one last ditch appeal for any tips/advice on dealing with early morning waking

[Tutter]

before i resign myself to the fact that ds (22mo) is just like this whatever we do

bedtime between 7 and 7:30
one nap of about an hour and a half from 1pm-ish
blackout blinds
no specific noises to wake him

he wakes on average at 5:45 (but anywhere between 5am and 6:30)

anyone? please?

she is duty bound to do this
it is the Toddler Law
They all do it

But

They all grow out of it

I think you should refer to the "what ghastly things will you do to your kids when they are grownup"" or similar titled thread from earlier this year, there were plenty of people willing to store up total and utter revenge. Meditate on your own peculiar scheme and that will get you through.

My best friend's ds was doing this. He got up at 5am day after day after day. She tried later bed times, blackout blinds etc etc.

She has finally managed to get him sleeping from 7.30pm to 7am. This is what she did:

-Blackout blinds

• Stopped all daytime naps (he was exhausted at first but she just prersevered, kept him occupied, did everything she could, and at 23 months he stopped wanting the nap)

• Gave him his tea about 4.30. Then gave him supper about 6.15 just before his bath. Piece of toast, banana, cereal. Then milk as usual before bed.

• Within a few days he was sleeping longer.

You've probably tried everything but she really was tearing her hair out and this really helped.

TBH 1.5 hours in the day seems a bit long as my ds is 18 months and if he has anymore than an hour, and sleeps anytime after 1pm, bed time is a nightmare.
If you can't cut out the nap, maybe drastically cut it down and make sure he's awake again before, say, 1.30pm?

Good luck!

(In 10 years he'll be a teenager and you'll be having the opposite problem!!)

I'm afraid I can't help you Tutter, but I'm hoping that the mumsnet sleep expert who solves all your problems will be able to solve mine too! My son is seven months old and where we were once pretty smug sleepers (7pm - 11 - 5 - 8am), he's taken to waking up every two hours and just can't get himself back to sleep. I've made a half-hearted attempt at sleep training but gave up after half an hour of screaming at 4 in the morning (I live in a block. it's not good for neighbourly relations!) I've been breast feeding to get him back to sleep, but I know he doesn't need it and I'm worried it's making him worse!
He's never been good at going down to sleep during the day, but we could at least be sure that once he went to sleep, he'd be down for 30 - 40 mins (you could set your watch by it!), but this morning, he woke up after just 10 mins and was ready to get up and go again, but was quickly knackered!
I just don't know what to do. Sleep training is so harsh (we did it when he was little and, though it worked, I hated every minute of it.) Is it really the only way, or is this just a phase they go through? I'm loath to do it if he's just going to hit another development stage and I'll have to do it all over again!
PS. I think there might be a couple of external factors. He's just cut his first teeth and we're just back from a three-week holilday to Australia where he was shugged to sleep in our arms, I went to him whenever he called from his cot and the flight and time difference surely played havoc with the poor lamb's body clock! But that was three weeks ago, and I'm worried if I let it go on for much longer he'll never sleep again! x

Tutter my DS 5 exactly the same and we just progressed to 7 am if we're lucky. I tried everything he now has clock in his room and is made to stay in there until 7 and then he is allowed downstairs. It will pass but my sympathys it's hideous ! By the way my dd 2 will lie in until 8/9 if i let her no matter how much sleep she has in day. So i am resound to the fact that it's the child and not what we do with them that aids sleep. sorry.

I too would recommend you make the nap v short - 45 mins max and make it earlier 12.30 if possible. Clocks change this weekend which may help you - put him to bed at 8pm new time (ie 7pm old time) when this happens whic means he shouldn't waked until after 6am new time which just feels more human!

One of mine is an early and it did improved significantly when we dropped the daytime nap but it has started to wear off now she is 3.5 - roll on school to wear my dd out!

Tutter, you could be me! My DS2 (22 months as well!) is exactly the same, to the letter. I've tried everything too and can't find any logical reason for it. It doesn't seem to matter what time he goes to bed or how much or little sleep he has during the day, he still wakes sometime between 5:30 and 6am, but usually 5:40 on the dot! I do think it's a phase though as I have a vague recollection of DS1 waking early for a while. My trouble at the mo is that DS2 disturbs DS1 so the're both on the go from 6am. CBeebies, Nickjnr or a DVD playing in our bedroom at least keeps them relatively quiet until 7am!!

thanks all

would love a change to come before ds2 is born, as the early start will hit hardr when i've been up in the night i'm sure

i really doubt i could get him through without a nap, but maybe it's something i can try on day when dh is home for moral support

forgot about the clock chnge - that should give some relief, even short term

ps loobins, i would start another thread if i were you - your appeal is likely to be lost in this one...

Good luck and if you do discover anything that helps, please let me know!!! I'm so rubbish without much sleep.

Loobins, my 2 used to wake after about 40 mins sleep all the time and I read somewhere that they come into a very light sleep at this stage and will start crying until they learn to settle themselves again. On learning this I left mine and they learnt to go back to sleep again. The external factors have not helped but from what I've seen and learnt, if you don't do some sort of sleep training and continually go to them or start cuddling/breastfeeding them to sleep you're gonna give yourself a much bigger problem. I think you need to go for it, perhaps over a weekend so if you're worried about disturbing people, chances are they're not having to get up early. Perhaps warn your neighbours? At 7 months old he needs sleep during the day and getting over tired at the end of the day makes getting to sleep even worse. At that age my 2 were still having about an hour in the morning and 2 hours after lunch.

Tutter

My DD is only 7 months but has been waking for the day anywhere between 4.45 and 5.30am. She sleeps through but wakes early. The lst two days I drastically reduced her naps. She now only has two 40 min naps a day (instead of one 40 min and one 1.5 -2 hours). This seems to help as for the last two days she has woken at 6.10am - seems like a lie in now!

I have decided that the theory that good day time sleep = good night time sleep does not hold true for us.

Good luck

Have recently pretty much sorted this with ds2 (13 months). He was waking between 4.50 - 5.10 am every morning; sometimes ready to start the day (but ready for a nap by 8am), or I had got into the habit of taking him into our bed to snatch another hour or so of sleep.
Decided enough was enough. So when he woke, I went in, made sure he had his dummy and "snuggly", then left the room. Of course he cried, so left him for about 5 minutes, then dp went in to reassure him and left the room, ds2 settled for a bit, dp went in again and so on. After 2 or 3 times of dp going in he settled himself back to sleep for another hour and a quarter.
We carried this on for every morning and each time it took less time for him to settle, and he also seemed to be waking the first time a bit later each day. It took about 2 weeks in total and now he sleeps til close to 6.30 - which is bliss compared to 5am!
I think the key was dp going to him instead of me - he associates me with getting him up or bringing him to our bed, so when I didn't, it was just more confusing to him.
I suppose this is a form of CC, but at least he seemed to settle in between dp going in - I don't think I could have managed it if he'd been screaming the whole time.
You have my sympathies anyway, Tutter, I know how frustrating it is when nothing seems to work!
Good luck whatever you decide to try !

Am keeping an eye on this as we are on 4.30am starts at the moment! Ds is 2.5. We are working on making a very big distinction between night time (sleepy time etc) and morning (awake now!! etc) and trying to settle him with the minimum of fuss. He is still not going back to sleep and my fear is that he just doesn't need to.

we have a rule of no getting up before 6:00

before then we pop in and settle him - keeps him going for 10, maybe 20 mins at a time

have always done this, and no noticeable difference over time, but thanks for the suggestion toothyboy and that it worked for you

Damn me if I am posting too soon.
DS2 17mths has in the last week consistently been sleeping through, thank The Lord, but has insisted on waking at 5am argh! I have encouraged and he has tried his best to go back down but he cannot/will not but I refuse to get up till at least 6am.
Anyway, yesterday OH suggested that he might be cold, I gave him the ?what would you know/how dare you? look, so last night I added 2 cellular blankets under his existing duvet, as well as his vest and romper I added a T Shirt and socks.
Guess what? 5am came and went, not a murmur. Alarm went off at 6am (it?s a working day), not a sound. Had a shower. DS1 had a shower, dressed and played a loud version of the Numberjacks in his room just next door, not a peep. I had to wake him up, ah, not fair!
Had to nod an acknowledgement in OHs direction.
Fingers crossed it was not a fluke, I all too easily could get used to this.

I won't tell you that I have had 7 years of this as that won't make you feel any better. They don't all grow out of it .
DS is a shocker. Does my head in on a daily basis. Sleeps on average 9 hours a night. Always has done.
So I won't tell you that.

I too am cursed with early risers - DS1 (3.9)wakes any time after 4.45 and often wakes DS2 (2.5), who usually sleeps til 6.00 - 6.30 if not woken. He comes into our room and gets in our bed but won't go back to sleep - just chats, sings, etc, all very sweet but not at bloody 5am!!! Can't make him stay in his room as he shares with DS2 but he does know that mummy and daddy do not get out of bed until 7.00.

We have tried everything - changing bedtimes, neither has daytime naps, blackout blinds, 'supper' in case he wakes due to hunger - nothing works!!!

I'm so fed up with it - I go to bed at 9.00 most nights to make sure I get enough sleep and if I do have the odd late night (by late I mean 11.00, any later and I'm a wreck) then I feel so rough the next day. I'm planning my revenge though. When he's 18 and still in bed at midday I'm gonna barge into his room and start singing really loudly.

Vossy,
Hope you're still watching this thread. Just wanted to say thanks for your advice. We decided to go cold turkey and when DS woke at 2am, instead of me going in to feed him, DH went in to settle him. He cried (broke his heart, actually!) for 10 mins, then settled himself to sleep. That was three nights ago now and he's slept through since! What bliss! He wakes up (i'm so in tune to it I hear his first murmur) but he just chats to himself and falls back to sleep almost immediately. I'm almost scared to write this as if saying it out loud will make it disappear, but i wanted to say thanks! Now we just need to work on the early starts (5.30, though he's happy to lie in the cot until 6. Still, you can't have everything!) x