Please help with bedtime nightmare (older DC)

[grounddown]

My DC are 5 and 6 and share a room. They go to bed at the same time (I'm a lone parent so it's just easier that way) and have plenty of warning that bedtime is coming at 7.30.

I give them a snack if they want one (toast usually) a warm milk drink and we go upstairs, do teeth, toilet, story time and then I ask them to lie down - then all hell breaks loose. Mom can I have a drink, mom can I have a wee, mom can I have my teddy/school bag/the cat it's endless. I always cover all these bases before bedtime so we have the teddies etc sorted but it's become a stalling tactic.

I turn off the light and go downstairs and then the talking and laughing happens. If I left them to get on with it they would talk until midnight. I feel bad because if I lived in a bigger house I may not hear them but this house is pokey and I can hear it all and it gets me really frustrated.

I shout up and tell them if it continues I'll turn off the landing light, it continues so I turn off the light and the screaming starts. I go upstairs and calmly let them know that if they want the light to stay on they need to be quiet, I turn the light on and the chatting continues. Bloody hell. I turn it off, the screaming starts again, I reiterate my message and the cycle continues with me getting louder and then it ends up with me shouting up the stairs like a foghorn. 90 minutes later they are quiet but it's 9 o'clock and we are all done in. I have to drag them out of bed at 7 in the morning because they are so tired.

Am I truly rubbish at this? They are a delight the rest of the time, it's just bedtime and I shout and shout and then sit here and feel awful. Please help, I need tips as this has been going on a while now.

It does seem odd to be contemplating sharing a room with the little one permanently but to not temporarily separate them by putting one to sleep in your room at bed time.

Starting one off in my bedroom was the best way for us when we had two lively DSs. However it also seems sad that if they are socialising with each other in their room you are getting so wound up. If you ignore them how long does it take them to settle down? Perhaps your actions are prolonging this and you should leave them to it and see what happens? I only compulsorily separated mine on nights when it was clear DS2 really needed to sleep and was past any chat with his big brother.

I do feel bad about the socialising bit, but they do have from 4pm until bedtime to do it. They play so nicely together and are best mates, I don't know what else they could possibly have to talk about!
I absolutely could separate them either by giving them their own room or by putting one in my bed, it's not something I've seen as a possibility before so I clearly need to think about it as a few posters have suggested it.

If I left them to it my DS would keep DD up talking all night and she would suffer for it the following day with tiredness whereas he wouldn't.

I think it's me who needs to change.....I am getting far too wound up about it aren't I.

This was me a few years ago and I absolutely share your pain, it's a bloody nightmare! My two, 19 months between them and the same age as yours when they were sharing did exactly the same. Up and down the stairs we'd go telling them to be quiet and that's enough talking etc, as soon as we went downstairs you could hear them giggling and whispering! Two long years we endured this! In the end we had to put them in their own bedrooms as they just couldn't go to sleep without pissing about. Bedtime is so much better now, we can put them to bed and leave knowing that they can just go to sleep without disturbing each other. I've come to the conclusion that some kids just can't share with each other! Good luck OP for what it's worth save yourself the stress and separate them!

Yep a 19 month gap here too :)
Its bloody annoying, they spend all day every day together even choosing to play together at school with mutual friends which is lovely but at bedtime it's like they haven't seen each other all year.
I even bought them a trampoline in the sales and make them bounce on it for about half an hour after we get in to try and tire them out, it's not working. My DM thinks it's all hilarious.

How about story tapes to listen too while lying in bed? With the volume low so they have to be quiet to hear it. Hearing is the last thing to go before dropping of.

I did try that podcast with the sleepy rabbit that was advertised to send them into some sort of magic trance about 2 years ago. That's didn't work, they kept asking me questions about what was happening!
I could definitely try it though, I'll put it on my list - this is why I like mumsnet, I've got loads of suggestions and light at the end of the tunnel

I think your children have what is called a late sleep phase. Once they are asleep they sleep well but you have to wake them in the morning. It is usually caused by school holidays ie Christmas when many parents allow the children to stay up a bit later and let them lie in the morning it is very frustrating for the parents because once back at school They have to get back into the routine and it takes time. As they are so close in age there is no reason why they shouldn’t go to bed at the same time and share the same bedroom.there is 20 months between my own Sons. They had their own bedrooms but still chose to be together at night. Leaving the landing light on shouldn’t cause any problems. The reason they won’t fall asleep at 7.30 o’clock is because their body clock is conditioned to fall asleep later and this is why they make lots of excuses . The way to change this to make sure that they are not allowed to sleep in in the morning even at weekends and not to have evenings when they are allowed to stay up late as a treat. The best way to change a late sleep phase is to keep them up until half an hour before they are likely to fall asleep in this case that would be 8.30. Only let them do things like crayoning or reading. no stimulating iPads or tv. Then take them to bed at 8.30 and continue with your normal bedtime routine. After 2 nights make bedtime 8:15 and then after another 2 nights 8:00. There is a very good chapter in a sleep book by dr Richard Ferber on late sleep phases. Your children won’t know why they can’t fall asleep at 7:30. There are many things that can cause children have to stay up late but if you know why they can’t fall asleep that helps to solve the problem. My children developed a late sleep phase over the six week school holidays every year as we used to have barbecues and I let them stay up late. I had to put in strict bedtime routine every September.