3 YO has NEVER self settled, huge issues getting her to sleep at night, help!

[Reastie]

DD has never aside from when she was a newborn self settled herself to sleep. We have always walked her in the buggy to sleep, she's napped in the car seat or she bf to sleep until about 6 months ago when we managed to stop this. Now she will only go to sleep if DH or I lie in bed with her and then it's a struggle (she has a double bed).

We're reaching crisis point in that she won't even go to sleep then. It's like there's a switch in her head and she won't go to sleep until this is flicked and then suddenly she will settle and go down.

In recent weeks she's been kicking DH instead of going to sleep and has generally been doing everything she can to not go to sleep. We ignore and lie there and tell her it's sleep time but sometimes it works and sometimes it doesn't.

It's been getting progressively worse to the point we're now often taking an hour or so to get her to sleep. She usually goes to sleep around 8pm so this is just getting me down as I'm pretty much going to bed straight after we get her to sleep and getting no time to myself or with DH.

Last night we just didn't know what to do. We spent an hour lying with her in her room to get her to sleep and it wasn't working, so DH lay with DD in the spare room (thought another bed might help [grasping at straws]) which didn't work and she was kicking DH so she ended out in bed with me chatting to me for about half an hour about goodness knows what until finally she decided to go to sleep and then that was it, she was sleeping. It all took well over 2 hours though.

We are at the end of our tether and have no idea what to do or where to go. We were planning to do a gradual withdrawal from her room as she was settling with us in her bed, and for a while had got so far as to sit next to her on the bed or on a chair next to her bed, but now I'm not sure whether to go for the self settle on her own without us in the room or what. Help!

Ok no personal experience of this but... does she still nap in the day? And what time does she wake in the morning? She sounds like she's not very tired at bedtime...

AFAIK with gradual retreat the next move after chair by the bed would be chair inside the room by the door, then chair outside the door with door open, then outside with door shut.

no she doesn't nap. She wakes up any time from 6 - 8 (usually around 6:30 - 7)

Watching with interest, my DD is 3 next week and is doing this which is made doubly annoying as I am also still rocking my DS 16 months to sleep (I know I know but I'm a single parent and have got myself into a right mess doing this)

"It's like there's a switch in her head and she won't go to sleep until this is flicked and then suddenly she will settle and go down."

Maybe she just isn't sleepy when you put her to bed?

When is her bedtime?

At 3, she is old enough to understand that mummy is right behind the door and will come if she needs her etc. Sleep tight, here's a teddy to keep you company as you sleep, lights off, goodbye.

Some tears are unavoidable, but be consistent and she should get the message soon. I can't believe you have lived like this for 3 years and nobody can blame you for wanting a change.

bedtime is at pm Cote* and she wakes around 6.30-7 usually. No nap. So seems unlikely she isn't tired (though agree that was my first thought).

Is it possible it's the reverse and she is overtired by 8pm? Is she a bit hyper at bedtime - lots of running around and giggling with the occasional meltdown? If so then you might want to try an earlier bedtime.

Otherwise - I agree with Cote that you may need to try a firm line approach - bedtime story then cuddle, night night lights out, leave. Rapid return if she gets up. May take a lot of patience...

Gah. 8pm.

Well, we've tried her earlier to bed but it makes things alot worse and she ends out going to sleep later than usual

We are now just deciding whether to do gradual withdraw (which we haven't really got very far with in the months we've been attempting it and tbh we've actually gone backwards now) or just shut the door and leave her, but aren't sure how to handle the shut the door and leave her to get on with it. Should we shut the door so she can't get out? Should we let her cry herself to sleep if this happens? What if she refuses to go to sleep? How long might it take? All these thoughts scare me, and we're on holiday in a month so maybe should leave it until after then...I don't know......

Why don't you wake her at the same time every day? So set her body clock. Having a 90 mins window of when she wakes won't help.

Also the weather is getting warmer here plus it is lighter of an evening so this will not help!
Is her room pitch black?

I would try sitting on the bed while she sleeps. Just tell her to lie down and go to sleep in a boring voice.

As for leaving the room - what you could do is tell her you're going out for the loo for 5 mins and will come right back. Then do exactly that (obviously don't have to go to the loo!). Do that for a few nights. Then as she gets used to you leaving and coming back, extend the time by a little bit and a little bit. Leave her with a dim night light so she doesn't feel scared.

Sorry for delayed response. Last night was a bad night for getting DD to sleep again

We tried waking her at the same time for a week (7:10) a few weeks ago but she got really really grouchy and over tired and many meltdowns. We generally now don't let her go beyond 7:30 if left to her own devices (but she's often awake earlier)

We sit or lie on the bed with her and say in a boring voice to go to sleep. She tries talking to us and we ignore her. Sometimes we say we're making a tea or something and will be back soon and she just runs out of the bed and around upstairs laughing until we come back. It feels like if she doesn't want to go to sleep we are at her mercy

Last night we just didn't know what to do. She didn't seem tired but had been rubbing her eyes etc earlier. She ended out getting in bed with me and finally going to sleep there, but I realise this is a bad habit. We were just desperate and tired and didn't know what to do.

I've introduced a reward chart where if she has more ticks than crosses every week the next week we will do a fun trip out. I have no idea if this will help. Last night she just kept saying 'can i go to X?' and I was replying 'if you are a good girl and go to sleep' which she understood but it didn't actually help her go to sleep....argh

Could DD be persuaded to lie still and listen to an audio book? Story tapes worked on me when I was a nipper, I always drifted off before the end.

She sounds like my DS. At 7, he had never self settled, not even as an infant. Kicking, wriggling, chatting, singing, toilet, drinks, anything we thought to help him avoid sleeping.
It could take up to 90 minutes to get him to sleep , and without firm encouragement he would still be up by 11pm even at 2 or 3 years old.
---He was diagnosed with ADHD a few months ago, and is now on Medication. Changed child.
It may be that she has an underlying problem?

we've tried audio books too another

ADHD fee , had never considered that. I don't perceive her to have any of the other traits, but will have a look online to find out more.