until I know she’s definitely getting enough to sustain her overnight.
Her brother was an amazing sleeper, never had a regression and started shoveling food in from day one, so this has all come as a shock to the system!

It's not easy I know - the first day we tried to get DS to nap in his cot he screamed but if someone is in the room with them then at least they know they're not being left to it and probably crying from frustration. All I can say is that we stuck with it and noticed a huge difference after just a few days and he settles much quicker now!
I have only fed today when he has been actually been hungry so it'll be interesting to see the effect that has tonight... If any!

@ethel really interesting to read your post. How often were you feeding and how often is he now asking for food?

Hi blueberry

I was probably trying every 2 hours or so. But since his block of 6 hours last night, he has been getting hungry every 3 to 3.5 hours and feeding properly so fingers crossed! I think I will know better tomorrow if it has made a difference. Fingers crossed for a good night!

I think my theory was correct anyway... DS went 7 and a half hours between feeds last night which he has never done! There was a couple of points in the night where he stirred and I had to put my hand on his chest to settle him back. I think he is getting the hang of self settling but can't do it between every sleep cycle.
Overall last night was a major improvement!

@Ethel great to hear!

Glad to hear your theory paid off last night!
I got a 3hr20 minute block of sleep last night which was wonderful! The rest of the night was still rubbish though!

Hello,
Sorry to differ in opinion but your baby is totally normal, and you were just lucky with your eldest, and the first few months with this one. It's normal for their sleep pattern to change too. Over time it will gradually improve, but you might see ups and downs.
Controlled crying is not recommended at all under 12 months, and generally they simply learn you won't come when they need help to go back to sleep or are thirsty or whatever, but they still wake up just as much.
Breastfeeding to sleep is nature's gift to you, don't stress about using it, it's not forever. My advice for surviving this (having been there myself and understanding how awful the exhaustion is) is to ditch the cot and prioritise feeding back to sleep lying down as much as you can, it helps you not to feel so woken up, and the BF hormones will help you fall asleep again faster. Research safe bedsharing here www.isisonline.org.uk/ or just get a single mattress for the floor in her room so you can be flexible.