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Original poster

Phenergan

41 replies

bubbly · 28/01/2004 17:40

Would you ever consider giving a 3yearplus old phenergan to get them to sleep throught the night?

Our ds has never slept through the night. He has always either woken several times in the night and/or woken (at top volume) extremely early. He has lost his pm nap and is utterly exhausted as are we.

MIL and M suggest phenergan (have been suggesting it since he was 3months old!!!) but dp wants to try it out. He's prepared to be persuaded otherwise but I just wondered if anyone has any experience of this.

We have tried the alternatives - sleep training (I am NOT a softie wiht this), rewards, stars, shouting, crying, falling asleep on the floor in his bedroom , getting him in our bed , us in his bed, any other variation of musical beds you might like to think of, bribery, putting one of his sisters into his room for company, leaving light on in his room, in the corridor, feeding him later/earlier, different food combinations, giving him more/ less excercise, more/less attention, talking about it alot/not talking about it at all.

He knows every trick in the book and worst of all he knows exactly what we want. I genuinely believe he just doesnt care.

My gut reaction is not to do it, but when I'm really tired in the middle of the night I'd be quite happy to shoot him with a tranquiliser dart.

OP posts:
noddy5 · 28/01/2004 18:04

Give it a try I was advised to try it and was reluctant but it is a mild antihistamine which many gps prescribe for rashes.hay fever tec.It does work and can break the cycle giving you at least a bit of sleep.Try cutting the dose in half and half again over time until hes settled

spacemonkey · 28/01/2004 18:10

i did use it once or twice when dd was a similar age on the recommendation of my sister (who was a HV in those days). I seem to remember (this was about 10 years ago now!) that it did work, but i didn't feel comfortable continuing to give it to her - just didn't feel right about drugging her. But as you say when you're exhausted from constantly disturbed nights, you start to get desperate!

Good luck

katierocket · 28/01/2004 18:32

one of my friends tried this with her DS (her dad is a doctor and suggested it). she used it just to break the habit and also to get 2 nights of unbroken sleep - for her, DH and for her DS.

she hasn't used it since as he's much better but I think if you're totally exhausted and you have a militant non-sleeper (I totally sympathise with that, we were up with DS (2yrs) from 2am-4.30am last night) then it is worth giving it a go just to get a break. Obviously I'm not advocating drugging children to get them to sleep as a long term solution (although I'm with you on the tranquiliser dart)

bundle · 28/01/2004 18:36

bubbly have you tried getting a referral to a sleep clinic? I know someone who did and it worked wonders.

Original poster
bubbly · 28/01/2004 18:56

oh thank you - I was so anxious of being frowned upon but I had to ask.

Bundle - I did ask the HV about a referral and she just raised her eyebrows at me! So I felt ashamed for asking. I would be very interested in the details though.
Spacemonkey - that's sort of how I feel.I will talk to dh about it again. I think the idea of doing it as a one off for a break is probably worth a try before there's a bloody massacre here.....

OP posts:
spacemonkey · 28/01/2004 18:57

blimey don't feel bad for asking about sleep clinics bubbly - i wish i'd known they existed (if they did) when dd was little!

allatsea · 28/01/2004 19:35

a couple of friends of mine used it with their kids and they both exhibited the well known possible side effect - hyperactivity!

sb34 · 28/01/2004 19:38

Message withdrawn

noddy5 · 28/01/2004 19:41

Medised is good but leaves them dopey the next day.(which isnt always a bad thing)

tiredemma · 28/01/2004 21:07

i gave it to my ds1 when he was about 2, one of the side effects is nightmares/night terrors and he woke up in the middle of the night screaming and sweating, so i didnt use it again.

my aunt said that when she went to the docs when my cousins were younger and when they were poorly, he would always give her a prescription with "something to help them through the night" on it = phenergan!
the doctor and his wife incidently had 5 kids all under the age of 5 so im sure he must of used it himself!

Gumboot · 28/01/2004 21:16

Used it on ds and yes he was well awake all night! And I do mean all night, what a long night that was with even less sleep than usual.

Tried it on dd who has never slept through (nearly 5) and she didn't seem to have any effect on her atall, was too reluctant to give her too much so gave up.

My mum said that she used to give it me, and I'm fine........ sort of

nutcracker · 28/01/2004 21:24

I would definatly give it a go. My g.p perscribed it for my dd when at 1 yr she was only sleeping about 2-3 hours a night. We were advised though to not use it for more than 3 nights in a row as they get used to it. He gave it to us to give dd a chance to get into a sleeping routine. Sometimes it worked sometimes it didn't. I stopped giving it to her after a few months (we didn't use it every night) though because I felt that it was leaving her dopey in the day and i thought this could effect her development.

nutcracker · 28/01/2004 21:27

Just read the bit on sleep clinics. I recently told my health visitor that i would of gone seriously into debt if i could of got someone to deal with dd's sleep problems. I'd never really heard of them at the time and no one suggested one either. Apparently there still aren't many where i live (birmingham). I would definatly see if you can find one though. Ask your doc, you could get a referral.

kiwisbird · 28/01/2004 21:50

One word of warning!
We used phenergan on air flight from NZ to UK with 3 yr old son
He went the opposite way and went hyper (he was normally busy but not mad like this)
Small % of kids react this way apparently!

I do feel for you, this is an extreme situation, try anything

bobthebaby · 28/01/2004 23:34

I'd try a small amount for a day nap to see if it does make him hyper first. The packet here in NZ actually gives a sedation dose as well as an allergy dose, so it is sold as an infant sedative.

We have a ds with eczema and we tried it to get some sleep - it didn't work as it happens - but then we used some non drowsy stuff for 2 nights to stop him itching and it reset his system totally and he now sleeps really well.

Just do it twice and see if it works, after that you could get away with a placebo maybe?

bunny2 · 28/01/2004 23:42

We have used phenergan to help ds sleep. He has eczema and can get very itchy at night so the doctor has prescribed Phenergan to ensure he can settle at night. We dont use it very often any more as his eczema is under control but, if he has a couple of disturbed nights, I do give him a dose. Of course drugging children to get them to sleep is not ideal but as a very short-term solution I dont think it does any harm.

WideWebWitch · 29/01/2004 04:29

Hi bubbly, I've used it too, when ds was about 3 and I was desperate. He hadn't slept properly for ages and ages and I just had to get some sleep myself so as a last resort I tried it and it worked in that he slept for the nights I gave it to him and the cycle was broken. Christopher Green suggests it (giving them something as a sedative, not phenergan in particular) in Toddler Taming too I think. IKWYM about drugging your kids and not wanting to do it ideally but desperate times call for desperate measures sometimes I think and of course it's not a long term solution but I don't see anything wrong with it in the very short term and to try to break a cycle. Have you tried wearing him out physically as much as possible? I'm sure you have, but just a thought - my ds was SO energetic at that age that my only sure fire way of making sure he slept was walking him for miles in the afternoon. Sympathy, it's really really draining isn't it?

fio2 · 29/01/2004 04:39

www what are you doing up at this time?

WideWebWitch · 29/01/2004 04:54

Hi fio2, small baby woke, had bottle, had clean nappy, needed rocking back to sleep in her chair while I looked at mumsnet and half an hour later she's asleep and I'm still here! Eeek, must go to bed NOW! (sorry bubbly )

fio2 · 29/01/2004 04:57

god i am still here too! cant sleep, too much red wine last night me thinks. must sleep must sleep, the kids will drive me mad to day if i dont go back to bed soon how is your little lovely btw?

WideWebWitch · 29/01/2004 05:00

Fio2, she is really lovely and melts my heart every time she smiles. But we must both sleep, so I'm going to bed NOW and you must too! Talk to you tomorrow I expect (apologies for diversion anyone reading this for advice about Phenergan!)

Original poster
bubbly · 29/01/2004 11:29

No worries www. Hope you did finally get some sleep!

Well we 'debated' a lot about it (and ended up giving him a half dose. he still woke up at 5 but was less noisy than usual. Climbed in with us and wriggled around for a bit then dh went in to his bed with him.

He has been his normal noisy self all morning so no obvious knock on into the day effect. Dh thinks we should try full dose tonight and then leave it over weekend when sleep is less of an issue. ie no school no office.

I guess I am happy to try that now he has done one night.I did that slightly ridiculous thing you do with new borns - spend the whole time wishing they would go to sleep and then keep prodding them to make sure they will wake up again....bit sad really.

Thanks for all your comments.

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littlerach · 29/01/2004 11:54

DD used to wake at 5 ish for a while, and a friend suggested we break the cycle by waking her at 4am - sounds crazy but it worked for us. Apparently our bodies automatically wake at about this time, and small children cannot always prevent it from becoming their waking time. If you look at sleep patterns on a graph, it does show this, we also have much lighter sleep at certain times, again a reason for broken sleep. So if you can break this cycle then it can train their bodies to sleep differently. You could wake him at 4am to put him on the loo, or just rouse him slightly if you feel that would be better - not sure!!
Medised does sedate DD but a friend had the opposite reaction - just a warning!!!!
Good luck, it's the worst thing about being a parent, lack of sleep.

Twinkie · 29/01/2004 12:29

Tixylix chesty cough medicine works - found thius out when DD had a chesty cough - you could also try not making him sleep not an issue - just don't put him to bed - keep him up till he is really sleepy - try sitting and watching a film with him - in his PJs all warm and snuggly till late and then gradually start doing this routine earlier and earlier and hopefully he will get in a routine.

I would drug DS (well DD in my case) if I were at my wits end like you after all he is not going to get the best of you when you are constantly knackered and thats not good either. For a short term thing to get him a routine I would give it a go. Oh its hard to get (phenergan) just say it is for travel sickness if they ask you - my best friend used to use ot with her DS cause he did not sleep until he was 4!!

Well must go now - am sitting here in my dressing gown and DD has to be at school at 1!!

Original poster
bubbly · 29/01/2004 13:14

Twinkie already went through the purchasing trauma yesterday. Pharmacist said had I used it before and I just mumbled and blushed. I must have been soo transparent.

Unfortunately the keeping him up later option has been a disaster for us. He goes completely wild and starts running around pulling hair and scratching he sways from wildly laughing and confrontational to screaming and sobbing and downright violent. You can tell he's desperate for sleep once he's in bed he goes out like a light (I say I'm just going to get a drink and I'll come back and kiss you again, by the time I've got to the door he's out). In fact one thing he has always been ok at has been the actual falling asleep. Probably coz he's a 3rd and used to be left in the cot awake while I bathed his siblings and always fell asleep by himself.It;s the staying asleep that's the prob.

I would so love to snuggle up wiht him sometimes but he doesnt do snuggling he does bouncing and running.The only time he snuggles is when he's poorly. We do read to him at night but it's interspersed wiht him leaping up and down and bouncing on the bed. He prefers dh to read than me but he cant always do it

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