Scared to try sleep training - but need undisturbed sleep!!

[ComeTalkToMe]

I'm hoping someone has some advice... My DD is nearly 9 months and since 4 months has been a terrible sleeper. Sometimes she's better than others but in general it takes 30 mins plus to get her to sleep and she wakes several times a night generally ending in me or my DH sleeping with her on a mattress on her floor.

I'm going back to work in a few weeks and I really feel we need to do something about this before then. Don't think I could do CC/CIO but I am desperate. I was wondering if anyone thought gradual withdrawal would be effective? We don't feed or rock to sleep but do hold her hand and give her her dummy back until she's asleep.

If we did gradual withdrawal so we still give her the dummy back or would that defeat the purpose? Or does anyone have any other suggestions... I would be grateful for any advice or help...

If you dont want to try CC or CIO what about pick up/put down?

Thanks for the reply - I did try PU/PD a while ago but it seemed to get her more and more hysterical, as if the more I was picking her up the more unsettled she was getting. That was at about 6 months though so I cold try again... does it help with frequent waking?

I'm not sure to be honest - I am far from an expert on sleep (we are doing so-so with ours at the mo, good and bad nights)!! But am a fan of no-CIO methods so just wanted to check you knew about it. Good luck xx

I do sleep training consultations BUT only after the days have being sorted as I've found 90% of night sleep issues are caused by day routine.

If you want I'd be happy to advise just need to know the day time routine (including all wake ups, nap times, eating times and food eaten and activity levels) of baby(at least 3 days of recording) and how she is usually got to sleep.

mrswishywashy I think you cold be right that it comes from her daytime routine as I don't think she gets enough day time sleep.

She gets up between 6 and 6.30, breakfast at around 6.30 - cereal, fruit and toast (some eaten, some on floor!), bottle at 8.30 and then first nap which is often only 20 minutes, 30 on a good day. Then she's up and we're either out or playing until lunch at between 11.30 and 12 - she eats a lot at lunch and then goes down for another nap - again this is usually only 30 minutes although for a week she did 90 min naps at this time, it was bliss but I don't know how to get her to do it again! She then has a bottle around 2pm, and another wee nap at about 4 (or bathtimes a nightmare!). Then from 6 it's bath, bottle, bed and in cot for 7pm.

We then sit with her holding her hand and shshing her until she goes off to sleep usually between 30 and 40 minutes later. The wake ups generally start 40 mins after this!

Any advice from anyone would be appreciated - she's started to look like she has black eyes as she's sooooooo tired. It's very upsetting.

Oh I missed out her tea at about 5 - usually something I've cooked - she eats really well!

If she is pretty consistent at waking after the 40 minutes it sounds like she is unable to settle back to a deep sleep after her light sleep stage. To overcome this you would have to work on her settling herself to sleep.

I would probably start withdrawing slowly from the hand hold so that you can get to a stage where she can settle herself to sleep. Where does she sleep during the day? There are some tips I can give you to extend day time sleeps.

Oh, just saw she had a dummy - they can either be great comforters to some children and others (like your daughter) it can really hinder their sleep, so I'd recommend getting rid of it and replacing with and attachment item.

I think it is simpler to just go cold turkey on the dummy and probably start to withdraw the hand holding at the same stage.

I don't have a one size fits all plan so can only give advice based on the feedback given about your daughter but I'm happy to throw more ideas around too.

Co sleep?

seeker we have had periods of co-sleeping but long term it's not something we want to do as we don't get a great sleep and as I said I'm going back to work soon and can't be dead on my feet. Thanks though.

I don't think she really can self settle and I believe that's why her naps are so short even though she's clearly tired. I think we will they gradually withdrawing the handholding and see how she goes. She's got very upset if we leave her before she's totally zonked in the past and I hate that.

Thanks for your help mrswishywashy do you think she should be napping more in the day to help her night sleep?

For this age group I would probably aim for at least 3 hours day time sleep, not more than four and no less than 2 and then 12 hours at night. Of course each child is different and I've had some that sleep 2 hours in day and 14 hours in night and others that to 10 hours at night and four hours during day. Some babies cope fine with not ideal sleep time and others really struggle with over tiredness.

I'm always surprised how easy it is to get a baby out of habits such as patting, dummies and hand holding and often think its the adults that hang onto it for longer than the child. I've had parents feeling extra guilty that they don't need to do anything (after months of them giving cuddles, co sleeping, handholding, bottles in night) to get baby to sleep and all while baby is sound asleep (without crying) in next room without having any help to get to sleep.

I would try to resettle her back to sleep or give her a chance to go back to sleep when she wakes for especially avo nap. I find if they cry on awakening it means they've not had enough sleep.

mrswishywashy thanks, I did think it would be a nightmare getting her to sleep with no help but after an action packed day I've just put her in cot. She's now dozing off with no intervention from me. I'm actually stunned!

so sorry to hijack, but Mrswishywashy, any chance i could get some advice from you? im in a really desperate situation with my 5 month old and sleep (particularly day time naps). Can I pm you? It sounds like you may be able to help. Happy to be a paying client anything to sort out the mess im in!

I'm having similar problems with my 7.5m old, she wakes every hour trough the night. :0/

I am shocked, but delighted to say, that after a couple on wake ups going off into a deep sleep last night my DD slept till 4.20, put dummy back in and she went to 6.30am. This is unheard of!

I know there may be bumps ahead but at least there is some light at the end of the tunnel!

Chestnut - I'm happy to give further advice, feel free to PM me.

ComeTalkToMe - congratulations and long may good sleeps continue. There may be a few bumps but just trying small things to try and break habits can lead to big changes in sleep for the baby.

"There are some tips I can give you to extend day time sleeps."

mrswishywashy, what tips do you have? I am desperate as the way I get my 7mo DS to sleep (i.e. feeding or pushing in buggy) doesn't seem to work if he wakes up after a short nap.

Sorry for the hijack!