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Sleep

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Original poster

manipulative 8mo

19 replies

FindingNormal · 20/01/2016 20:15

She's not is she? My baby is not manipulative, she's just shit at sleeping and finds comfort in her mum and dad. I've had 2 people today tell me that I "need to" let her cry otherwise she'll wrap me round her little finger. I call bullshit. Can someone reassure me that a breastfed baby will learn to sleep on her own without me leaving her to cry? I'm knackered, I want to sleep, I want her to sleep; but I don't want her to cry her eyes out.

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RookieMonster · 20/01/2016 20:17

An eight month old needs her parents. She's not being manipulative. Ignore the peanut gallery!

DartmoorDoughnut · 20/01/2016 20:17

She'll sleep just as you've reached breaking point, they're sneaky these babies! but yes I call bullshit too.

lovefairylights · 20/01/2016 20:21

Trust yourself - of course an 8 month old isn't manipulative.
Some are tricky sleepers - I have a two year old that finds it hard to go to sleep on her own. Yes I have spent the last 2 years cuddling her to sleep but I wouldn't give up those 10/15 minute cuddles for the world. She is a happy secure little girl and does not manipulate me even now - she just isn't ready to go to sleep on her own yet. I am not worried that I will be cuddling her forever...

LottieDoubtie · 20/01/2016 20:22

yep, total bullshit. She is not capable of manipulating you. She may be capable of learning better habits - depends on what you have done so far/her personality... BUT that absolutely doesn't have to mean leaving her to cry if that isn't want you want to do.

FATEdestiny · 20/01/2016 20:22

Not manipulative.

You may need to actively teach your baby to sleep on her own, it doesn't have to involve crying if you have plenty of time and patience to offer.

Original poster

FindingNormal · 20/01/2016 20:27

To be honest I've gone with the path of least resistance so far and feed her to sleep. Rod for my own back blah blah blah and yes I probably do need to invest time and patience to help her learn better habits. Not sure how to do this though, any suggestions? She is a lively wilful little personality and is very mobile- crawling standing etc. Getting her to lie down in the cot so I can pat/shush etc is a battle in itself.

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Crumpet1 · 20/01/2016 20:30

At 8 months old she just needs the comfort of her parents. She'll be easier to teach to settle herself as she gets older, I think my boy was about 13 months by the time he was sleeping in his cot on his own. If you are happy to feed her to sleep then I'd just go with it. Ignore what other people say and follow your motherly instinct.

BendydickCuminsnatch · 20/01/2016 20:31

Finding my 7 month old stands, crawls in the cot too. Lots of bumped heads. We're shh patting for naps (with lots of guidance from FATE ), can take up to an hour but he's getting better. Night time he self settles but naps are taking a lot of work.

katienana · 20/01/2016 20:36

Do you sleep alone for 12 hours straight? Or do you wake up, change position, have a drink, go for a wee, hear a funny noise, sometimes struggle to switch off after a busy or upsetting day? Why should an 8 month old be any different. My tip is just do the discuss sleep with anyone you will rarely get sensible advice or even the sympathy you're actually looking for!

Original poster

FindingNormal · 20/01/2016 20:36

thanks everyone. She's got a cold at the moment and is in a 'leap' (are the wonder weeks a load of crap too?) so the sleep is particularly rubbish this last week.
Bendy oh for a self settle in a night time! I would take the shit napping if she would self settle at night (gives me an excuse as to why the house is a state)

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FATEdestiny · 20/01/2016 20:36

yes I probably do need to invest time and patience to help her learn better habits. Not sure how to do this though, any suggestions?

Well, there is the Pantley Pulloff from the No Cry Sleep Solution. Or the simple dummy is, in my view, the easiest of no crying sleep solutions.

Very gentle gradual withdrawal is also about not creating any level of distress or upset if done slowly enough (it can be speeded up and involve crying though).

These things take a long time though - hence me saying time and patience are needed. If you want to teach her this skill in a gentle, kind way involving no crying then accept that it may take many years months until she is going to sleep independently.

Have some realistic expectations. If you do nothing, she should be able to learn to sleep independently by school age. If you gentle sleep train with no distress or crying, it might take you a 6-18 months from now (depending on your child, could be longer) unti sleeping independently.

lenibose · 20/01/2016 20:37

Agree with PP. Not manipulative. But like everything else sleeping well is something you have to teach her. There might be a few tears along the way but there is no need to let her cry it out. We did a VERY gradual retreat method. First we had a very solid unbending 'night routine'. Co-slept for a year but by 8 months post feed I would tuck DS in say night night and sit and see what happened. If he got distressed, tuck in, say night night and stroke back. It took a while (never the magical 3 nights) but he learned to put himself to sleep. I always stayed in the room but minimal interaction. Eventually he learned to sleep and I would leave when he was sleepy. For a brief while he held my hand while sleeping but again gradually we broke that habit. Post age 3 all he needs is to be tucked in, night night and he goes to sleep entirely independently. We achieved that sans any major trauma. He was moved to a cot in our room at a year once he has learned to put himself to sleep. Again there was 10 mins of resistance on night 1. I stroked his back. 3 mins on night 2 and that was it. We lived in a small London flat so he stayed in our room till he was 3. Transferred seamlessly to his own room. Now sleeps on a different floor and as I said is a very independent sleeper. It is fine to do what you want as long as it is working for YOU.

Original poster

FindingNormal · 20/01/2016 20:37

Come on fate share the magic beans

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BendydickCuminsnatch · 20/01/2016 20:38

Oh I mean he self-settles at bedtime but we're still getting up in the night - first wake up we feed to sleep and 2nd wake up we feed then co-sleep til morning. But omg yes I am glad it's this way round! You poor thing. My house is a tip still though!

Original poster

FindingNormal · 20/01/2016 20:49

Going to try the pantley pull off and see where that gets us- thanks fate. I really am committed to finding the best way for her- I don't want to be boobing her when she's 15.

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Original poster

FindingNormal · 20/01/2016 20:50

Oh- and have tried switching boob for dummy and no deal. She spits it out in disgust and roots for the boob.

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FATEdestiny · 20/01/2016 21:01

Come on fate share the magic beans

What are you after?

I did very similar to lenibose. Gradual Withdrawal as an over-riding parenting ethos from birth. As in I planned to always give my baby enough reassurance and comfort to not need to cry at bedtime at all, but always with a view to eventual independent sleeping.

She was about 12/13 months when she got to the point where I could put in cot (with dummy and blankie) and she would go from fully awake to asleep alone without making a sound.

She has never, ever cried at bedtime - so this was teaching a baby to go to sleep without me leaving her to cry. It took about a year to achieve, and that is from birth so without any pesky 'bad habits' (BF to sleep is not necessarily a bad habit, it depends on your view and if this is a problem to you, or not)

Oh- and have tried switching boob for dummy and no deal. She spits it out in disgust and roots for the boob.

Yeah, they do that. Definitely worth the perseverance though.

However 8 months old may be too late to introduce a dummy so you may have missed the boat there.

If baby likes to suck to go to sleep you could try encouraging her to suck on a blanket or toy comforter? Otherwise, unless you go the very, very, very slow route, you are likely to encounter some crying as she falls asleep without a nipple plugging her mouth.

Original poster

FindingNormal · 20/01/2016 21:08

Sorry the magic beans post was a X post with your precious advice- wasn't asking for more!! Sadly we gave her a dummy early doors which she loved for a while and then just suddenly decided wasn't for her. Same with her thumb- sucked it obsessively for about a month (and would settle herself this way) then one day that was that. No more thumb.

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LottieDoubtie · 20/01/2016 21:26

I don't have any magic advice either (sorry).

I did lots of shhing, patting and giving a dummy for naps when DS was much younger than 8MO, and I was fantastically lucky in that he learnt to self sooth (with a dummy) by about 4/5 months- although still with me in the room, I gradually went through phases with getting out the room once he was 6 months- so I read to him for awhile, then I would read my own book out loud in a reassuring voice for awhile, then I sat on my tablet/phone playing him music and reading MN, then I tried leaving the room with the music on and then finally we ditched the music- this process took months though was achieved with minimal crying (I always picked him up if he got upset, and again I was lucky, this wasn't often). It 'helped' that BFing didnt work out so we had no tradition of falling asleep feeding- that isn't a recommendation, I'd take successful BFing over sleep myself!

Once he got to six months I always did the nighttime bottle downstairs about 20 mins before bedtime to try and dissociate it from sleep- I guess you could do this with the BF but it might be (a lot) harder!

Sorry all thats not particularly relevant to you- but I can only talk about my limited experience. It is largely luck though and I'm convinced there is no 'right' answer. Just think about what you want to achieve, what's important in your house and play the long game to get it to happen!

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