Gradual retreat sounds lovely (!) but what if your baby just screams?!!!

[Jojo13]

I've posted for some advice before and we have tried it...!

DS just coming up to five months and won't settle to sleep in his cot. I know putting him down awake is the key to sleep training but he is calm for the first ten mins but no amount of hand holding/sssshing/patting will work; he just gets more and more angry until he is hysterical and even picking him up won't calm him.

Want to try gradual retreat but what do I do when he cries? Picking him up and putting him down when he is calm just isn't working.

He's getting worse and worse it's like having a newborn again, he is up every couple of hours and takes ages of rocking to get him back to sleep.

HELP ME PLEEEEEEAAAASSSEE!!!

Do you use a dummy? I can't see gradual withdrawal working unless you have adequate in-cot settling methods. That means dummy at this age, comforter toy from around 12 months.

You can't even start gradual withdrawal unless you have baby calming down in the cot. At least not in the true, gentle sense. It's the dummy that primarily does the calming down, in addition to swaddle when younger or hand on chest and occassionally shush patting when after 3 or 4 months. But both require the dummy to do the main bulk of the calming down and settling in the cot.

Yep he has a dummy, which keeps him calm for that first ten mins but then he just gets more and more agitated, spits it out (or it falls out with all the fuss) and then he won't take it back (or if he does he is still crying)

How do I get him to stay calm?!!! I feel like I've tried all the softly softly stuff..

Personally I think 5 months is way too young for sleep training. He obviously doesn't know how to self settle just yet x

That's good, it will be a lot easier.

So it sounds to me like you are making too much of a change from what baby is used to. The idea of GW is to make changes so small that they create no distress for baby.

So if you are currently rocking to sleep (?), you have several things to overcome before baby will settle in the cot easily. Namely:

• movement to go to sleep
• being held in your arms to go to sleep

So your first aim would want to be just vuddling baby to sleep in your arms, with no movement.

The next stage would be moving the cuddle to be lying down, say on your bed rather than in your arms. Then reduce how much cuddling and how physically close you need to be to cuddle.

Once baby can go to sleep lying down, stationary and not in your arms, then in-cot settling starts. You seem to have made a huge jump to begin with. Gradual withdrawal is meant to be gradual in its changes.

I would go to independant cot settling via a sidecar cot (cot with 1sude removed, next to your bed. An example of the gradual changes:

• rocking to sleep in your arms. Transfer once asleep.
• cuddling to sleep in your arms. Transfer once asleep
• cuddling to sleep lying down on your bed, transfer once asleep
• cuddle to settle on your bed, then roll away from baby once calm but stay close on the bed. Roll back into cuddle if needed, roll away when settled.
• cuddle to settle in sidecar cot, roll away when settled but stay close on the bed. Back to cuddle when needed, roll away when calm.
• Reduce cuddle to hand on chest. Stay close on your bed, baby in sidecar cot. Cuddle if unsettled, just hand on chest when calm.
• Hand on chest in sidecar cot to settle, roll away from cot when calm. Back to hand on chest if unsettled, withdraw when calm

SIDE BACK ON THE COT (I think this is where you trying to start from, missing all the above)

• Hand on chest in cot (next to your bed) to settle. Stay lying on your bed, roll away from cot when calm. Roll back with hand on chest if unsettled, withdraw when calm
• Hand on chest to settle, say on opposite side of bed when calm. Back to hand on chest if needed, withdraw when calm. Wait until asleep.
• Hand on chest to settle. Wait by door until asleep. Return as needed, withdraw when calm

Cot could now go on child a own room, if sleeping through. You may need to cycle backwards up the steps with the move. But will soon progress back up the steps.

Personally I don't do gradual retreat. I always did rapid retreat, baby down, say night night and go (run like the wind) and get on with your evening and it's always worked well. Maybe not at 5 months, more like 7+ when they understand more and can recognise the routine you have for them.

"too young for sleep training"

It depends what you define as sleep training really. I was doing the above from birth pretty much, never too young. But never done to create any distress whatsoever. GW is just about very slowly, patiently and gradually making changes towards the end goal of baby sleeping independantly.

Indeed I would describe Gradual Withdrawal as a parenting style, rather than a sleep training method. Just as attachment parenting is one no-crying parenting style that affects the way baby sleeps, gradual withdrawal is another no-crying parenting style. It's just this one promotes independence, not dependence.

Thanks for all the advice.
I know 5 months seems young but he is a big boy and I'm finding it hard to continually rock him in my arms. He weighs a tonne! He's a bit temperamental with the bouncy chair, sometimes he'll nod off in it others he won't. And again, he's started to get too big for it. I'm running out of options so some form of sleep training/getting him to settle in his cot, whatever you want to call it, needs to happen! Thanks

I'm a bit out of touch as my youngest is a teenager now but I think the Baby Whisperer gives an example of a baby that she picked up over a hundred times the first night and how it reduced from that! Not sure what that age that baby was.

I'd never heard that you must put them down awake until I came on Mumsnet. Is it a new idea?
For what it's worth I fed mine(4) until they dropped off, winded them and put them down asleep in pram, carrycot or cot and they slept until next feed.