If you nurse to sleep...

[qwertina]

do you do it for every nap?

My 13 week old DD finds it difficult to go to sleep in a buggy/sling/car/cot unless i bf to sleep. We are also going through the dreadful half hour nap stage. My concern is that every feed is now turning into nap time.

If you fed to sleep what age and how did you stop?

DS is almost 6 months and we still nurse to sleep. I try and take him off before he falls asleep though so he's aware that he's being put in his cot and needs to fall asleep there. We feed before some of the day time naps. If we're out then he is okay to doze off in the buggy. He naps for only 30min each time and needs to nap every two hours otherwise he goes a bit crazy...! It works at the moment... I do worry a bit about the feed to sleep association but an just going with it for the time being. He wakes at night and we leave him for a little bit to make sure it's a hungry cry vs a waking up cry. It's usually hungry and he gets on and has a god suck for 10min and goes back to sleep. On more unsettled nights he does this more often and sometimes really wakes himself up and wants to play.

I nursed DS to sleep until he was about 14 months old. The only ways he would fall asleep were either on the boob or in a moving car/buggy. It really upset me for a while as my HV was trying to push me into sleep training, but any attempts to do anything else were so upsetting all round that I just went with it. At about 14 months DS suddenly seemed to 'get' the falling asleep without boob bit, so we continued to give a pre-sleep feed (naps and night-time) but then make sure there was a period of time between this and sleep to reduce the association between bf and sleep. He still needs us in the room to fall asleep but self-weaned at 19 months and sleeps well now.

One technique I did find useful was one I found in the No Cry Sleep Solution: it basically involves gently stopping the latch when you notice your child starting to drift, it helps to gently stop the association between actually feeding and falling asleep, without losing the closeness of nursing.

I still nurse to sleep my almost 1yo and am wondering when it's going to stop, so appreciate the responses above.

In terms of a 13wo taking naps at every feed - I wouldn't worry about this, it is totally normal, unless your baby is waking through the night more than you think that she should. I think that I read somewhere that the actual act of nursing tires the baby out as well as breast milk containing something that makes the baby sleepy.

I still feed to sleep. DD is 15mths now just. She sleeps in the car or buggy if out. She settles at nursery and with me in the evening I bf and bottle and cuddle to sleep on my lap then transpose her to the cot. Usually this still works fine (Ive had a couple of bad nights just now but its not this that has set it off as she's quite happy in the cot til around 1-2am. She's got a bad cough).

So far Ive learned to trust her. Pretty much every 3-4mths she's changed something about her routine as she's got older which has made good differences. EG at 8wks she wouldn't sleep anywhere but the car seat. At 12wks she begged for more room so we changed from moses to crib and again she did it to swap to a cot at about 6mths. She altered her bedtimes as she wanted at the age she wanted them to. Originally bedtime was with us at 10pm, then slowly the older she's got the earlier she has asked for it and the last change was at 12mths in December from 8pm to 7pm. It can be hard and no doubt will change again at some point (god I hope thats not now) and Ill need to do some sort of training perhaps. For now Id emphasise trusting what you see your baby asking for.

I still feed to sleep most nights and DS is 3.4. It takes between 5 and 20 minutes and usually he feeds, then rolls over and falls asleep on his own. Also if I am out or ill or go to bed early or I get wound up and DP ends up taking over bedtime, he goes to sleep fine without me. I'm pretty sure he will stop by himself when he is ready :)

I used to let him nap whenever so when he was tiny he'd be in the pushchair, car seat or bouncy chair, and then when older he would usually be in the pushchair (we used to do a toddler group which finished at 11 every day so he'd fall asleep on the way back) or lying down on the sofa watching TV. I'd only feed him to sleep by accident - e.g. we would just be having a cuddle and feed and he'd fall asleep. But I didn't really note the time of naps until this 11am phase so it could have been that he was just asking to feed when he was tired, if that made sense.

My DD is 5 months old and I feed to sleep at night, but sometimes it happens accidentally during the day and I just go with it.

I have started following a few suggestions from the No Cry Sleep Solution book... But need to try a little harder!

Thank you for all the responses. Sorry I haven't been back for a while, I have hit rock bottom an am considering stopping bf.

She will not sleep any other way and I feel that I can't go anywhere and do anything. Sometimes she falls asleep in the buggy but for half an hour max. The same in the car or sling.

Last night she woke up 6 times and wanted to sleep with my nipple in her mouth.

I feel that i can;t continue this way. I don't really want to stop bf as I worked very hard to establish it but feel I have no choice. Going through the sleep section it seems that most 'bad' sleepers are breastfed.

Last night I felt so angry with her it scared me. I am in tears and feel awful, she is my tiny lovely baby, how am I even capable of feeling like that?

Don't feel guilty for harsh feelings. You are shattered it's understandable
It doesn't mean you don't totally love her. I don't have advice on the sleep thing as I a in the same boat.I am considering mix feeding, will be weaning soon so ebf is over anyway. Perghaps the bottle will break the association between feeding and sleep but even if it doesn't somebody else can do it occasionally and I can have s break.

Honestly everyone needs a break sometimes it can be so intense. Don't beat yourself up for being human :)

:( Sorry to hear this. Sleep deprivation does terrible things to you! Please be assured it's perfectly normal to feel anger, anger will not hurt her.

I hate to say this, but from what you've described it does not sound like her sleep problems are related to breastfeeding. I know it feels like you'd do anything if it was a magic solution right now, but it would be a shame to stop and then find out it wasn't the magic solution you were hoping for, and often there just isn't a magic solution...

Are you saying that every time she feeds it is sending her to sleep for a nap? Because this to me says that she is extremely tired, so she's probably not getting enough sleep in general either. I think it would be worth looking at something like Cranial Osteopathy, or even try eliminating things from your diet. Does she back-arch a lot? This can be a sign of her reacting to something in your milk.

We had four sessions with CO, didn't make any difference and DD hated it, screamed throughout.

I'm pretty certain I know why she has bad nights - it is the lack of daytime naps.
Until she was 7 weeks old, she napped well, we had a bedtime routine, bf and awake to her cot where she would drift of easily.

At 7 weeks her naps started to become shorter - down to 40 min and by evening she would be overtired and hysterical and would not let me to put her down. That's when I started feeding to sleep as I felt I hd no choice.

I tried everything to extend her naps - sling, car, white noise, putting her down as soon as she showed signs of tiredness, playing lots so she would get tired. It got worse and now we are down to 30 min.

Tho only thing that sometimes works is lying down with her, feeding her to sleep and then popping my boob back in her mouth every time she starts waking. On the days I manage to get her nap like that for couple of hours we have much better nights.

Tried bottle of EBM this morning when she was in good mood and appeared rested, she went berserk so gonna have to stick to bf for now anyway as I have a feeling making her to take bottle would make things worse.

:(

There is a no cry sleep solution book specifically for naps if that sounds any use?

Thank you for all your kind words. Feeling better now :)

Have ordered the No Cry Nap Solution book so we'll see.

Had a good laugh at Boots Parenting Club e-mail today - "Your baby is 4 months old and you are probably enjoying full nights sleep by now". Glad I found it funny, it is usually this kind of remark that gets me down.

Who knows maybe tonight will be a good one!

Sorry to hear you're having trouble - it would be a real shame to stop breastfeeding as there is possibly a way out of this.

Have you considered pick up, put down, as a form of sleep training. I think whenver people hear the phrase sleep training, some think it means controlled crying. PUPD, a baby whisperer method, is far more gentle and can work well to break to reliance on breastfeeding/rocking etc to sleep.

If your partner could do it, its supposed to work better as your baby isn't doubly upset by the fact your milk is right there but you are witholding it. I've seen Tracy Hogg do it on TV with a mum who was in exactly the same boat as you. She got the husband to do it and within three nights they were seeing good results. You never leave the baby to cry so it's not traumatic in the way that CC can be. Hope that helps.

Full night sleep at 4 months is a good laugh for I assume most people. Why do they do things like that?

OP i was you a few weeks ago! Sooo very tired, crap naps, crap nights, DS only going to sleep through feeding. (DS is 5 months btw)

Then randomly his first morning nap (of 35 minutes - you could set a watch by him) could only be had if he was in the sling when he went to sleep (I could then take him out and put him in his cot). Even when I tried he wouldn't fall asleep when feeding but would feed, then cry until I put him in the sling and he slept

Now he almost never falls asleep for naps whilst feeding and to be honest I kinda miss it because it was so easy, easier than now when I try to feed, then the sling, then the pushchair, then the sling again... . At night he's still feeding off to sleep and feeding a few times in the night, although sometimes just a cuddle will get him back to sleep (he's waking 5 times a night on average).

We've still not cracked it although he does sometimes nap for longer than 35mins, and even the shorter ones are grdually creeping up to 40 mins and 45 mins

Just hang in there. We had many many trying weeks - basically since Christmas - and we're only just seeing an improvement in the last week. Many times I was crying in the night and early morning out of sheer tiredness and frustration.

oh and totally dreading the evenings and nights! As the day went on I got more and more unhappy at the thought of trying to get DS to sleep and to stay asleep!

Another shit night here.

I have considered doing the pu/pd but my dp doesn't get home till late so can't always do it and I cannot face doing anything like that on my own as I know that I will give in eventually and just feed her.

At the moment I'm thinking along the lines of waiting till she's 6 months and doing CC as much as I hate the idea.

It is good to know that I'm not alone - not that I wish this on anyone though :)

In RL most people don't understand what I am going through, and I don't blame them to be honest as before I had dd I just thought you put them to bed and that's it :o

Doesn't help that most of my friends with children have good sleepers, I am utterly fed up of fb updates such as 'my darling so and so slept all night last night I am so happy bla bla bla...' and some of those babies are younger than mine.

It sounds exhausting

I don't have a magic wand I'm afraid - I still try to feed to sleep now (babies are 16 months), though it doesn't always work now. My two will sleep in the day in the buggy/car or feed to sleep on the bed (sometimes). At night, they will sometimes go to sleep without a breastfeed (they have dummies) but when they wake in the night (at least twice each) they want a breastfeed to get back to sleep.

What I have discovered is that all this feeding/sleeping nonsense is reserved for me If my mum or DH puts them to bed or goes to them in the night, they have a rub/pat/shush/cuddle and dummy and drift straight off! And they just lie in their cots and go to sleep for 2 hours in the day! It is very difficult to cope with the fact they're easier to look after for my mum and DH , though I enjoy the odd night off now they'll settle for someone else and are big enough to not need a night feed.

At 4 months I would try to keep going. Things change quickly at that age, and it will all be even harder if your baby will still only settle with a feed but you have to do bottles etc to feed her.

Could you try DH going to her in the night? Does she have a dummy?

I don't know how you do it with two babies Happy, I used to want second dc quickly after the first one, now I think IF there is a second it will be when dd is in school.

If dp goes to her she just wants to play. She has a dummy but at night only boob will do. Even if I swap boob for dummy when she is asleep already, she wakes up almost immediately.

I don't mind feeding to sleep as such, I just wish she would stay sleeping for longer. And it takes anything up to an hour and a half in the evening for her to fall asleep while feeding. Which is down to being overtired. I know the key to success would be prolonging her naps. Hopefully once she starts moving about more she will knacker herself out.

If we had good nights/bad naps or vice versa I could cope, so hopefully she will grow out of this 30 minute napping soon :)

I have ordered sleepytot to go with her dummies hoping that it will over time become her comforter.

Can you nap with her during the day? That means you get to catch up on your sleep, and she has instant boob access. Win, win! :-)

I really feel for you as I'm in the same situation! Friends babies all sleep way better and I'm just shattered.

My parents recently moved closer to me and now take DS out for a walk every afternoon so I can get 1 or 2 hours sleep which has made all the difference. Is there anyone that could do that for you? It's hard to sleep when they do when they only sleep 30 minutes. I find it sometimes takes that long for me to unwind and let go, then just as I fall asleep DS wakes up and I feel even worse than if I hadn't tried to sleep.

How do you get your LO to sleep originally? At a few weeks old DS could fall asleep on me whilst I was watching the TV. So I kept doing that. And couldn't understand why the evenings got harder - he was overstimulated and couldn't sleep. So now one hour before bedtime we stay quiet, no TV or music, then DH changes him and I feed him in a dimly-lit room (our bedroom) and when he's really sleepy put him in his cot. On a good day he'll then sleep 4 hours, which is a big improvement!

Also, once DH was on night duty and comforted DS to sleep but DS ended up wide awake wanting to play. DH just closed his bedroom door and ours and we listened to him babbling away. I was convinced he'd be awake for over an hour but within 10 minutes he'd gone back to sleep! I was

Unfortunately no relatives or friends that could take her out near us. Dp does take her out weekends so that helps.

I do find it difficult to fall asleep with her during the day, I think I have developed a mild OCD and just hypnotise her when she sleeps looking for signs of her waking up.

I know I need to do what your dh did Bartiimaeus and just leave her to it sometimes, I just want to go back to sleep so do what is easiest and feed her so she never falls asleep on her own.

I have started a wind down routine before naps so hopefully that will help. Also need to rethink the evening routine as while she loves her bath, it is far from calming, she gets so excited.

For now though I am just trying to go with it, as we are going abroad in couple of weeks to see my family which will be a big disruption so I guess no point trying too hard now and I will probably find it useful that she can sleep while bf when we are at the airport/plane.

Qwertina, I really hope some decent sleep comes your way soon. Agree with those suggesting that good day time naps can really help sleep overall. I would try for a nap a couple of hours after DD wakes up in the morning and that should set a good sleep pattern for the day in motion. I wouldn't worry too much about how your DD gets to sleep but more that she does sleep. I always found a good walk for the first nap of the day with my sleep resistant DS really helped and getting out just felt good (always coupled with cake stop :o) You can try to get her to sleep for longer but don't beat yourself up if she just won't. DS slept for 45 min naps until he started crawling then some epic beauties came our way....so things may well change. As for the night issues - we had a really rough patch around 4 months and then it really did settle down. I still Bfed DS once or twice a night until about 9 months but it was much more predictable so I felt far more sane. As for your upcoming trip it might not be so disruptive. We travelled for a couple of months when DS was 6 months and he was alright. Sometimes a change of scene can kick start a good sleep pattern so don't be too fearful. DS is 15 months now and I know it is hell when you are in the middle of a terrible patch (I really can relate to those feelings of frustration and anger followed by the guilt for feeling that way!) but in hindsight rough patches did pass and were just that - patches. I remind myself of this when any come our way! In the meantime rest when you can, enjoy the highs, ride the lows and we are all here to listen when you need an ear.

Thank you Dango,

I can't wait till I'm like you and come here to give useful advice and make people feel better rather than just whinge :o