daytime napp and night sleep problems...

[LLsMum]

We never had any problems to get DS (2.5 yo now) to go to sleep. We co-sleep - it's great - and for napp time we lie with him. But don't get me wrong, he is a very boisterous, active, disruptive adorable toddler.
For about a year now, we've even been able to lie with him for a bit and say:"I need to go back down now, good night..." and he's fine. (he still sleep in our room, DH woodworker has modified his toddler bed so it's his bed stuck to our and mattresses at same level. He sleeps through the night in his bed, occasionally he'll shift toward us... We can even get another member of family or good friend to put him to sleep.
All ideal until... well, he's still very tired at the end of the morning and needs his daytime napp shortly after lunch. He would sleep 2 hours if given a chance, but then will not be tired enough at bed time (8pm).
If he skip the napp, it's a disaster of tantrum and grumpiness for the rest of the afternoon (or occasionally he would fall asleep on the carpet amongst toys or on changing matt at 5pm until 9pm and be full of beans again !)
If we lift him after a shorter napp he's all grump as well...
I feel I can win ! We can't let him run around until 11pm because that is OUR time... for...euh... housework !
Help !
Cheers - Marion :-)

I know this too well! We are having similar with our DS atm too (he's 22 months). Long nap means late bedtime. Can I ask though, what time does your DS usually take his nap?

We try to have early lunch (but it's often 12.30) and down for napp no later than two- around half one is the most often.
Someone suggested to me today to try the napp before lunch and lunch around one, with a good snack at 10.30... this means you don't go out in the morning...

Hmmm. Did you try the earlier nap? Would your DS actually go down for a nap before lunch? I don't think mine would. I would also be a little wary as IME early naps can often cause issues with earlier waking. Its difficult isn't it - early nap = early wake, later nap = bedtime resistance.

Perhaps just shoot in the middle at say 12/12.30(ish) & allow a shorter nap. Maybe by doing that he won't be as grumpy when you wake him, i.e. if he's awake for say 5hrs then has a 1hr nap he will be less grumpy than if he's awake 7hrs & you wake him after 1hr IYSWIM?

I also hear that waking at the end of a sleep cycle (45mins) is better than waking after say 1hr when they are in deep sleep & they are likely to wake up much less grumpy that way.