Early mornings with three year olds

[robbie]

I'm getting more and more miserable about early mornings and wonder if anyone had any tips. My two (just three year old twins) usually wake up at six and come and visit mum and dad. They are most definitely up and awake and ready to go - no taking them back and convincing them it's still night time. I've tried... shutting the door and letting them howl, bought a sleepy time bunny alarm clock - they come in and tell us he's still asleep, any amount of threats etc. It's obviously not a light/ blackout blind issue as it's pitch black outside when they surface. They can turn the light on by themselves and will usually play until seven but during that time will have visited a few times, so basically we are awake from six. I know six may not sound that bad but my husband is usually at work until 9.30, so we don't eat until late and it's tough to go to bed on a full stomach - plus i'd quite like to have a conversation with him (most of the time anyway) so we really find it tough to get to bed before 11/ 11.30. By the end of the week the six oclock kick-offs have really worn us down.
They are still napping in the day - have tried cutting out but made no difference - in fact they often woke in the night aswell (probably because they were too exhausted by the time they went to bed). Even worse occasionally they would conk out around 5pm - just go up and put themselves to bed which meant it was hell waking them up and when they did, boy were they miserable.
Anyone got any suggestions - just got Christopher Green out and he suggests a smack! which made me wonder why an earth I think he's worth listening to. Help I need eight hours.

Nightmare, robbie! I have a friend whose son was just like this.

I think Batters has made a very good suggestion. Gradually introducing a slightly later bedtime would be my first thought, too, especially considering all the other tactics you have tried. After all, even half an hour's change would be great. 6.30 am is a whole lot better than 6.00 am.

However, and sorry, you won't like to hear this - my friend found that introducing a later bedtime had little or no effect on her son. The lack of sleep just made him cranky.

Your twins are just three - a difficult age I think, because they are going to grow out of day time naps soon.

Looking on the bright side, this could mean that in six months or so you will find they can go a whole day without flagging, but will be extra-tired at bedtime, and so sleep a little longer in the morning.

Will they be starting nursery soon? I remember my son went through a difficult sleeping patch at around three years as he grew out of day naps, but then he definitely slept longer once he had the rigours of a nursery day to contend with. Also, once your daughters attend nursery, they will be having a different day routine so this could be the ideal time to introduce a different sleep routine.

My friend never managed to get her son to sleep much later though. So what she began to do was let him go downstairs to play quietly or watch videos - making sure the place was very child friendly, of course. She used to creep downstairs with him, put a video on, and then go back to bed. He liked being taken out of his room and this seemed to stop him going back upstairs to visit his parents in bed. I remember being a bit shocked at this - her son was around four when she first started doing this - but she assured me her son soon learned to be quiet, happily occupying himself (mostly) and leaving her and her partner alone for another hour or so.

Lastly, my evenings tend to end late for similar reasons to yours. I try to practice some damage limitation: one early night (10.30 -ish) midweek to give me an extra burst of energy to tide me over till Friday.

Wish I could offer more constructive advice. Hope you get some here!

Berocca tablets, Batters!

Mind you, my sons aren't early risers, so this is one energy-draining problem I don't have.

Massive sympathy to you ... I'm afraid early morning waking is one of the problems that exist for parents not kids! YOU don't say what time they go to bed but I suspect it may not make much diffence if you make it later, if they're always up at 6. Mine think the day begins at 5am or even earlier sometimes, but we have got them to play quietly lately (tho of course the definition of quiet to a 3 year old isn't necessarily ours!!!)
Do you think yours would respond to a traffic light on RED outside your door to stop them going in? Or could you try that alarm clock with the bunnyface that opens its eyes and lifts its ears when its time to start the day... I think JoJO Maman bebe have one..?
One thing if they nap in the day is to gradually make it shorter and may be later( if its mid morning) ( you don't say when they nap or how long?)rather than cutting it out altogether.
Sorry if this like a stream of consciousness but hope it helps a little just knowing you're not alone..?
Must go to bed now.. been up since er ....!!!!

Message withdrawn

Gee six oclock is pretty standard around here! Mind you, dh and I both have to get up just after that anyway during the week so it doesn't matter except on weekends!!!

Dd who is 5 is usually any time between 6 and 6.30am, and ds who is 2 and a half is either woken up by her or will sometimes make it to 6.45am. It's hard with the two as they do wake each other up if one wakes up first. Do they share a room?

It seems some kids have an internal alarm clock that is pre-set by who knows who to some inhumane hour of the morning. The button to alter the time is inaccessible and nobody has the instruction manual anyway! It's even worse in summer when it gets light earlier though...

I'm sorry I'm not a lot of help...will they play quietly in their room(s) for a while? Someone I know "coloured in" a clock face from the seven to the twelve and told their dd that if the short hand was in that area they could come and see mum and dad, otherwise they had to stay in bed or in their room and play. Might be worth a try - it's never to early to start teaching the time!!!

Hi there,
Thanks for all the support/ advice. Yesterday we didn't nap and this morning they woke at five!!!! What's more I had two grumps from 4-6 during which time I rashly embarked on a "quick" trip to M&S. They screamed for lolly-pops the whole way round and refused to walk back to the car. So cutting nap out altogether is NOT the answer. Today I'm going to try and wake them after an hour (tricky as given their druthers they would sleep for two). Bedtime is 8/8.30 usually, so don't really want to go too much later. Oh and we've got the bunny alarm clock already - they come in at six to tell me he's still asleep! Grrr. Any other ideas would be most welcome.

Another idea... do they know their numbers? if so would a digital clock help? YOu could say no entry to M&D until say 6:30?? It worked for us although we had to wait a while and go minute by minute... YOU could also do the rabb it to wake up at eg 6.05 and see if they can wait til then and gradually make it later? One hour nap plus these strategies will probably help a bit but in the end you may just have to accept that some kids don't need the sleep we'd like them to! THey're probably bright??! Good luck!

Your twins are three. Why not try putting a vid on in their room when they wake.. It should keep them quiet for an hour. But other than that count your blessings. I know 5 o clock starts can be a killer but 6 am doesnt sound too bad and if their in bed at 8.30 then believe me it could be a lot worse.

Just remember before you know it they will outgrow this stage and will start sleeping in longer. It sometimes helps me with dd (20mths) to remember that. Gosh in the past yr Ive been tru 3 mths of 5am starts , Then waking every hour, then 6am starts and sleeping thru and now at last bed at 6.30 and wake up at 7.30. Hooray!! but I dont know how long it will last.

Before you know it they will be in school.
One tip though , shorten nap time to 30 mins it is enough to give them second wind but try for at least a week it wont work straight away.

My sister has a lie-in every day until 6am, now her DH is retired. When he was working and their kids at home they used to get up, through choice, betwen 5 and 5.30am!! She wasn't pleased when the 9 o'clock News changed to 10, because they're in bed by then. Me, I'm a night owl....

robbie, I have found with my ds that the more sleep he gets the more he will have. When he gets overtired for some reason, he sleeps badly & wakes up early. I find that if I put him to be earlier, then he will often sleep later.
I wouldn't be tempted to keep your two up any later, 8.00/8.30pm is already quite late.
Good luck.

What about extra phyical exercise? I find that running around in the cold air really knackers our toddler.

Yes, I'd agree with Bells that extra physical exercise pays dividends on the sleep front. If you cannot get them outside in the cold, could you give them an extra long bath time?

Also, I find a warm bedroom helps stop early morning waking, so perhaps look at the bedroom heating.

I certainly agree that warm bedrooms help but watch out that the heating going on doesn't wake them up earlier! WE now set ours v low all night so it keeps the house from going v cold at night but isn't as warm as you need it once your'e up IYKWIM. WE also do as much fresh air as is possible... not easy in these damp dark days but short sharp doses do help.
Hang in there!