4 month old very awake between 4am and 6am

[ThePippy]

Hi again. I posted a couple of weeks back asking about getting my 15 week old to drop his night feed, which he has now thanks to a suggestion to move him to a 4hr schedule.

Well he has not had the night feed since and his morning feed is much more successful as a result, but I now have him waking around 4am almost every day and being very noisy (singing, shouting, babbling) until 6am when he is sometime possible to resettle and sleep until 7am when I get him up. This started just after his 16 week jabs and has been like it for almost 2 weeks and is really getting me knackered. Nothing has changed in his schedule with 180ml feeds at 7am, 11am, 3pm and 7pm plus dream feed at 10.30pm and sleeps at 9am, 1pm and catnap at 5pm all of which he really needs. He never feeds to sleep and always self settles. His napping has become more difficult over the same period too, with it being hard to get him to have the full 1.5-2hrs for each nap, which again he really needs as he is mr grumpy without that amount.

Is this just a phase/4 month regression do you think or is there anything I can do to change this behaviour? I am getting ready to introduce solids (as he will be going to nursery at 6 months and I would like him to be used to solids by then) and was wondering (ok hoping) that might help?

Hi!
How long is he napping for during each nap?

Sorry just realised you said he naps 1.5-2 hours each nap.

I have a 17wk old and his naps are 45 mins in the morning, 2 hours at lunch, and 15-30 mins late afternoon. He sleeps 7-7 with a dream feed at 10 which will be dropping once on solids.
My first thought was too much daily sleep which would mean by 4/5am he had had enough sleep and is ready to start the day.

Of course it may also be hunger which would hugely improve once on solids!

Agree with lara. If each nap is that long, he's probably having too much daytime sleep. I would go with something exactly like Lara in terms of length of sleeps.

For smaller babies, you can also try giving them some awake time at 10pm, rather than it being a dream feed. But at 4 months, I'd say you need to cut the daytime sleep so it's more appropriate for his age.

Sleep patterns do change at 4 months but I think the term 'sleep regression' is used rather loosely sometimes to explain away poor sleeping habits without looking in more detail at what might be causing them.

Just to comment on your point about him really needing the sleep - as a younger baby, he most certainly did need that amount of sleep but as they grow, the balance of daytime and nighttime sleep shifts so that they're sleeping longer at night and less in the day. Some babies don't reduce their naps naturally so while he's probably needed to cut down on his naps for the last couple of weeks in line with his biological development, he hasn't. What has happened instead is that he's wide awake at 4am ready to start the day (another indication of this is that he's not crying when he wakes - he's happy to sing etc).

The problem with the 4am waking (apart from the obvious!) is that fairly soon after they start, he then needs to compensate for the early starts by having longer naps so you actually think he needs the naps, not the other way round. Vicious circle....

Agree with lara & love. At this age, if he is taking a super long nap at 5pm it is this nap in particular that will be causing your early waking issues. So if you choose to cut back on a nap, the 5pm nap is the one to cut short first, because this is the nap that is typically dropped first (usually at around 6-7 months). If cutting this nap right back to 15-30mins doesn't help, then look at cutting back the morning nap a little. You might find that he will still need those 2 long naps for a wee while yet.

Thanks all for the responses. Not sure how I can limit his daytime naps as I am already really working hard to keep him awake as long as I do, and when he gets tired he really gets grumpy and becomes hard work. I was also under the impression that sleep begets sleep and that good daytime napping leads to good nighttime naps. My DD used to have two 1.5 to 2hr naps every day right up to about 14 months when she then switched to one long 2-3hr nap after lunch and that continued until well after 2yrs old when we moved her into a bed and the dynamic change stopped the napping. From memory she was still having the 5pm catnap (30 mins or so) right up until 6 months.

Last night DS slept right through to 6am and then did a little chatting and went back to sleep until 7.15am which is much much better, so I am desperately hoping that it was just a blip caused by something like a developmental change or possibly teething (he has been chewing like crazy).

Every child is different - some carry on with a 2 hour nap till they're 3, others drop naps altogether at 18 months (I know of 2). Sleep does beget sleep but it has to be structured correctly otherwise it goes the other way.

It's up to you of course but if you want to fix those 4am wakings (and assuming it's definitely not something else), I would look at his naps.

By the way, if he's catnapping at 5 for up to 2 hours, when does he go to bed? I'm assuming it's not 7?

His catnap is only 30 mins usually, and sometimes it can't be helped as I need to take him to collect his sister from nursery at 5 so being in the car sends him off. Even when he is home at that time though he needs that quick nap otherwise he is impossible by bath/bedtime. He goes down at 7pm and is usually asleep before 7.15pm.

I completely understand that all babies are different, I can see many differences already between my two, but its just that he really seems to need that much nap time at the moment otherwise he is red eyed and screamy from tiredness, which just doesn't seem right to inflict on such a small baby, plus it makes eventually getting him down for his naps a nightmare as he is so overtired.

I am hoping that because his routine is pretty established (following baby whisperer) that the night will go back to how it was soon. Last night was better, although that could be a one off. They do know how to keep us guessing these babys!!

Thanks again for your time in responding.

Oh, I see. Sorry thought that all his naps were up to 2 hours. If his last nap is only 30 mins usually then that's probably just about right and you definitely don't want him overtired by bedtime.

I would say that he is grumpy during the day because he's waking at 4am but that doesn't mean that continuing to give him long naps will solve the problem (if that's the cause of his waking). However, it could be just a phase (my daughter has just gone through another one at 2.5, so they never end!) so hopefully he will start to come out the other end.

Perhaps cutting his morning nap down? They say a long morning nap is a babies way of extending night sleep? Either push it back 5-10 mins every couple of days, or start waking him up 5-10mins earlier every couple of days. I would imagine you'd have a bit of a grumpy baby for a week or so as u try to fix it, but would be worth it to stop 4am starts!
But like you said it might hopefully be a phase!

Is his morning nap 2 hours at the moment? I think that could be shorter - about an hour? Then 2 hours at 12ish then the catnap late afternoon until he needs to drop it. The MN can often be an extension of nighttime sleep but this is usually if they're tired about an hour after they've woken up for the day.

By 6 mos, my DD was on 30mins at 9.30am, 2 hours at 12.30pm and no AN.

I should add that she didn't need much sleep so this probably isn't helpful! :)

So yesterday/last night was kind of odd. Firstly he napped really well in the day, and I was especially amazed when in the middle of the afternoon nap he had a huge poo and I was convinced he would never go back down for the rest of the sleep as he seemed wide awake, but he did without even a moments fussing and slept for another hour. Anyway he normally gets a dream feed at 10.30pm and is usually sound asleep when we go to do it, but last night he woke at 9.50pm proper crying and as there seemed nothing wrong we decided he must be hungry and fed him early and he completely drained the bottled then totally crashed out. He woke at 7am this morning and I had not heard a peep from him all night!! So I am now thinking that maybe it has all been developental or a growth spurt maybe.