Almost 4 year old has never slept through the night

[canigoontheipad]

I have no idea how to tackle this.
DS wakes up every night, several times a night. It's almost like having a baby. He goes to sleep at 7, but the longest he'll sleep for is until about 11.30, at which point he comes into our bed. That isn't too bad in itself, except on nights like tonight where he has woken at 8.30pm
He just doesn't like being on his own I think.
I've tried over the years to do controlled crying - failed, gradual retreat - failed, sticker chart - failed. The reason these things have failed is that he is SO strong willed and after a period of time of there being no improvement and/or illness etc I have basically given up.
Just don't know what to do now - please help!!

Bribery just changes the child's motivation obviously.

DD1 was exactly as you describe your DS - we also tried everything until at 6, the community paediatrician diagnosed a 'significant sleep disorder' and prescribed melatonin.
She went on to be diagnosed with various other things which we later realised contributed to her sleep difficulties.
There was nothing behavioural-wise that would have helped.
Just sharing this as sometimes, it's more than just wilfulness.
Perhaps ask your GP to make a referral to community paediatrician? Ours was more than willing to by the time we eventually asked for helped, as he realised that like you, we really had tried everything, to no avail.
The melatonin, and her age eventually calmed it down, as hormone production levelled out. She now sleeps 'normally' aged 11.
I know how utterly gruelling it is.

My DS was 4 before he slept through.. He still isn't a great sleeper..

I agree with other posters.. I did controlled crying once, he was sick and never did it again...
I did slow retreat...It takes a really long time.

I have done return to bed it is exhausting..

I also did the gro clock...

The one thing with these is they do work it depends how you want to do it been committed to doing it and deciding you are going to follow through.

Make a new start..New bedding, sleep teddy? something make the room a great place to go.. Is there a light? if so I did read don't turn it off when they are asleep...as it disturbs something.

Do it when you have the energy to follow through when you can no more get DH to do so.

My child is 4 and still doesn't sleep through. No advice here, just wanted to say I feel your pain!

Thank you everyone - I know I need to do something but have been putting it off until the new year, which it will be very soon....
I might retry with the gro clock or some equivalent.
I do like the idea of bribery and it would probably work for him,but it would need to be something that he really really wanted.
Thanks again everyone

Maybe ask to be referred? We did a sleep study and found out it was sleep apnea, so waking multiple times in the night scared as couldn't breathe briefly. Tonsils and adenoids out and.changed child completly. Do they snore or get tonsillitis?

That's it - something he actually wants more than to sleep in your bed. He sounds strong-willed - mine was too.

Op, does your child eat enough food before bed to keep them full through the night? I know Dd wakes up to six times when she does not eat properly. This can go on for three days.

You might want to change the eating time or adding more just to see if it makes a difference.

He's not a great eater.
For example today he has eaten no breakfast, hardly any lunch and picked at dinner. I've raised these issues with hv and gp but they said his weight is fine. Sometimes he will eat really well in a day and other times not. I'm sure this is a factor but not a lot I can do about it.

I'll see how I get on with the next attempt at training and if it's still proving impossible then I'll ask for a referral thank you for the advice.

Op, I think that is your biggest problem. I gave up on diverse food and we are stack with only food they like. I think for my Dd is todo with the texture. Some types of food makes her throw up.
We mange breakfast (the same thing for the past three four months) nibble till 2 (these will include fruits, dried fruits, crackers, sometimes biscuit to keep the colonies up, raw vegetables or carrots and pepper) sometimes she eats non of those.
Between 2-5 we will have a big bowl plain easy cook pasta.

I use the pasta mainly for bulking up her stomach.

She goes to bed at seven. I try my best to make sure drinks yoghurt. It's my only way of getting milk down her. Three of those little one for children. She can't eat it a spoon. I mix it with water and Tropicana mango/peach/Papaya because they are not as acidic as the others. The other fruits would spoil the yoghurt.

Vitamin supplement before 1pm.

I have tried health visitors and every body I can ask for help. Sometimes you have to work with what you have got.

If they are hungry, there is no training in the world which will help. Unless you are training them to cope with hunger.

I have meddled with food so much that when people come round they think my child is spoilt. I know what am doing and what the aim is. It's not easy having a child who does not. A child who is will to starve for two days.

I think Harry's on the money. In general I am somewhat sceptical about sleep training. I think if the child is on the cusp of getting it, then these methods help get them over the final hurdle. But if they are far from the finishing line, no amount of training will help, and might in fact make things worse. I'm aware of very few cases where a child has slept consistently badly (e.g. waking every two hours) for 2+ years and then being transformed overnight by one of the usual sleep training methods. Maybe thousands of people will now pile onto this thread to prove me wrong, but I suspect if such things were going to work, they would have done at 6-18 months.

So my feeling is your (limited) energy is best directed elsewhere. The food issue does sound important and is probably worth addressing in its own right. That said, children do vary a lot in how much they eat from one day to the next - ours can go from being a bottomless pit for several days (usually just before a growth spurt) to picking away at things for others. But if there's a long-term pattern of not eating (like harry describes) it sounds like this needs to be dealt with. I'm afraid I have no experience or advice to offer here.

On the sleeping - it took us over 3 years and in the end it sorted itself out. Starting nursery school helped a lot - I think the novelty of it and all the activities helped tire him out. Maybe you have something similar (school, even, if you're in England?) looming? In the meantime I think the best thing to do is focus on your own mental condition (and your partner's) and make sure you have some strategies for dealing with the lack of sleep and unpredictability of it all. If you're bearing the brunt of the nighttime duties then arranging for a period of guaranteed 'me time' each week could be sufficient to keep you strong.

Good luck. Those of us who've been there know how hellish it can be. I wish I could tell you when it will end.