Early waking nightmare...

[Humania]

dd2 is 11.5mo and has been sleeping through since about a month ago so I feel incredibly fortunate for that. Initially she woke around 6ish which was perfectly manageable, but it's been steadily getting earlier and earlier and we have now got to the unearthly 4.30am and she will just not go back to sleep. I usually cave in and bf her around 5.15 in the hope that she'll settle but she rarely does. We've tried blackout blinds, leaving her to yell (horrible), earlier bedtime, moving naps, shortening naps (she has 2 good naps every day - around 2.5 - 3 hrs in total) but nothing seems to work. Also have 3.9yo dd1 who gets woken by dd2 and then I start the day with 2 crying/yelling/tantrumming girls who need more sleep. Any advice gratefully received as I've recently gone back to work and am really starting to struggle

fifi I know what you mean, they're all so different and it's not as simple as it often sounds on these threads. But I disagree there's not a lot you can do about it - sleep is a science and understanding why they wake after one sleep cycle (45 mins) can help to make their naps longer. In my case, my DD was overtired, she couldn't go more than 2.5 hours between her MN and her LTN. If I pushed it to 3, she just flipped into OT mode and wouldn't go down.

fififrog
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Esker

Went to a sleep clinic this morning at my local children's centre. The woman there said the first thing I should address was the BF as soon as DD wakes. She thought that the light mornings could well be a factor, even though we have a fairly effective blackout blind, but more likely is that she knows she gets a BF and snuggle when she gets up so has an incentive to wake earlier. She advised just a cuddle and drink of water when she first wakes, then putting her back down to try and get another hour or two. I've always thought she must be genuinely hungry when she wakes, but apparently not if she's having a good dinner and BF before bed. I did manage to drop the nightfeeds completely a few months ago by not giving DD a BF when she woke at midnight/2am/3am or whatever, so perhaps I need to apply the same approach...?

Thanks, loveis. Yes, it seems to be unanimous - 4 hours is definitely too much!! And there was me just enjoying the change to do some washing and put my feet up with a coffee ;-)

beamur ;) quite why my iPod thinks they're important in the average person's messages I don't know!

loveis, I'm not saying you're wrong because things have clearly worked for you, but the things that have worked for you have not worked for me! Believe me I read 4 books on sleep before she was even born, have subsequently read another two, have paid a sleep clinic, and devoured parentingscience.com so I am pretty well informed about infant sleep cycles and typical patterns. I couldn't get her to sleep any longer no matter what until 7 months, when I managed, by hovering at her side, to get her to sleep for 50mims rather than 30. But none of this "do it a few days and they'll learn" - I did it every day for about 2 months. Nowadays I have to hover for 10mins at 45 mins. I have tried all sorts of time shifting naps and capping them but nothing has sorted her early waking. Everything I have done has been consistent for at least 4 weeks bar illness. I conclude that some kids are not terribly amenable, and my life improves a lot when I try to accept she needs to work it out in her own time, and I stop worrying about it!

fifi sorry, didn't mean to imply that. I know it's the most frustrating thing in the world when people who don't know your child try and tell you what they would do as if it's as easy as that! I'm expecting no. 2 in five weeks and am firmly expecting my tried and tested sleep remedies to be thrown back in my face! :)

Ok hi everyone I'm back with an update. We've been on the new routine for just under 2 weeks, and I'm afraid we've seen v little improvement. She's having 30-40 mins at 9.30am, around 2 hours at 12.45ish, and is in bed by 7. We've had a couple of 5.30 starts but most often it's been 5.10 . I was really hoping for a bit later than this! Would it be a really stupid idea to try to move bedtime an hour later? I know most people say this doesn't work...

Hi again, sorry you've had no luck, Hugs and sympathy! Surely it's worth a try... I was sort of trying to do the same, but haven't quite managed. Saw no improvement going to 7.15 from 6.45 and it would often take her longer to fall asleep so more sleep-deprived overall. I was and still am of the opinion that it might take a short sharp shock to change things, like moving bedtime by 1.5 hours or something, but when it comes down to it I'd rather she is in bed at 7 and wakes at 5.30 than is up til 8.30 or 9pm.

If you do try, I think you'll need to be rigidly consistent for at least a week. And please do post back, I'll be v interested to see how you get on!

loveis no worries, I think it's great you managed to solve your kid's problems. I wish you an excellent sleeper in #2 :)

Thanks fifi... I'll definitely give it some more thought. Based on some of the advice I've read here I suspect omama will suggest that she needs to drop the morning nap altogether but I'm not convinced... Surely if that was the case we would have seen at least a little improvement shortening the morning nap from 75 mins to 30 mins? I can appreciate the theory but I really believe that each little one is so different and will not necessarily follow the rules! Any other ideas very welcome... 4.55 this morning and I am beyond shattered

FFS. 4.45am. Anybody?