Just a phase ? Time to change ?

[didireallysaythat]

DS2 is 3, almost 4, years old and falls asleep by around 9-10pm most nights. Usually wakes once or twice in the night but often around 5am. Has to be woken at 8am. No naps during the day. I'd like an earlier bed time if possible - at 9:45 tonight he wanted to know why trains have whistles not horns. Ten seconds later he was out sparko. Been like this for a year or more now.

I know we're lucky because we are getting sleep but the tired tantrums are awful, and to be honest I'm dreading our holiday next week as I just want to curl up and catch up on my sleep.

So suggestions on a bed time routine (including application of Valium) gratefully received... Or encouragement that this is just a phase and he'll grow out of it by the time he's a teenager ??

What does he do all day? I have two at 3 and they are outside all day. They go out after breakfast, they come in for lunch, still have an hour or twos nap sometimes, back outside after till tea time, in for tea, back out for another hour or so then bed for 7 - pick their own pajamas and get a story or two, sleeping by 7.30ish.

He's at nursery from 9-5. They go out for a walk for an hour or so each day normally plus his room is learning how to ride their bikes (the nursery is on a campus so acres of lawns, forests, lakes etc). The room also has an outside play space. When he gets home he usually plays in the garden for 30+ mins while I cook (supper 7-7:30).

Sleeping by 7:30 sounds lovely. Here its 9:30-10:00 and then I go to bed at 10 !!

I don't know then, I let mine play out in all weathers as long as they are dressed for it but MiL keeps them in if its raining or snowing (which in Scotland is all the time) and I notice their energy levels are higher for longer and their behaviour deteriorates when she does this. Trampoline??

What happens when you put him to bed earlier? At like 8 pm for example.
I have a nearly 4 year old son and his bed time varies from 730 to 930. He has always been a very good sleeper so I know it might differ but here is our routine. Diner 630-7, then bath then before bed I make him calm down,watch a cartoon, then he has a story ( he tries to talk a lot during the story, wants to know about everything. A mixture of curiosity and delaying bedtime. The rule is now if he interrupts I stop the story) and then I leave him in his bed with a picture book and he falls asleep looking at pictures in his bed.

I know its hard my 7 months old is the worst sleeper, Im doing everything people are telling me to do but he still wakes up all the time, all that to say there is no right or wrong but at nearly 4 years old you can explain to him that bed is at whatever time you choose. That if he tantrums you will punish him (take away a car he likes, no bed time story whatever you deem is right) and he should get the message.

When its weekends I sometimes let my son stay up and have diner with us and play around but week days I make it no later than 830 or he gets so tired, and turns into a little tantrum monster. When he has slept well he is the sweetest boy.

Hope this helps... good luck !xx

If we put him in his room earlier, teeth, milj , books and then leave he just gets up and goes down stairs to play ! Sometimes we hold onto the door handle so he can't get out but he screams abs kicks at the door - 30 mins plus is our record !

Its just a phase. We will come out the other side as his brother sleep OK (10 - 6) without too much trouble most nights !

Thats really tough..How about bribery? Sorry if I offend anyone on here, but it works great for me.
Ex: if you dont eat your vegetables you won't get desert.
So if you get out of your room, Im calling santa and telling him you're not being a good boy.
Anyway something he loves, you say you will take it away if he doesn't obey you. It works really well with my son. Its hard because when he doesn't obey you actually have to follow through. I have confiscated lightening Mcqueen so many times now.. But he gets the message and when he is good I give it back. And vice versa if for 1 week he goes to bed and stays in bed when you tell him too, you could tell him you will get him a car/ stickers/ spiderman socks something small that would make him happy.

Would he respond to that?

Bribery might work. He does have a rather amusing habit of then saying he doesn't want whatever you've just taken away ! Tried last night with the fish and chips bribe but failed horribly. Said he didn't want them. Then he didn't want anyone else to have them. Had to force him into the car seat (not my finest hour), left him in the car screaming while I went to get them, then didn't want them in the car, didn't want to get out of the car and then didn't want the rest of us to eat either !! He's stubborn. Like his mother ! But I might try bribery - stickers won't cut it (completely failed when potty training - he just decided one day not to wear a nappy and that was that) but I can probably think if something else.

I really do appreciate the advice - sometimes its just another line of attack that you need !