Any advice

[Starfish25]

Hello, first time mum with a 10 month old. How can i get him in a better sleeping routine? He's awake from 4 o'clock talking away. He goes to bed before 7 as he is kicking off. He will want a nap around 9am till possibly 11 then he will have another 30 minutes to an hour while am out shopping around 1-2ish. Is this a normal routine or is he sleeping too much during the day? Thanks for any help x

His sleeping in the day sounds fine and very normal. My only thought is that he might be going to sleep too early. My dd was in that pattern a few months ago (6.30-7 bedtime, wakes up at 5/6) we pushed it back gradually by 5 mins a day. She was pretty furious to start with but we just kept on and within a month she was much better. She's now sleeping at around 7.30-8.30, waking at 7-8am and is much happier.

We vaguely follow the 2,3,4 rhythm: first nap 2 hours after waking (this is set in stone), lunch, second nap 3 hours later (though it's often a bit more atm), dinner and then bedtime 4 hours afterward.

Hth

Thank you for the reply. I will try putting him to bed later tonight an see how we get on. When I've tried to keep him up i have my mum telling me if i do that he'll become over tired and won't sleep. I don't know if I'm coming or going lately haha x

I would be inclined to suggest not enough daytime sleep.

You say you put him to bed before 7pm because he's kicking off. That's because he needs more sleep than he's getting.

At 10 months and with your short afternoon nap, I'd add a teatime power nap:
9am-11am nap
1pm-1.30/2pm nap
4pm-4.30/5pm nap
7.30-8pm bedtime

Really you need that afternoon nap lengthening. The aim would be 9-11am nap then 2-4pm nap, only then dropping the third nap. I would move when you do shopping and make the afternoon a longer nap at home.

Thank you for the reply. I thought he was getting too much sleep during the day as I've read on older forum's that at his age he should be sleeping max of 3 hours in the day then he should ideally be sleeping the whole night.
Today he went to sleep at 8am till 9:45 then he slept 1pm till 1:40 and then again at 4:10 till 4:55 with that nap he woke up crying which only means he is still tired.
At the moment he seems ok he is normally grunting/moaning at me to go to bed. Fingers crossed the extra sleep might of helped x

Not sure what forum you read that on, but any limit on daytime sleep is going to hinder, not help.

More sleep = better sleep
Poor sleep = less sleep

A baby/toddler getting more sleep is easier to get to sleep, sleeps more deeply so wake less frequently. So overall sleep quality continually improves.

A baby/toddler who is over tired will find getting to sleep more difficult, will sleep lightly so wake easily and so overall sleep spirals to get worse.

At 10 months old my youngest was having two 2 hour naps then about 11h unbroken at night. She kept that until 20 months.

At 20 months she moved to a single 3h-4h afternoon nap and 11h at night. She's now 2y3m and she sleeps 12-3pm (I wake her for the school run, she'd sleep an extra half hour if left) and closer to 12h at night.

If you've taken the mindset that your baby needs less sleep so have been discouraging rather than encouraging more sleep - that is probably the root cause of the problem.

The only other thing is I'd add is don't let that teatime nap go past 4.30-5pm, or it will end up affecting bedtime. But 2h-3h awake time before bed is ideal. Any longer and baby will be over tired.

I would push the second nap back a bit personally and I agree with 3 hours. Aim for 90 minute naps at 10 & 2.30.

Bedtime routine in the order of pjs, milk, teeth, book & bed