how can i change ds's sleep pattern??

[maisystar]

following on from the 'what is a reasonable time to get up' thread!!

ds sleeps from 7pm till 6.30-7am, (normally slightly before 7-hate seeing the 6 on the clock, even if it's 6.59 ), how can i shift this to 8/8.30pm till 8ish?

if i put him to bed later he wakes earlier, but have given up after a few days cos he starts getting grumpy and falling asleep at 5pm!!

he's 3 1/2 btw

Maisystar - my ds2 has an inbuilt clock at gets up at 6 or 6.30 irrespective of his bedtime, or how physical/tiring a day he's had. From time to time we make efforts to try and adjust his routine, but it just ends up in none of us getting the sleep we need, and being bad-tempered and grumpy as a result. For us battling this problem has just not been worth it, and I've found it more liberating to just accept that this is how he is atm, that he won't be like it forever, and to try and make the best we can of the situation. By the time he was 4 he was able to get up without disturbing everyone else too much, and go and play quietly, and this is what still happens. (He's 5 now.) His brother (they share a room) rarely wakes, and I usually go back to sleep.

I don't think you can, maisystar, since he is sleeping for over 11 hours at night. Everything I've read about sleep suggests that trying to get him to bed later won't help. I think he is getting to an age where you should be able to encourage him not to disturb you when he wakes up though - by means of a bunny clock or similar.
And remember, when he's going to school presumably you'll have to be getting him up earlier than 8-8.30?
btw I know what you mean about the psychological effect of 6 - I have a conventional clock and I feel sooo much better if I'm woken at 'something to 7' rather than 'something past 6' - so 6.30 is my deadline time!!

Maisy, what do you do when the clocks shift backwards or forwards? Does he adjust, or does he just keep waking up at the same time? I have found that DS will eventually adjust (and has also done so for complete time shifts, like our trip to Washington), but it takes a while. You may find you have to shift the whole pattern of the day eg naps - as there is a "rhythym" to the day which determines wake up times.

Personally I think 7-7 is pretty amazing!

if he wakes up at 6.30 he will go and play till 7am, bless him

think you have both confirmed what i already thought-that i can't change it !!!

sorry florenceuk, missed your post, neighbour knocked on door to tell me she was rearranging the bins!!

if the clocks change i tend to leave the clock and change it in the morning iyswim. it doesn't seem to affect him at all, doesn't wake earlier or later!

naps-what naps?

Sorry maisystar - its one I struggle with too! But like you, my ds1 will usually happily amuse himself until around 7am.
When we go to Europe I usuallly try to keep to the later time in the hope of getting a slight lie-in - so I shift all his mealtimes and sleeptimes later (so they are the same time according to his body clock iyswim) but it doesn't help very much - usually find that his wake up time drifts earlier gradually. Frustrating really because in theory it ought to be possible

maisystar, dd is the same. She wakes at 7am as though she had an alarm clock in her room, regardless of whether she's gone to bed earlier or later than usual. I'm the same though. If I have a late night I still wake the same time in the morning. I have no idea why.

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My ds wakes up at 5.30 in the morning... can we swap for a while? I guarantee you'll be pleased to wake up at 7 after a week of mine!

done my fair share of 5am starts!!! had about 6 months of them in winter '01. not an experience i wish to repeat!!