room dark or light for naps, conflicting advice, confused new mum!!

[alibo]

My 4.5 month ds went for weeks struggling to nap for long, always fully woke up in light sleep after 45 mins.Put blackout blind and curtains in room, and over many weeks started sleeping good 2 hours with occasional cry out. Never sleeps for long in pram, and wakes when stop pushing, even though still tired. However I am getting increasingly nervous about him getting used to sleeping in dark, as far as visits to relatives, holidays etc. But cannot see him having the same good sleep in broad daylight, and obviously do not want to deny him this. All relatives live away and this has already caused conflict with mum who cannot understand need for quiet dark room. She thinks he should sleep anywhere if tired, but I see how ratty he gets if he's not had a proper sleep. Dark room also got him to sleep till 7, 7.30 instead of 6. Getting upset with mums comments like "he is always shut in his room in dark and never sees light of day"! and she thinks i am making a rod for my own back. Don't know what to do for best!! Would welcome any advice for and against!!

I have always put my babies to sleep in as dark a room as I can manage, and have never found it to be a problem when we go away and they have to sleep in a lighter room. I think that the essence is to teach them a good sleeping habit, and then they can cope with sleeping in environments that are not quite what they are used to. I also make sure that they have the same bears in their cots wherever they sleep, and, if necessary, even take their blankets and sleeping bags away with us. My mum also thought it was wrong for me to put ds to sleep in the dark for his daytime naps, but when she saw the result (that he is a champion sleeper) she never raised a murmur when I later did the same with dd.

Hi alibo, I had the same thing with ds1, would only sleep well in a dark room and never anywhere except his own cot, was a nightmare if I needed him to sleep anywhere else and a cause of much anguish to me!
After this experience I made a concerted effort not to make ds2's room completeley dark during the day (he has blackout curtains but I don't block out all the light that shines over the top etc). Happily he is a much better sleeper than ds1 was and (touch wood) he is 11 months, and only sleeps less than 1 1/2 to 2hrs at lunchtime if there is something genuinely wrong with him.
I think wether you make the room dark depends on what makes your baby happiest. With ds1 only the dark would do, but ds2 is different and sleeps through regardless.
By the way, did you know you can get blackout linings that attach to existing curtains with hooks? Didn't know if this would help your ds sleep better away from home (from Mothercare or the great little trading co). Oh and the other thing we did, was if a break away was planned, was to put him to sleep at home in his own room in his travel cot for a day or so before we went, just so everything wasn't totally unfamilliar when we wanted him to sleep there away from home. HTH

The best advice I was given as a new mum was to not let anyone elses advice bother me and to do what I know is best for my child. Be strong and follow your own insticts! Try him in alighter room if you want to but don't worry if it doesn't work (as long as you're happy to continue the way things are). Thank your mum for the advice and explain that you need to do what is best for your ds. Hopefully, she'll realise that as you're the one with him all the time, you're the one who knows best what he needs. Best of luck.

neither of mine have ever been in dark rooms, and when they had daytime sleeps, I didn;t even draw the curtains. They always have slept well, and not bothered about it being dark. But this worked for me, and may not be what you want to do. xoz is right - do what you think works for you.

Hi Alibo - we did the same for ds from birth and got exactly the same comments from family and friends. As you say, he just didn't sleep as well in the light - and why should he? I don't leave lights on or curtains open if I go to bed! There is meant to be eveidence of a sleep chemical in the brain which is triggered by darkness - will do a google and wee what I can find.

We also have a fantastic sleeper who will be asleep from 7pm til well after 8am, whereas many other children seem to be awake from around 5/6am (ie dawnlight).

There is a big difference in babies grabbing 40 winks anywhere they can and having a good, long undisturbed sleep where they are comfortable. Think about when you sleep on a train or in a car - you don't really feel refreshed when you wake up. You're doing the right thing and your ds will be a much happier chappy because of it.

My MIL managed to track down a market stall which sold blackout fabric by the metre. We bought a couple of metres worth and take it away with us whenever we stay with friends or family. We just blutack it to the walls and shove a towel over the curtain rail.

hth

ironically, we put a new blind up in ds2 room with blackout lining, and the first 5 days he woke at 5am and not 6am,....because it was dark???????? whats that all about

that's "evidence" and 'see" - ds may sleep, but I don't get nearly enough

Found this

"Keep your bedroom as dark as possible. Your body produces melatonin at night from the pineal gland, which is very sensitive to light. Even the slightest amount of light can interrupt the melatonin cycle. Make sure there are no gaps in the curtains to let in street lighting or car headlights."

from the-stress-site.com

we have no curtains or blinds in our beddroom (but are not overlooked thank goodness) as we are rennovating (could be years before we get them!) so no wonder I feel shattered all the time. thanks for that.

Thanks for all your replies,will carry on with dark room for now, as in the last couple of days he has started being disturbed in his sleep again after half an hour. Sure he is teehing, with a lot of hand sucking, saliva,etc. Sometimes he will go back off with some teething gel, sometimes not. Last time I stayed at mums we nearly had a full blown row as I had taken a dark blanket to put up at the window, in the very sunny room where he would be sleeping. She thinks I am obsessive, but didn't say too much the next day when he slept till 8 am. However next time he will be in the travel cot, not moses basket, which will only fit in her bedroom, which is even sunnier at 5am. Scared to death of another conflict if I take a spare set of blackout linings!! It is getting me down a bit, as my niece who also stays there (5 months) will nod off anywhere dark or light , even on a change mat in middle of lounge!! She is always comparing them and then declares that me and my sister slept well as babies and "blackouts weren't invented then!!" She also thinks he should sleep outside in fresh air in pram for 2 hours like we did. All family is going to Scarborough in August and I am even starting to dread that, as she has already made the comment that "I hope you won't have to back to the apartment every day so he can sleep in his cot!!" Sorry to carry on about the mum thing, but she is beginning to make me feel inadequate. Wish he would have a good sleep in his pram whilst out and about, but he just doesn't. Any more advice welcome!!

If it makes you feel any better I am worried about exactly the same thing with DS (13 months)! He has always been a champion sleeper and even now will sleep 2 hours during the day in his dark room, in his cot and 12 hours at night. Problem is we're going on holiday in July and I can see myself either going 'home' at naptime or ???? I have thought about doing some 'pushchair sleep training' (I had to do travel cot training with DD !) before we go but I know that the quality of sleep that he will get will not be the same and so he will be very ratty as he will be so tired and consequently I will have extra work on my plate with him!!! You are not alone!!! I need advice too from anyone out there!!!!

Hi alibo

I agree with the other comments - do what feels right to you. You are the best judge of what works for your baby.

I also know I'm a far better mum to my 2 children than my mum was to me.

If your mum isn't being supportive, how about telling her so when you are both feeling calm. Tell her clearly what you do want from her and what's not helpful and why.

Good luck! In those days they thought leaving a baby to cry was good because it exercised their lungs - so what do they know anyway!!

Hi there mumsnetters, it's reassuring to know I am not the only one with same problem. My other concern with dark quiet room for sleep is what will happen if in the future I send him to nursery for a couple of days. We are possibly going to be moving this year to live near my sister, and if he went to the local nursery where my nieces go, I know for a fact that he won't be sleeping in a darkened quiet room!!! Has anyone else out there had this problem, and if so did you solve it?

Alibo, you shouldn't let your mother pull you down and feel inadequate of your decisions. You should do what is best for you and your ds and only you will know what that is, if he sleeps better in a darkened room then so be it...it is better to have a happy baby who has slept well than a grumpy one who has had little sleep. Sleep is so important for babies (and us!) so it is up to you to decide what factors will benefit your ds in having a good sleep. My ds (now 14 mths) has only ever slept in a darkened room and sleeps well from it. He does sleep at nursery in a lighter room but not as well as he would at home (nor for as long, as detailed in your other thread). My mother keeps popping little suggestions forward about getting him used to sleeping in a lighter room and when I try he sleeps, but never for as long (some naps are approx 3 hours!). I am wondering how ds will cope when we go camping but I'm not going to think about it until nearer the time! With regard to your holiday, we found that once ds's sleep pattern was established he pretty much dozed off at around that time in the buggy or car, maybe it is something your ds will do eventually. Don't fret about it though but enjoy your holiday, hang those black out curtains up with pride and ignore the comments! Good luck Alibo.

Hello poppyseed! I would be interested to keep in touch to find out how you are getting on with pushchair training. I sent my e-mail to you via "contact other mums", but mumsnet emailed me back saying you had requested not to be contacted on your registration form. If you would like to keep in contact, they said you can amend your form following links from the homepage. Hope to hear from you soon!! Alibo

Hello muddaofsuburbia, I would be interested to know what feeding routine you have from 8am till 7pm, and the age of your ds. My ds is 4.5 months and I find if I let him sleep till 8am I cannot fit enough feeds in before bed at 7pm. He still has a 10pm feed, and not interested in solids yet.Would welcome any advice as I usually have to wake him at 7.30 no later.

A completely darkened room imo is not really necessary during the day. And noise or no noise is something a child has to get used to. Ourr dd has had to learn to sleep with trams cars, and buses going past our appartment.

Why don´t you simply try and not make the room darkout and if the weather is nice take him outside regularly for walks but somewhere quiet away from shops and busy streets - a forest, park etc.

Perhaps you Mum knows from experience that a baby can sleep in a not completely dark environment! He is still young and my dd was also waking up after 45 minutes when your ds ag, pram or room.

Hi Alibo - pushchair training will commence on Tuesday 22nd -watch this space!!!

Alibo - we did the gina Ford routine with ds. He's now 21 mths and has his own routine, but for the first year we were pretty strict with his timings and it's worked brilliantly (although that's not the case for every baby).

At 4.5 mths I woke ds at 7am and he would have a breastfeed (for ages). I would have to check back to see the times for the rest of the day at that age, but he was fairly "on time", though not always to the last second!

Bedtime was and still is 7pm. He still got a feed of expressed milk at 10/11pm (can't remember exactly when), which we woke him up for. Once he was stuffed he would sleep through til I woke him again.

He started solids at 5.5 mths, but could have quite happily waited til 6 mths looking back.

Much as it's a bit of a pain to wake your little one at 7am, it does work. Although I know how tempting it is to let them sleep on if you know they will . I started letting ds sleep later once he'd dropped his morning nap, which was about 13/14 mths - he also dropped his morning b/f then too.

Don't worry too much about 15 mins here and there, but if he does sleep too late at this stage, I think it does have a knock on effect throughout the day. Keep doing what you're doing - it sounds like it's working really well. All the best

Island Girl, you could wear one of those sleep eye masks which will black out light.

Hello poppyseed, hope first day goes ok!!

Hi, have started a new thread in sleep if you want a laugh about my attempts at training!!! See Ya!