5 months still waking especially difficult at 5am

[KarenT]

Any advise please... my DD is now 5mths old and still not sleeping through the night. She is in a good routine during the day sleeping approx 3 hours during the course of the day. At night she goes down nicely at 7pm and wakes for a feed at about 2am. The main problem is that she wakes again at 5am, crying - we keep going to and fro putting the dummy back in. Would let her cry more but I also have a 3.5 yrs DS who is also waking by DD crys. If I fed her at 5am she will then not take her 7am feed (I am bottle feeding - soya as she has had a lactose intollerence)which puts the rest of the day off schedule. DD has been in her own cot in her own room since 10 wks old.

Any advise please - I feel we have tried everything in the book!

KarenT - How big is the bottle you give her at 2am? How much milk is she getting during the day and is she on solids yet? If you feed her at 5 does she go back to sleep?

jambot, I am giving DD 7oz bottle during day although she does not take it all sometimes only 5oz. DD is feeding 5 times a day and I would say taking approx' 30oz a day. DD bedtime feed is always 7oz - drained. We are giving 4oz at 2am as I am trying to encourage her to take more during the day... DD is not on solids and will only go back to sleep at 5am with dummy for 15min periods if dummy falls out DD cries... loudly:(
The 2am feed is a approx wakeup as the time can vary between 1am - 3am but a guaranteed 5-5.30 wakeup - she's a nightmare :)

maybe its time for her to go onto solids....

biglips... Due to her intollerence the hospital advised against solids until 6 mths, but today I have been giving her baby rice (just a teaspoon) but today I have decide to go for it on the solids in the hope that this could settle her. My DD just does not seem to have a massive appretite during the day...

Does she need a dummy to fall asleep in the first place and after 2am?

dd was nearly 6 months old when i did cc, was a different situation for me cos she was breastfed and she went to sleeping feeding and so woke frequently in the night because that was her sleep association. I got to the end of my tether and after doing cc it took only a few days for dd to sleep by herself, though for a long while she was waking at 5am (still proof enough for me that she didn't actually need those night feeds), i just had to wait for it to gradually get later (I also made that feed shorter & shorter so her body would get used to not feeidng so much at that time). In terms of the dummy, sounds like she needs to learn new assocations. cc is really really tough but for me anyway was totally worth it, dd has slept through since. although hard cos you have ds waking too...
I also read somewhere that babies don't need anything to drink in the night after 3 months old, though at the time i was very very sceptical of that! (still am)

The book I used was Solve Your Child's Sleep Problems by ....oh god i can't remember his name and i'm not at home so can't look, sorry!! ooh richard ferber or something like that? he does say the early morning waking is the hardest one to solve...

hope that makes sense & is helpful...

KarenT. What does she weigh? Want to work out what milk she should be having a day and see if I can use that to help. If she's over 5kgs (sorry, don't know pounds!), she should physically be able to get through the night without a feed if she's getting enough in during the day.
My dd was big from birth and hungry all the time until I found out that the tin works on what the average size baby requires, which was quite a bit less than DD who was nearly 1kg over the average weight.
I know she has an intolerance but I would consider trying her with a little fruit or veg. DD started solids at 4 and half months but ate nothing but pear and butternut until 6 months. I know the whole 6 months story so burn me at the stake if you wish but my DD was also an early riser until she started solids.
Also, when she has her 2am feed, where do you feed her? How long does it take before she's back in bed?

Oh by the way, if she doesn't seem keen on the rice go straight onto the fruit. Pear or apple. DD hated the rice and didn't want to know, but loved the pear.

Hi Jambot, she weighs 5.98kg, DD is such a poor eater, I reckon on average DD takes approx 28oz that's 5 feeds (4 during day and one night feed. She seems to be starving at 2am and I have resorted to giving her 7oz bottle which she drinks beautifully, I feed in her room with only the landing light on, I do not speak to her, a lot of the time I need to change her nappy as she tends to do a poo she usually goes straight back down - sometimes without dummy... the past 3 nights she has been waking at 6.30am - much more reasonable. I am now starting solids - DD not keen on carrot so I'll try the apple tomorrow.

Okay, at the risk of sounding extremely unhelpful.....

Some babies just dont sleep well.

DS was like this. He only really resolved his sleep issues at around 10.5 months. At the time, i felt that i must have been doing something wrong because DD started sleeping through at 11 weeks. But, ultimately, as time has gone on i realise more and more that each baby has a different personality, and alot of this reflects in eating and sleeping habits.

In your place, and knowing what i know now - i would choose the path of least resistance. If she wants to feed at 2am and 5am - let her. Stretch out her 7am feed and adjust the day accordingly as long as she is getting the right amount of milk. That said - i needed to do the least stressful thing because i have been diagnosed with PND and the less battles to fight the better for me really.

Please dont try solids with a view to solving this - it has no extra calories in it at all - give more milk if necessary. Particularly so if your DD has various intolerances. Also, its a lot of faffing to start doing/pureeing etc whilst you have a toddler and their meals to contend as well.

Agree with (most of) what VVV says.

Schedule be damned! Feed her up as much as she can take during the day. dd didn't sleep through the night (or day) until she was well over 6 months. Nearly 11 months till she slept well at night

I know it's damn hard but it will get better

KarenT - I worked out that according to her weight she can be on as much as 930mls per day, which is about 31oz. I know you say she's not a great drinker during the day, but I would definitely up her bottles if you can during the day. Also try and offer her what she hasn't drunk about 20 minutes later and see if she'll take the balance. My dd's bottle before bedtime was 8ounces at that age, sometimes nearly 9, and she always drunk every last sip, as if she knew she needed to get through the night. If she's getting more during the day and getting a big bottle at 2ish, hunger shouldn't be the problem at 5. Unfortunately you'll then have to consider other reasons. But it sounds like she's doing better, so fingers crossed.

Hi Karen, we were exactly the same. That 5.00 wake-up was a killer; particularly as our LO wouldn't get dozy again for two hours afterwards - just as the rest of us needed to get up. We started waking her up at 10.00, so we were able to cut out that 2.00 feed. If you're being woken up twice in the night, it feels worse. But she still woke at 5.00. Once we started solids, things got better, so hang on in there. But if you can avoid being woken up twice a night, I would. You'll cope a bit better. Things will improve, although when you're in the middle of it all, it doesn't feel that way... My LO is now 8 months and does 7-7, but still needs that 10.00 feed.