trying cc (ish)

[Nouseforausername]

We're getting to our wits end with our 16mo ds. We're trying the jo frost version, go in after 2 mins then doubling etc, we're up to 20 minutes snd hes grizzling so much, i dont think im strong enough to do it , what if he's crying because he wants more milk and he's still hungry?
hes never been a great sleeper. 1 nap in the day for between 1 and 3 hours which is brill but usually at least 1 night wake.
this really feels so horrible to be leaving him cry like this

also whats the longest you've left your dcs for?

and is there anyone its not worked for? hes in his cot stood up shaking the bars of the cot

At 16 months and assuming he eats fine during the day I very much doubt it's because he's hungry. Assume he's not teething or got a cold?

Is he able to self settle ie does he go to sleep on his own at bedtime? Do you think he's got into a habit of needing you in order to go to sleep?

My experience was that CC worked well for DD at 5 months to get rid of rock to sleep and at 8 months to get rid of the final night feed (which I was sure was just habit). However it hasn't worked to solve DD's frequent night wakings as a toddler. I think with hindsight, that's because her toddler night wakings have been more due to teething or having a cold and she's a light sleeper so gets woken by those every time. CC won't help with that.

However if your toddler has never learned to self settle and is waking because of that rather than because of any teething etc, then I think CC probably will help. I think it works well at changing "sleep associations" and teaching them they can go to sleep without you. But you do need to be consistent and stick with it. If you don't it's confusing for them and you've done it all for nothing... Your 2 minutes then doubling sounds ok to me.

Best of luck and have some

he settles for his daytime naps its just night time, he was having a bottle then going down dozy and settling with a bit of rubbing. hes just had a bit of a poorly week with an allergic reaction so had been soothing and sleeping on us but has been bad since getting better.
surely cc is and them getting to the point of falling asleep exhausted from crying doesn't help. We're 1.5 hours in and he seens to have gone off 4 minutes since the last settle down.
do you ever set a max limit like 20 mins then go in? or has it got to an hour for anyone?
sorry for all the q's

hmm ok sounds Like he'd got used to the cuddles and isn't keen to give them up. I kind of had different limits depending on how distressed she sounded - just whinging then I'd leave a long time but full on crying much shorter like 5 minutes. hard to remember exactly!

slept through the night and seems cheery this morning like all is forgiven. heres hoping tonight goes smoother

sometimes in the day you can hear him babbling to his teddy. he gets left unless he cries so i can clean and get dinner on. think we're going to set a max time if he's bawling

I'm interested in this. My dd (7months) is a howler. I would happily leave her if she whinged but she's a full on screamer, tears, sobbing the lot. Am I still meant to not go in before the set time or pick her up to calm her down? I've tried calming her down in the cot but she just carries on screaming with waterfalls coming out of her eyes :( if someone can tell me this is normal and it'll get better then I'll carry on but I've yet to meet another parent with a baby who reacts this way.

That was my ds last night. he knows full well how to throw a tantrum as when you go in he laughs..... last night was 1.5 hours of in and out. Today i got home at 8.30 and dp said he only went in once at 2 mins and quiet since

Oh dear!
My mum keeps telling me my dd has a right temper but can this really be true at 7 months? I admit she knows how to cry and prob doesn't like that she's being put in the cot to sleep rather than being rocked but I'm not sure she's that clever to be able to turn the tears on just so I'll pick her up?!

Of course she's not manipulating you, she's a baby. They cry if they need something, that something may be comfort, hence stopping when you pick them up. As for laughing when you enter the room; it's a survival instinct to make you friendly towards them when they're scared.
In answer to how long have others left a baby to cry-I haven't.

I hate CC (as you may have gathered!) but what I know of it is the time limit is quite short, I think you're meant to check them every five minutes minimum because as I say, they cry for a reason and may be in pain, hot/cold etc

It's also too much like hard work!

stolensleep.com/2014/09/27/how-to-get-your-baby-to-sleep-through-the-night-in-just-two-years/

Setting a max time is a bad idea. He's just learning that if he cries for long enough, you'll come i.e. you're teaching him to cry for longer and longer periods of time. This timing business makes me . I've read Ferber (and happily used some of his ideas) but the logic of the timing is simply this: you're trying to maximise the probability of your child falling asleep alone, while still checking on them. Ferber thinks that if your child doesn't fall asleep alone - literally without you in the room - then they won't be able to self settle alone when they naturally rouse in the night.

While I found his ideas really useful in some ways, and used them to night wean DD, that makes no sense to me. My intuition told me that if DD felt safe and secure in her room, that she would feel happier on her own in it. This takes more time to build but I think is an easier goal to work towards as a parent because it's nurturing. Leaving her alone crying I thought would make things harder. And I didn't want her ever to be quiet because she'd just given up on me coming.

So in 23 months we have never ever left her to cry. That sounds dire! except she's slept through fairly consistently since we night weaned at 10mo. Oh, she cried! but we held her, talked to her, stayed with her, offered her water instead of the beloved milk. She fell asleep a few times through exhaustion, I'm sure, but she wasn't alone. I spent a month gradually cutting her milk down (no crying during that period), then once we were at almost nothing, offered her water. That's when she cried - she was so tired and frustrated and just wanted to sleep. Anyway she was sleeping through in three nights.

The other thing about going in and out is it's so bloody stimulating for them. They're just waiting to see when you come back!

today, bed at 8, quiet by 14 past.

Hope tonight's going well for you!

I'm also trying CC (my baby's only 7 months) and she seems to be coping well with it so far. The worst bits are the night (or really early morning) wakings.

What did you mean by max time? As in before you give in and pick them up/feed to sleep or before you go in and soothe them by rubbing their chest etc.

I always thought CC never advocated just leaving them to cry, you're supposed to keep going in. At the moment I'm doing intervals of 3 mins, 5, 8, 10 and then sticking at 10. I never pick her up though, just go in, pat her chest and stroke her cheek until she calms, and then leave for another ten minutes.

First night she cried on and off for a LONG TIME, last night she only cried for less than an hour, so I THINK it's working. I might be doing CC completely wrong though. Fingers crossed for tonight - let me know how yours goes!

yeah sorry i meant max time as in they say double the goings in. 2mins then 4,8,16,32 do you just do that each time? we made our longest 16 mins on the first night and its been the only time its gone that long.
what happens when they're poorly and need cuddles, do you have to start the 'training' all over again?

I wouldn't call it training. I would call it going back to the routine. But yes, after illness, or jet lag, or a trip away, or whatever it is, you do have to recommit yourself to them sleeping alone and in their cot, without milk or rocking or whatever their poison is

But I've found that DD is pretty smart about recognising the signals we give her that that's the case (i.e. getting back into her recognisable routine - bath, jammies, milk, stories, bed, I talk through the day and sing her a song). Not to mention understanding explanations from about 15mo (or perhaps before, but that was when I could recognise her understanding).

I think the problem with the max time is the same in either case. They learn that it will be an interval before you come back and they wait and wait for that, crying to let you know that they're waiting. And they learn the pattern but it's not reassuring (which is the whole rationale). If it were, they wouldn't cry!

To be clear, I'm not saying don't do CC or CIO - your child, your choice, of course. I'm just trying to get to the logic that underpins it. I remember what it feels like to be driven half mad by trying 85 different things and not knowing what was working or not, and why.

We've stuck to a ten minute maximum - she just tries to put herself to sleep and then cries when she can't do it. Usually when we have to do ten minutes we go in and she's on her front and can't roll back, which is why she's crying for us.