Rapid return - tell me about your experience

[boopdoop]

DS (22 months) has always been a horrendous sleeper, never slept through. Previously a bit of cc did help, but then he started putting his knee through cot bars so had to move him to a bed. CC then didn't work as he was hurting himself (bashing head on stairgate etc). So we are trying rapid return.

On night 4, and it's feeling hard, though not helped that DH is away tonight and tmrw night. First and second night similar with 90 mins to settle then 3-4 wake ups with 5-30 mins each time. Last night was only an hour and 2 wake ups, one 4 mins the other 90 mins (1.45-3.15am).

Just wondering what others experience of doing it was, how long it took till they settled easily, and any tips. Tell me it's worth doing this (though no idea what else we'd do, feel like we've run out of options).

We tried one night, it took 45 mins to get our 26mo to fall asleep - but on the floor. I transferred her. Then woke at about midnight, was awake till 345, it was not so much rapid return as "try to force a strong and thrashing two yr old into a bed she is getting out of before you've even got her fully back into it". It was horrendous, she was hysterical, and we gave up. No easy solutions though as, while we have managed to be firm about sleepytime etc, I'm still spending half the night next to her. I posted on here for help and was advised to put her back in the cot and do rapid return into the cot instead - wouldn't work for us as she was devastated when we tried to put the cot back up, possibly as we had been so positive about the move to big girl bed...
Hope you get some more encouraging responses though! It does sound like it's worth you sticking at it for at least another couple of nights...

Thanks. He protests for the first few mins then he just gets out and runs to the door and stands st the door waiting for us to go in... When we do he turns and walks back to bed and gets in... So he knows what he needs to do, which is great. Just need him to do it less times / stay in bed sooner! And I worry it's turning into a game at times. I have run out of other options so this really needs to work!

You have a behaviour issue that you are trying to solve.

The putting his knee through cot bars is also a behaviour issue. Is there any reason why you didn't deal with that as a behaviour issue?

You seem to have taken a child who's quite young to be moving into a cot (mine were over 3 years old) and already has behaviour issues surrounding sleep time and bedtime - and you thought that moving into a bed may solve this.

As you have found, it's not going to solve anything and actually just makes matter more difficult to solve.

I would go back to the cot and deal with the actual problem - the fact that he isn't sleeping well. This kind of behaviour issue is a million times easier to deal with in a cot, if at all possible.

I agree with fate's slightly strict reply

Hope you find something that works for you wtf, it's so hard isn't it. Don't haven't suggestions as we've totally reached the end of ourselves over his sleep and am just desperately hoping that this will eventually work.

fate, we tried to stop him putting his knee through the cot bars for weeks, but nothing seemed to stop him. He'd do it as soon as we walked out, and he was getting it very stuck, took 2 hands to get his knee out. What would you suggest to deal with that, as nothing we did seemed to work, so felt we had no choice.

I know quite a few people that moved their kids to cots around 2, some earlier, so didn't seem too early. I hadn't planned to do it yet, but didn't know what else to do and was worried he'd cause damage to his knee if he carried on.

Would love to hear any experiences of rapid return, how long it took to work etc. Anyone had success with it?

Travel cot? Harder to climb out of and can't get knees stuck. We did this with our son when he would climb out of his cot but was too young for a bed. He trashed at least 2 travel cots from jumping in them, but it worked and now he sleeps like a dream. No advice about rapid return per as I've never heard of it.

we tried to stop him putting his knee through the cot bars for weeks, but nothing seemed to stop him. He'd do it as soon as we walked out, and he was getting it very stuck, took 2 hands to get his knee out. What would you suggest to deal with that

Very similar to what you are doing now. Your focus is on lying down in the cot. Don't tolerate anything other than lying down in cot.

Child stands up.
You lie child down, re-settle, establish calm lying down sleep time and walk towards the doorway
Child stands up.
You lie child down, re-settle, establish calm lying down sleep time and walk to the doorway
Child stands up.
You lie child down, re-settle, establish calm lying down sleep time and walk to the doorway, wait in the doorway.
Child sits up.
You lie child down, re-settle, establish calm lying down sleep time and walk to the doorway, wait in the doorway.
.... and so on until....
Child stays lying down for 15 minutes, you take a few steps away from doorway but leave door open. If child stands, repeat as above. If not wait until child is asleep and then close the door.

The behaviour issue here is that the child is not lying down and relaxing at bedtime. This issue is the same bed or cot. It is just much, much easier to deal with in a cot.

I know quite a few people that moved their kids to cots around 2, some earlier, so didn't seem too early. I hadn't planned to do it yet

This decision is not yours, that is the problem. If you remove the behaviour issue and moved from cot to bed at a time that you felt was right for your child, then the age doesn't matter. The move from cot to bed should be positive, a nice change that is easily done.

You have not made the decision to change from a cot to a bed though. You have allowed your childs behaviour to force a decision before it is actually the 'right time' in your adult view.

Great to see that Fate has all the answers .

boop Evening rapid return failed here. Got down from 90 to 30 returns in 2 weeks and it broke me (working lp).

I don't have all the answers. I answered the specific "What would you suggest..." question.

Why the hmm face?

Thanks fate, sounds great in theory. Our reality is that it's never worked doing sleep training when we are in the room, the only thing that has ever worked was cc. So I didn't really think of doing that.

And now I think it's too late to go back to a cot. He does actually love his bed, and so I don't want to go backwards. And he was just getting to the point of trying to get out of the cot so wouldn't have lasted too much longer anyway.

Hopefully persevering with this will work, it's just quite relentless doing it on your own, and DH has been away for s couple of nights. Back after tonight.

When you do the rapid return, do you make any eye go tact, talk, or respond to him?

Hi theyremad, with rapid return I don't think you do any interaction. I tend to have one phrase I use at first "back to bed" which I say as I go into the room the first few times. I think the key is to be boring and the same each time. After s few times he turns and walks back to bed when I go in anyway so then I don't say it anymore. I just go in, and put the duvet over him when he's laid down. The first few times I also have to walk him back holding his hand or guiding him by his shoulder, but again after a few times that's no longer needed either. I am told the key is to do as little, do the same each time, and not react or interact. And be as boring as possible! Apparently.

Sounds like you're doing it right. Dull and boring. And it sounds like he is responding. But there's no denying that it's tough. The books imply that it will work quickly. The truth is IME that it actually takes a couple of weeks, plus backslidings a every few months. At least the backslidings only take a few, less painful nights to fix!

I've done CC, shush-pat, and RR. CC had the fastest results, but I never did it a second time. It felt too wrong, too harsh. Shush-pat and RR are much gentler, even if they are slower.

At least you can reassure yourself that you have an assertive, independent ds who thinks for himself!

Thanks theyremad, that's really helpful. I think I was feeling dishearten because with cc things were significantly better after 3 nights, and this wasn't feeling like that, but then it is much gentler so I guess will take longer. And DH is back and it's so so much easier with 2 doing it and swapping. Hope you are getting good sleep now!

The Morherhood Mantra: "This, too, will pass."

Sorry, wrong thread

But actually quite applicable!

Hahaha swimming, very appropriate here!