What happens to a baby who doesn't nap in the day?

[marsup]

I've tried the 'window of opportunity' of 1-2 hours of waking (plus black-out curtains, white noise, dummy, swaddling) and my baby doesn't want to nap anywhere except in his wilkinet papouse. Has anyone tried the opposite technique - exhaustion? what happens if we just don't take him out in the wilinet one day and let him stay up, only put him down when he cries? will he eventually drop off and learn how to? nb he is only 12 wks old and I know he needs naps. Please don't accuse me of mistreatment without knowing that I have tried rocking him to sleep and this no longer works unless I do increasingly violent movements. I do stay in his room stroking his head to try to get him to sleep. Anyway I guess someone will accuse me of mistreatment in any case - but does anyone know what happens to a baby who doesn't sleep at all in the daytime?

Have you tried the baby whisperer? There is a thread on it somewhere under sleeping.

What aBOUT gf?

Both of mine have had periods of several days where they have had no daytime naps, from about 7 or 8 weeks onwards. ds now 30 weeks, sometimes has a daytime nap, sometimes doesn't. That's just the way they are. I've had hv going on at me several times but have learnt to ignore it. Is your baby happy?

Have you tried waiting two hours after waking, putting him in cot with dummy and lovely and warm, and then going downstairst to make a cup of tea, ignoring any protests. If he isn't asleep, make a quick phone call to your mum/sister/best friend with kids. If still not asleep, go and try again or get him up depending on your feelings/instinct? My ds needs to be alone to sleep in his cot, and when small always yelled briefly before going off. I think babies will sleep eventually - in the car or pushchair usually, which is good if you are out and about. Or even on your lap. But I do know what it is like to crave a couple of hours of child-free peace in your own home.

You have a crap day

Mine (ds3)was hthe same at 12 weeks

I think the prob is that you remember the other babies sleeping when in reality they didnt and you had lots of time to carry them

is this number2?

My son never slept during the day til about 8 mths old and that was via a touch of tough love from my mum, he was also a nightmare at night
He grew up sweet beautiful big and strong and exceptionally clever - one ed psych said some kids don;t sleep, they have more important things to think about!
Try not to worry too much, he will learn one day
Sorry for being no help at all...

I've got one like that too. His older brothers both slept for a couple of hours morning and afternoon so DS3 is a BIG shock.

He is 6 months (as of yesterday, where has the time gone??) and up until about 10 days ago would sleep for no more than 1 hour during the day, sometimes all in one go but mostly little 5-10 power-naps here and there. He's now having a couple of hours in one sleep and than a few 10-20 minute naps. I haven't a clue what changed to make him do this, maybe food, maybe just getting bigger....I have no idea.

The only thing that happened here when he didn't sleep was that by 7pm he would be sooooooooooooo tired I was able to put him to bed, even when he was still awake without hardly any protests and thats a real novelty as DS1+2 would never do that and had to be rocked to sleep or fall asleep downstairs until at least 18 months.

I think Kiwibird hit the nail on the head.....some babies just have better things to do, my young man is the nosiest baby I've ever encountered and cranes his neck to investigate to slightest noise or object. Sleep was the last thing he wanted to do.

Ooh, sounds like dd. Only napped in car/pram/my arms. In the evening she'd take about an hour to go to sleep, with us rocking and feeding and leaving her to cry for a bit and going back again when that didn't work, and feeding some more...

I tried not getting her to have a nap once or twice (ie not taking her out in the pram etc). She'd still have a 5 minute nap at the end of every feed (every 90 minutes ) but wake up when I put her down. But by the end of the day she was completely distraught. Obviously just got more and more tired as the day wore on, till at bedtime she was sooo stressed that it took a couple of hours of hysterical crying before she'd sleep (and have a very disturbed night).

I did controlled crying at 5 months to get her to have daytime naps in her cot. Before then we used a baby swing.

Why not try it and see for a day or two? You've nothing to lose....
But IME when my baby didn't nap he became very cranky and unhappy. I know this because whenever I gave up in despair with his naps, by the end of the day I would be thinking 'oh yes, THAT'S why I'm putting such a lot of effort into this'. he would also tend to doze on the breast for long periods.
In the end I sleep trained (left him to cry it out) at about 4-5 months. It worked (also helped as he got older by being on solids and becoming generally mroe settled as a result) and he became very easy to put down in his cot for two great naps a day, and a much happier babe. I do have to say that weeks 10-16 approx were probably the most miserable time I had with him though.

kiwisbird is right!

My DS (2.5) is exactly the same. Would only sleep if in pram/cot/car and at night we had to rock him to sleep. I know how tough it is and how draining it can be getting now time to yourself. If you keep him up he will just get really overtired I think.

not much help but I think you have to try and do what you can then try controlled crying when he's older. the baby whispering book is good too because the types of babies are very interesting and different ways of dealing with them.

If you read the sleep advice section in any good baby book, like The Baby Whisperer etc. you'll see all sorts of advice about how to change sleep associations. Your little one obviously associates sleep with his carrier and you need to change that mental habit in order for him to sleep where you want him to. The fact that he does sleep in the carrier seems to suggest he needs a nap. I could never have left dd napless at that age, she'd have been totally exhausted and her night sleep would have suffered as a result. I'm a firm believer in the saying 'the more they sleep the more they sleep.'

marsup - have you tried rocking him to sleep in his pram? - I'm assuming when you say you've tried rocking him you mean in your arms, by the way. that's the only way to get ds to sleep at the mo without feeding him to sleep. I'm working on trying to stop rocking just before he drops off, and hopefully I'll be able to rock less and less.

Or have you tried a dummy? Or, and this may be controversial - have you tried putting him on his belly?

Message withdrawn

Will he sleep in his pram? The only way we could ever get ds to sleep in the daytime was if he was "strapped down" (that make me sound a very cruel mum, doesn't it?) in a pram or a car seat. Ever since he sussed out how to roll - at all of 8 weeks - he'd just never keep still enough for long enough to have any chance of dropping off unless he was actually provented from going anywhere by being strapped in.

It's just the way he is though. He doesn't seem to need anything like the average amount of sleep. It is tough when everything you say tells you that they "should" be sleeping a certain amount, and you've got one who doesn't conform. At the end of the day you can provide they environment, create the conditions, follow the routines, whatever..... but you can't MAKE them sleep. I actually felt a lot more relaxed about ds's non-conformist sleeping habit once I'd accepted that I couldn't change the way he was.

There's a bit in "Toddler Taming" about babies who don't need much sleep which puts a positive spin on it when it says they'll "probably grow up to be prime ministers or leaders of industry". Whether that's what you want for your child is a diferent question of course....

Thanks so much for the supportive messages, everyone. I'm a bit scared about what I say on mumsnet these days as a result of another thread! DS is my first and I always wanted 2 but now think he may be my only child. DH is much calmer about things though, and I am probably overreacting during to some weird combination of hormones - who knows. Anyway we don't have a car but every time we have taken DS in one he has screamed. He used to scream in his pram too but now if we keep walking continuously he will have small naps in between periods of crying and periods of wakefulness. He does get very wretched quite quickly when he doesn't sleep. When he is not exhausted he is extremely curious about the world and stares/peers/listens avidly, which I think is part of the problem.

It is very reassuring to know that other people have had the same problem. Otherwise it feels like a personal failure of some kind.

Anyway we have decided to do outings in the morning and work at the afternoon nap. Today I fed him to sleep (naughty, I know, but hey when you're desperate) and it lasted for 20 mins.

My friend from my antenatal class had a DD who was like this and "nothing" bad happened to her -she just looked a bit tired!

However when my friend went back to work, the childminder managed quite quickly to get the little girl to take a nap in her cot in the middle of the day - something my friend had long given up on. So don't despair, just because he doesn't nap in the day now, doesn't mean he never will.

So if he doesn't sleep at all in the daytime, I doubt that anything very bad will happen to him.

Oh I forgot to add - several people have mentioned introducing solids as a way of getting babies to sleep better, and I met someone else who said solids helped her son with colic, but I wonder if 12 weeks isn't too young as DS is quite small for his age (2 weeks preterm) and probably has an immature digestive system...?

and stop using words like 'naughty' and 'failure' to describe yourself!! It will only make you feel much worse. Sometimes you just have to ride with events, and if feeding makes your baby sleep and gives you a break, then do it.

I would steer clear of solids at 12 weeks.

Solids/formula made NO difference to my son. He was weaned at 4months, and slept through at 8months (with some cc). No connection at all. Sorry.

I haven't read all the threads here so apologies if I repeat what others have said. I realise now with number 2 that I was far too lenient with number 1. Being a first time mum and trying to figure out what each cry represents was almost impossible I thought so each time number 1 squeaked he got picked up and fed. Number 2 is a different issue and I let her cry her head off. I know she needs the sleep and I also know (even at 6 weeks) that she is incredibly stubborn and single minded so I have had to resort to leaving her for 15 minutes. I started out at leaving her for 5 minutes but felt I needed to increase it to 10 before going to get her and now we are at 15 minutes. Dd wants me to hold her to sleep (except in the middle of the night when she goes down happily). Sometimes I relent and other times I don't depending on how tired I am or how busy I am.

It's incredibly hard being tough and I wasn't at all with ds. It doesn't help much but do whatever it is you think is best. I have found that any bad habits ds had (all created by me I might add) haven't been too hard to break but obviously the earlier I broke him of them the easier it was. I do know that with both of mine they sleep better the more sleep they have which is why I am so determined with dd that she will sleep during the day and not in my arms so that she sleeps well at night and all in all is relaxed and happy. I doubt that helps.

Agree with Aloha - I fed DS2 to sleep for quite a long time (he wasn't good at settling himself either) - I don't see anything wrong with it and it certainly doesn't mean that he will never learn to settle on his own.

Marsup, I noticed that introducing solids makes them sleep better but just at night as they don't need to wake up so often to be feed. However, better sleep is a consequence of introduction of solids not a reason to do it earlier, I would wait until 4-6 months as recommended by gps to avoid possible allergies.

Marsup - I'm having the same prob today (I let him sleep too long this morning I think). But I often feed him to sleep. It's not naughty: it works!

Anyway I have managed to establish a good morning nap (too good this morning) by feeding him to sleep, putting him in his pram in a dark room and then rocking him the instant he starts to wake up. Just an idea.

Also I agree that solids make no difference, other than to create a grumpier baby (we thought it was teething, but I think her tum was giving her trouble).