bringing 5mo breastfed baby's bedtime forward

[folkhead]

Hi all. My second baby is now 5 months and breastfeeds on and off all evening until nearly 10pm when she's finally had her fill and will fall asleep enough to be put in her cot. I'd really love her to go to bed earlier as I'm sure she's overtired (doesn't nap properly either). She then sleeps for 12 hours (with 3-5 feeds overnight.) I don't want to leave her to cry and wouldn't anyway as my toddler goes to bed at 7 and might be woken up. She's in a cot in our room but will hopefully move to her own next month. I seem to be feeding every hour in the day and so can't see how I can bring her 'evening' feeds any earlier. Any advice please?

Try an give a bottle, either ebm or f at 7/8 ish? Both of mine cluster fed in the evenings but with ds it stopped at around 3 months and I'm still waiting on dd as she's only 9 weeks. 3-5 feeds over night sounds like an awful lot at 5 months alongside feeding every hour in the day. How long are her feeds? My dd is a whirl of over tiredness in the evening if she hasn't slept well in the day, how are her naps? How do you do naps? Does she have a dummy?

Thank you so much for your reply. She doesn't really nap at all in the day, even in the car. She'll fall asleep while feeding, but wake up once she falls off the boob. To be honest I haven't pushed a nap routine because we're out most days with my toddler. She doesn't use a dummy (I guess I am it!) and hasn't taken a bottle yet. We did controlled crying with my eldest at 11 months but I'd like to avoid it this time if I can. I'd just love a bit of time in the evenings to eat dinner etc without having to feed constantly!

Forgot to say, I'd be happy to introduce a formula feed as my husband could give it when I take the toddler to bed, but I suspect our problem isn't entirely due to needing food but comfort feeding?

I would guess she's comfort feeding too. Have you been out in the evening yet-so not there to comfort feed on IYSWIM? I'd try and introduce some sort of nap routine and get your dh to try with a bottle. I know that the advice is to have all sleeps with you until 6 months but I'm sure we just disturbed ds when he was downstairs with us (which we carried on doing until he was 6 months anyway- we were just quiet)so maybe move her upstairs to sleep in the evening??

Oh my God, how are you even alive? Hats off to you for sustaining that. I imagine she must be using you as a snack bar/endless cuddler and I bet her life is just lovely but how are you?
Listen, I don't know, but could you not just gradually try to extend the intervals between feeds? My ebf baby gets fed whenever he asks but that's only about 8 times a day and he often forgets to wake up in the night. However, when he does feed, my breasts are full, and he generally empties both. I know from pumping that he would be taking 120-150ml each time and that generally seems to sustain him for 2.5 to 3 hrs.

We were going to bed with our 6 week old at 10pm but we decided to put a routine in place (not a scary gina ford routine, just a sequence of events). So at 6.20 we now start the bath, then she goes up to bed and we shut the curtains together and say goodnight to the sun (which has gone anyway!) then I feed her, lots of breast compressions to get as much in as possible, both boobs etc. She tries to fall asleep at the breast so I then pop her up and read her a v quick soothing story (goodnight moon is good), then I hold her with white noise and sing a bit (dream a little dream is the current favourite). She falls asleep on me and then I hold her for 10 mins, then transfer her to the crib and sneak out. Most nights she goes down first time, sometimes I have to pop up and settle her/hold her for another 10 mins. I've noticed she now associates the white noise with sleep during the day now too.

Thank you all for replying, I really appreciate it. As I write this, I'm feeding her in my bedroom ... She actually seemed to self settle in her cot half an hour ago, but she woke up and cried so I'm now feeding her again. (I did try cuddling/ rocking her but that didn't cut it!) Part of the problem is that we're trying to fit around my toddler's bedtime so I need to think of a routine that works for both. Maybe a bottle will help. It's just pretty exhausting!

Was your toddler as high maintenance as your baby is now? If so, how did you handle that?
I'm absolutely no expert, but I'd say you might have two issues, in that she nurses so often that she only ever has "snacks" and so is maybe never deeply "full" (maybe missing out on hindmilk a bit too?)
and is also very used to the comfort of a nice warm breast to snuggle onto.
I'd say a bottle might well help, and someone else to give it to her. I notice my husband and any minder get on better giving a bottle than I do. He knows I have better things to offer and while he will take a bottle, is quite likely to break off and start chewing my shirt instead.
I wonder if a soother would also help? I never ever wanted to use one but it does help us. It seems to do what the name suggests, soothes when it's a little comforting that is required as opposed to more feeding. And we don't need it much, it's not permanently glued to his face!

Sorry no advice but watching as my baby is the same - although much younger (1month) so I'm happy to put up with it for now, but want to think about a bedtime routine before too long.