Would it be wrong to do this?

[hollowtree]

Hi, I'm desperately sleep deprived and would be so grateful of help and advice here. My DD is 5 months, used to sleep like a dream up until 3.5 months. It coincided with her last jabs and what I think may be the 4 month regression.

Whatever it is, she wakes more than once an hour through the night and I really can't take much more. I have a permanent headache and I think bits of my brain are dying off. I often can't speak properly and can't process what other people are saying to me.

I've read on here that part of the problem can be that they are hungry at night. So around six months some people recommended that babies are given water during night feeds to stop them wanting milk. I'm tempted to try this because I'm tempted to try anything at the moment.

But instead of going straight to water would it be possible to reduce the amount of scoops of Formula in her bottle? So for example if she has 6 ounces put 5 scoops then the following week put 4 then the following week put 3, but always keep the volume at 6 ounces if you see what I mean?

That way her stomach would gradually adjust to having less and less milk and in the end she wouldn't be hungry during the night.

Does this sound like something that could work? Grateful of any replies.

Speak to you health visitor or pop along to one of the clinic weigh ins and discuss all this with the health visitors there. I agree that rice at this age isn't appropriate. Sleep when baby sleeps in the day, forget everything else. It will get better, but it is so hard when you're so knackered.

Although I understand your thinking behind it to thicken the milk, baby rice has no nutritional value and just takes up space in the tummy leaving less room for milk. Every baby is different in terms of when they are ready for weaning but it might be that her stomach is not coping with the solids, as she is a bit young.

If you haven’t already I would see GP about ranitidine or gaviscon to begin with to treat the silent reflux. Babies with SR can comfort feed a lot, which may be what she is doing. Even though her tummy hurts she will want to feed to try and soothe.

Unfortunately she is also just doing what babies do. Baby sleep goes up and down in the first years, it isn’t linear. they can go through phases of frequent waking. Night waking isn’t always hunger related, sleep is a development thing.

pop along to one of the clinic weigh ins and discuss all this with the health visitors there That's exactly where I was told it was fine!

baby rice has no nutritional value and just takes up space in the tummy leaving less room for milk i never thought of it like this though of course that makes perfect sense

No to rice in the bottle. Have you tried anti reflux milk? It’s thicker anyway, worked an absolute treat with mine.

rhino Thanks! We already use hungry milk as it is thicker

Wow I'm amazed if British health visitors are recommending rice to a baby under 6m. I think you have to keep feeding and cope with rests in the day & lots of cake... do you have family or friends nearby who could help. It will pass, which I know is no consolation, but remembering there's an end helped my sanity second time round.

I am absolutely appalled that a HV would recommend putting rice in a baby's bottle! This is not your fault OP so don't feel bad, you were given advice from someone you should be able to trust! If it were me I would inform her supervisor that she is giving dangerous and outdated advice.
With regards to your question, unfortunately it's very normal for them to wake frequently when they're that tiny. They need milk little and often. I would continue to feed on demand. I know it's completely exhausting. Do you have anyone who can help you in the day so you can catch up on rest?

I don’t know anything about baby rice but a quick google will let you know that the 6months for food thing is not universal worldwide advice and there is evidence that weaning earlier may be better.

See for example - www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.newscientist.com/article/dn28366-should-babies-be-given-solids-earlier-to-prevent-food-allergies/amp/

However, I agree with pps that it sounds more like a sleep issue than hunger. It is absolutely hellish not being able to sleep for longer than an hour at a go. Is there anyone you can ask to help either with night feeds or to take baby whilst you sleep in day?

I cannot believe a HV recommended baby rice in milk.

I cannot believe a HV recommended baby rice in milk.

qcumber she was quite young so I didn't think it would be outdated advice? I'm not making it thick like you would feed off a spoon and then feeding it from a bottle.

She also said (it was during a talk called 'introducing solids') that there is no evidence to suggest weaning early has any impact on a baby's physical development- they just recommend waiting until 6 months as the brain is more developed and they enjoy it more.

I don't know what to do anymore some people say put her in her own room some people say keep her in her Next2Me because if SIDS some people say cosleep urgh à this rate I am just going to jump out the window next time she wakes up!!!

A GP recommended I put rice in my now 3yo's bottle when he was about 3 months! So I can well believe it.

OP, I think watering down the bottles is fine to reduce night feeds once your baby is well established on 3 meals a day, so 8-9 months.

This sounds like a sleep issue rather than a feeding issue though, so she may well still wake for water. Is she using the bottle to fall asleep at bedtime?

Hv is talking rubbish. It's nothing to do with whether they enjoy it! It's quite worrying this is what she is telling mums. No wonder you want to jump out the window! Sleep deprivation is awful. Would an appointment with GP help for some sensible advise re feeding and reflux?
At least they can prescribe gaviscon.
I don't think hungry baby is anything to do with reflux? My dd was given gaviscon for reflex which definitely helped. Solids helped too.

Hungry baby milk is harder to digest than normal milk, not sure if that is better or worse for reflux!

marcine thank you that was really helpful. I will hold off until then. The hungry milk is thicker so it's supposed to stop the milk flowing back up the oesophogus (sp? So tired).

miss apparently they feed more to soothe the discomfort as it is comforting to feed

Hungry milk and anti reflux milk are two different products.

How does she fall asleep at bedtime OP? However she does, she will probably need to be settled the same way during every sleep cycle at night - one of mine was fed to sleep and around 4-5 months started needing to be fed back to sleep every 45 minutes!

For naps she goes straight off and self settles

Oh and at bedtime. It's just that she wakes up all the time.

A friend of mine has really recommended putting her in her own cot in her own room. We've got baby monitors so I'm going to try it soon. I'm just worried about SIDS because she is under 6 months

The risk of SIDS for a healthy 5 month old is very low, but it is a very personal decision.

Maybe try only feeding 4 hourly at night, say 11pm and 3am, and only patting her in her cot at any other waking?

Does she have a dummy?

Do you have a partner who can take over for a night? I had two absolute milk monsters who were v big babies. Did not use hungry baby milk or wean early. Just fed on demand. They did sleep through fairly on. But I think that is just luck!

Yes she does have a dummy

My friend has a baby with reflux who was put on ranitidine recently and the difference has been startling (from what she has said). My DS is 6 months and has just gone in to his own room, so now I have to go up there for night feeds, it may not make you feel better. It is a very personal decision though. I would make an appointment with the GP to discuss. If baby is not getting the calories needed as they are filling up on baby rice that may explain why they are waking in the night.

Oh dear. Babies aren't ready for any solids until they show signs on readiness, which includes the ability to sit up unaided, being able to 'pincer grip' the food and move it to their mouths by themselves. This usually happens around 6 months, although some babies may be ready earlier and some later. My DD was weaned at 7 months as that's when she could do all of the things she needed to feed herself.
Whether you're feeding solids off a spoon or from a bottle it is still a choking hazard. All the nutrition they need is in the milk and anything else is just taking up room in their tummy.
I would go to the gp if you can. You should be able to get a same day appointment. And ask them to explain everything to you. I would stop putting rice in the bottle and up milk feeds if baby is hungry.
It's so normal to be confused, there's so much different information out there, and it's a very personal choice. What I'm recommending here is what is recommended by the NHS as it's shown to be safest.
I wouldn't water down night feeds, if baby is waking it's because they're hungry and they need the nutrition from the milk.
Sleep deprivation really is awful though so I completely understand wanting to do whatever you can to help baby sleep a bit longer. Again the recommended age for putting them in their own room is 6 months, but if you feel ready then you could try putting them in their own room.
I wish I could say something more helpful! Unfortunately the early months are just a complete daze of not sleeping and confusion. But I promise it will pass. And soon baby will be sleeping through and you'll miss the lovely sleepy cuddles. Enjoy your little one and try not to stress. They're only this little once x

I weaned DD at 17 weeks. Before going ahead, I read all the underlying research I could find and made an informed decision. Here is what I learnt:

1. NHS and WHO recommend weaning at 6 months (as opposed to 4 months) solely to promote extended breastfeeding. There is no research demonstrating that weaning between 17 and 26 weeks could be harmful for babies. There is an increased risk of minor diarrhoea but it can be eliminated by keeping things hygenic.

1. There is reasonable (albeit not entirely conclusive) recent evidence that "early" weaning (between 17 and 26 weeks) reduces risk of allergies later in life. Some health care professionals outside of the UK (e.g. AAAAI - the American Academy of Allergy, Asthma & Immunology) have recently revised their weaning guidelines from "6 months" to "4 to 6 months". This was the primary factor that convinced me to wean "early".

1. It is true that most of "very early" weaning food is low on calories (with the exception of sweet potato) and is primarily introduced for flavours, however, protein based purees (e.g. chicken, fish, etc) are more calorific than milk. DD was on 3 meals by 6 months and it definitely helped her with the 6 month growth spurt. She never needed food after her dream feed (between 10.30pm and 7am).

Here is a link with more information and actual references to the underlying research:

scienceofmom.com/2015/05/14/starting-solids-4-months-6-months-or-somewhere-in-between/

Do you think she could be waking for the dummy? I wanted to keep the dummy but it was interrupting my baby's sleep and ended up being more detrimental than beneficial. So at 3.5 months, we ditched it cold turkey and he started linking sleep cycles much better within just a few days. Just a thought