No sleep, no routine, i have FUCKED UP

[CharliesMummyMeg]

Hello all.
I'm shattered, i have a 9mo son who co-sleeps and bf all night. Im shattered, recently broke my finger so any idea of a routine is out of the window recently. PLEASE HELP ME.
Im trying to get a new routine, up at 7am bed by 7pm please could you share your routines including nap time feeding times everything.
im at breaking point right now...

Can I suggest (don't shoot me anyone) that to get an idea of routines the Gina Ford Contented Baby Guide and the Baby Whisperer books are both very good.

And you haven't messed up - all you need to do is decide what you want to fix and then stick to a plan, IME consistency is the key for changing anything, you must stick with what you decide. A routine could look like this

7am - up - breakfast
9am-10am - nap
10am - snack / milk feed
12pm - lunch
12.30pm-3pm nap
3pm - snack / milk feed
5pm - dinner
6pm - bedtime routine: bath then story then milk

At this age I would say that you could try a "nicer" form of controlled crying -
eg: once settled for naps/bedtime I would leave to cry for 2 mins, then go in and put your hand on his chest until he settles and then leave again for 2 mins and continue. This could take a while to work but I prefer it to leaving them for long periods.

You can change this but you need to be committed as your son will take his guide from you.

HTH! please ask if you need anything else - and remember this will pass!

won't shoot you terrys I have referred to both with my own LO, & both are based on having your LO take a nap at a time of day when the body is naturally sleepy, (proven to be 9-10am & 12-2/3pm).

WRT the co-sleeping & bfing agree you could do CC with shorter intervals, or if you don't feel you can leave him to cry (I for one, couldn't) then you could try some of the BW methods eg PU/PD which will still involve crying, but your LO won't be left alone to cry. No Cry Sleep Solution by Elizabeth Pantley also has a more gentle approach to dealing with breaking sleep associations called Gradual Withdrawal.

Agree with PP if you decide on any form of sleep training you will need to be committed as it might take several weeks to be effective & many LO's do well after the first few nights & then suddenly regress. It may also be helpful if a partner or family member could help with the first few nights as DS won't be able to get his 'comfort' feeds from them.

HTH.x

Do you want to stop co-sleeping?

Bear in mind that a) you haven't fucked up and b) 9 months is the pits with sleep/teething/growth spurt and developmental leap all colliding to make the perfect storm. Made
Worse because you think it should be better by then!

Our routine at that age was:

6am wake and feed
7am breakfast
8.30/9am feed, nap
11/11.30am lunch
12pm feed then nap (DS couldnt last until 1pm for a nap)
2.30pm snack
3.30pm possible catnap in pushchair, not always if at home
4.30pm tea
5.30/6 bath (early if tired)
6.15 feed then fall asleep for bedtime

You haven't fucked up. It's bloody hard. There's no one answer and I don't have any advice but I'm sure you will find your way. I hope you heal soon.

All the posts above offer really good advice for starting to implement a routine if this is what you want? Are you co-sleeping and bfing all night out of choice or because it's ended up that way? I think it's really important to be happy with the choices you make and not feel pressured to do something because a) everyone else at the mother and baby groups are doing it or b) because you're desperate.

I do rate Gina Ford, having said that that, I don't agree with everything she says. But the principles of what she says are sound if you want a routine. At 9 months, I'd say something along the following lines:

7am: wake
7.30am: breakfast
9.30am: 30 min nap (may need longer if you've got a sleepier than average baby)
11.30am: lunch (can bring this forward if baby tired by this point: I went through a phase of giving lunch at 11am!)
12.30 -2 hour sleep
4.30pm - tea
6pm - start bath & bed routine, give milk before bed at 7pm

That's only what I was doing; my daughter was very average in her sleep needs but some may still have a PM catnap at this age. She was sleeping through the night at this stage.

I've got a 9 month old and this is our routine:

6:30 - wake up and breastfeed
8am - breakfast
10am - nap (1.5 hours)
12 noon - lunch
2pm - breastfeed
3pm - nap (1.5hours)
5pm - tea
6:30pm - bath, breastfeed, story - aim to be asleep by 7:30

Hope this helps. We've had major sleep problems since he was born so you have my sympathy. Hang in there - things WILL get better. Hope this info helps x

We need a flying pig icon.

Awake at 5am in bed with mummy BF doze.
Breakfast at 8
Take big sister to nursery
11.25 look sleepy
11.45 pick up sister from nursery
Decide playing with sister is more fun than nap.
Lunch
Grump
BF
Tea grump bf
On a good day let mummy put DSIs to bed
bF
Sleep sometime around 9

I have no recollection of DD2 taking a nap after she was tiny.
DD1 used to sleep for a chunk of the middle of the day probably 11-2 ish. Never got two naps to work, they were always too late and DDs wouldn't go to bed.

You can read all the books that you want but I reckon the most important thing is getting them used to sleeping at the right times first before worrying about where they're sleeping. Gina Ford and Baby Whisperer make a big deal out of not sleeping anywhere other than their own beds and also about not holding them... but I think it's more important to get their body clocks used to sleeping at certain times, then they become more pliable with where they'll sleep. Do whatever you have to, to make baby sleep at the times you know he/she's sleepy. Then worry about using the bed. I recommend using a sling to start the process of sending them off to sleep during the day.

My DS (9 months) co-slept and constantly BFd until we did CC at 7 months out of sheer desperation. He wouldn't sleep anywhere but on me, due to reflux/colic, was a little bit prem (36wks), and we'd had such awful BF problems that sleep really came second to getting food into him. We had been doing an evening routine for ages, but he just never settled instead sleeping and feeding on me until I went to bed, so when we started the CC we took the advice of friends and stuck to the routine like glue, and it seemed to help him understand what was coming. At 7 months, and on HVs advice, we moved him into his cot in his own room, stopped all night feeds, and did CC. First few days were awful, then it got easier, and now he sleeps so much better. He still wakes occasionally, but tends to self-settle before midnight, and often won't settle after midnight, no idea why...
Our current 'routine' is;
8:00/9:00am wakes up properly
9:30/10:00am breakfast
10:30/11:00am nap for 30-90 mins, different every day...
1:00pm lunch
3:30/4:00pm nap for 15-60 mins, again, different every day...
5:15/5:30pm supper
6:00pm bath
6:30pm BF downstairs
7:00/7:15pm goes to bed in cot - usually cries for 5 mins before falling asleep. Will sometimes wake and cry for a minute before going back to sleep every hour or two.
4:00/5:00am wakes, comes into bed with me and DH, BF then naps
6:00/7:00am wakes while DH clanks around getting ready for work, BFs, naps.

He's just woken up now as it happens, and not going back to sleep, damn teething! Off I go... Happy to explain more about how we did the CC if you're interested.

PS, sorry for mammoth posts, but meant to say (DS asleep again now), absolutely don't do CC if you're not comfortable with it, I wasn't when he was younger, despite everyone telling me that it was 'the only way to go'. Tosh, you know your baby, and you know what you're comfortable with, so don't be persuaded unless you're really happy to give it a proper go. Half arsed CC is torture for both of you, you have to stick with it to see the benefits, otherwise you've just put you and DC through weeks of crying for nothing.
I really sympathise, as I was told by everyone that a routine would fix everything, and we still had no obvious routine at 7 months. My sis kept ramming bloody Gina Ford down my throat ("well it worked for my 3 DC"), and my mum even said she thought there might be something seriously wrong with DS! Really helpful... It does help to read the books, even bloody Gina, as they all have useful info you can cherry pick.
Also, I'm still BFing throughout the day, to help him drop off for forming nap, and to calm him down when he's upset, mid afternoon before and often after nap. Still trying not to feed him once he's gone into his cot for the night, but am finding it v useful to calm his teething pain.
My DS happens to be a big screamer, to the point where my mum friends still comment on what a happy boy he is these days, in stark comparison to a few months ago when he was basically screaming all day and most of the night.
Before 7 months we literally had no routine at all, daytime naps were all on me, so if I moved or tried to put him down he woke, aaaargh. Also he didn't wean til 7 months either, as he gagged on solids til then.
If you do get him to settle at 7pm, you'll get your evenings back, and that made a huge difference to my sanity.
Very best of luck, hope my waffle hasn't bored you to tears...

I didn't have a routine with dd until she was about 18 months old . I really don't think it matters that much to be honest. Your baby needs love, food and care. Who cares what times these things happen? If you work then you need to structure things around that but until preschool routines don't matter in my opinion. I didn't get dd into a good bedtime routine until DS arrived when she was 2.5 as it was too hard without structure when I had 2. She was fine after that. I also coslept until she was 2 and he was 1. Both now sleep alone no probs. Both fed to sleep till 2 and 1 respectively and came off that easily.

Don't worry so much. I spent ages battling with routines that never worked, these things come naturally in time, honest :)

Oh and gf is a nightmare for bfing mums. Don't bother reading it!

startail you have really made me laugh.

A bit cheeky on a serious thread, but we had a very organised GF following mum in our NCT group and I was the only second time mum and totally disorganised.
In the end it doesn't matter at all, 10 years on we both have delightful DDs.
We just had very different ways of staying sane on the way.