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Help sorting 13 month old sleep - frequent wakings, prolonged crying bouts

14 replies

lonesomeBiscuit · 18/12/2011 17:43

Hoping for some wise advise. My 13mo's sleep is getting worse not better and I am so tired I can't function day to day let alone work out how to improve the situation. Sorry for the length of the post, I am trying to put down everything which seems relevant. Thanks in advance to those who read it.

A typical night involves him going to bed around 7.30-8pm, he is BF and feeds nearly to sleep then I try to put him in his cot awake. He is angry and protests very hard about this but can usually be soothed to sleep in his cot by a combination of patting/stroking/a still hand on his back or singing a lullaby (different things work on different nights).

He then wakes randomly, at least 2-3 times per night, but at different times. Sometimes he wakes at 10pm, 12am, 3am, 5am; or it could be 1am, 3am, 5.30am, or any variation really. I'm desperate for some continuous sleep (if I get 5 hours in one go, I feel fantastic) but due to the 10pm-midnight wakings even if I go to bed early I rarely get more than 3 hours in one go. Most nights I am up with him every 1.5-3 hours.

I used to always thought his wakings were down to hunger. Until about a week ago, I always used to feed him back to sleep in the middle of the night, as this was the path of least resistance. However, his wakings have been getting worse not better and we need to sort his sleep, for the sake of my sanity (I have been to GP as I am suffering problems with memory and cognitive functions which she put down to chronic fatigue). We therefore decided a week ago to night wean (no BF between 8pm and 6am). This has gone much better than expected, generally no harder to get him back to sleep than it was with BF, and he didn't even seem hungry at breakfast time, so I decided his night wakings must have been about comfort not milk. However his sleep is still just as bad, so the night weaning hasn't been the magic improvement I was hoping for.

When he does wake, he instantly stands up in his cot screaming for us. Usually the first one or two times per night it is relatively easy to soothe him back to sleep. I am trying to teach him to sleep in the cot, so I lean over and give him a hug which turns into lying him back down, then pat / shush him, and usually just the reassurance of a hand on his back is all he needs to relax and go back to sleep.

However, frequently we have prolonged screaming bouts one time per night, where he is awake but doesn't want to be, and pretty much nothing we can do can help. This happened before the night weaning as well as after, so it isn't just that he is hungry and/or cross about not having milk. It can start at any time of the night (last night, 3.30am, the night before, 1.30am) and often the time it starts will move back or forward by an hour each night for several nights in a row, then there will be a few nights' break. When he has these screaming bouts, it is very loud and angry/distressed crying (not grizzling back to sleep). Nothing we can do (including cuddling or bringing him into our bed) will stop him screaming. It will go on for 1.5-2 hours till he tires out and falls asleep. My husband says since he will cry anyway, leave him to cry in his cot, but he will cry for 1 hour plus, standing in his cot screaming (yet if we go to him, he still screams in our arms).

It isn't teething or illness. He's 100% fine during the day and was hardly bothered at all by the teeth that have come through already. In addition, this has been going on for months.

He naps well. 2 hours in the middle of the day. If he's had a bad night, he will sleep for 3 hours.

He sleeps much worse now than as a little baby. He used to sleep 9 hours aged 3-6 months, then hit a blip at 6 months, then went back to sleeping 7 hours from 7-9 months.

I went back to work at 10.5 months which hasn't helped, and I do think there is an element of separation anxiety at the moment, but his sleep had got bad before I went back to work, and we've tried co-sleeping and that isn't the solution either. He still wakes (and sometimes does the screaming thing), and I can't sleep properly with him in the bed. Also I feel the inconsistency isn't helping.

I don't like it when he cries, I hate even more the thought of leaving him to cry on his own, but don't know what to do. Certainly what I have been doing so far (feeding, soothing, taking him to sleep in our bed) hasn't worked at all. I feel I've made a major error somewhere along the way. I don't know what to do and would welcome a fresh perspective - my husband and I are so tired we keep going round in circles all the time.

Everyone I know is advising me to do controlled crying / cry it out. I don't want to but am out of all my reserves of energy. So many posts I've read say "I've done controlled crying and he just grizzled for 10 minutes" - but this IS proper distressed crying. I've no problem leaving him to grizzle to get to sleep.

Answers on a postcard, pretty please? Or suggestions as to a good sleep consultant.

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ladybirdsinmyeyes · 18/12/2011 18:01

This has been exactly my situation. I am starting cc now (my feeling is you will know the second you are ready and can take no more!) and don't know if it's by the book, but I went in after 1 min first then every 2 or so mins (my DD screams too, not grizzles) whereas I think other people say 1, then 2, 5, 10 etc, but I didn't feel comfortable extending. I only didn't go in if she'd started to calm as it started her up again. If she started screaming again, I'd start comforting again. With my son it took 20 mins ONE NIGHT but with DD it took one hour last night and heavens knows tonight. So I do know what it's like with the screaming and everything you've described is what we've been dealing with, but I do think cc can work if you are ready and if you are strong enough to keep going once you've started. Patient and authorative when you go in, using words they know 'Go to sleep' 'Night night' and a stroke or kiss. Sorry, it's a bit crazy here, better go...!

lonesomeBiscuit · 18/12/2011 19:45

Thank you ladybirdsinmyeyes. I'm sorry you have been in a similar boat, but your post has made me feel much better. It is really useful to have another perspective and to know how you implemented the cc in practice. It makes the whole process seem less scary.

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Samvet · 18/12/2011 19:52

Millpond sleep consultants worked for us.

Fenouille · 18/12/2011 20:45

I really feel for you. Working as well, you must be on your last legs.

We've been in this situation from about 5-6 months until 12 months (and both DH and I work ft so it was horrendous). People kept saying, "Just leave him, he'll quieten down," but DS was like yours, escalating screaming to the point where we couldn't calm him any more. We survived by co-sleeping through the worst nights (I don't know if you're willing or able to do that).

What has mostly solved things for us (and it was by accident) was getting out of the usual routine altogether. We went away on holiday (far enough for there to be jetlag) and when we got home he started going down a lot easier than before (although during the holiday he'd slept very badly). To start with it was just because he was knackered and glad to be home but it did seem to press the reset button with him, and apart from some relapses while he's been ill recently, he's a lot better. I don't know if it's practical for you to do something so drastic but perhaps just changing your routine completely at home might shake things up a bit.

Another thought: your post seems to suggest he's still in your room? Could you be disturbing him in the night? Is it possible for you to move him into his own room? I was worried to start with I would just end up going backwards and forwards but it did generally help the deep night wakings (although not the evening/early night ones).

You poor things. I hope you manage to find a solution soon.

omama · 18/12/2011 21:00

Hi there. I feel for you too - all those NW's must be pretty exhausting.

I think the biggest issue is that it sounds like DS doesn't know how to put himself back to sleep when he wakes up in the night, as up to now he has been fed, or assisted to sleep with patting etc. You've already made some fantastic progress by cutting out all the NF's so a huge WELL DONE for that. You say that was only a week ago though, so bear in mind DS has been used to this way of settling to sleep for a very long time, so there's no wonder he is still quite angry. With any sleep training it can take quite a time period for them to 'get it', and the older the LO the longer it will take. Many LO's also have a regression after around a week, so I think if you stay strong & resolute, & be persistent & consistent in your new approach then he will eventually get the message. You could also adopt a gradual withdrawal strategy if he is really struggling, so start by patting him at the NW's, then after a couple of nights just put your hand on him, then sit next to him, then with your back to him, & gradually work your way away from him so over time he learns to settle himself.

One other thing that comes to mind is BT. You say your DS naps for 2hrs in the middle of the day so is that 12-2pm? Have you tried a slightly earlier BT of say 7pm as it could be that he is a bit overtired & waking in the night from that.

HTH.xx

lonesomeBiscuit · 18/12/2011 22:36

Thanks for all messages. I am SO grateful. Some really good suggestions and your words of reassurance/support mean more to me than I can say. DH and I have got to the stage of blaming each other, so your words have really uplifted me. I will mull over things overnight.

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Fenouille · 19/12/2011 14:45

I hope you had some not-too-badly-broken sleep last night lonesome.

I just had another thought too, about naps. Adding to what omama says above, are you sure he's getting enough daytime sleep? DS naps at least 45 minutes in the morning and 2 hours in the afternoon (2-4pm). That sees him through until about 7pm (we start the bedtime routine anywhere between 6.30pm and 7.30pm depending on how tired he's acting).

'No Cry Sleep Solution' has a table of how much sleep an average baby needs at any age, including naps and night time - perhaps it might be worth seeing if he'd like to go down for a morning nap? Our CM says she tends to see children drop their morning nap between 12 - 18 months, but DS is nowhere near wanting to drop his.

TheLaineyWayIsEssex · 19/12/2011 14:51

Marking my place in the shameless hope for some tips.
waves to fen
my ds is almost 13 months and from10 weeks til 8 months he slept through, and napped well in the day.
He has now dropped the first nap unless we are in the car, so I just don't think the post lunch nap is enough, he is then not sleeping well at night, illness and teething aside. Things have got bad in the last few weeks. I havd done some rersearch and heard there is a big developmental leap somewhere between 11.5-13mo which can rally affect sleep.
Fingers crossed you find a solution that works.
No practical advice, just much sympathy.

Fenouille · 19/12/2011 15:40

waves back to lainey

It's a nightmare isn't it? Even if you think you have solved the problem you can never quite be sure as there's always a growth spurt, or developmental leap, or illness, or teething, or something and don't get me started on those smug bastards whose children slept through from day1 And everyone is just so keen to tell you to "leave them to cry, they'll learn." Argh.

Massive sympathies to all of us trying to find the solution...

TheLaineyWayIsEssex · 19/12/2011 19:55

The thing that annoys me is whenever anyone asks if ds is a good sleeper, dp always says yes. Which is true, if you only count the days when he hasn't got a tooth coming, isn't riddled with some mystery virus, doesn't spend the night coughing his head off, or those nights when we can figure out what the heck is wrong.
Yep, briliant sleeper.
He is also refusing to go to bed tonight. I don't have the strength to try CC, so he is up, but will try again in ten minutes.
This is the boy who has been up since 6 and only had one nap

the omly thing I can say in his favour is that unless he is in a lot of pain, he does resettle quickly in the night with a quick tuck of the blanket or put dummy in

lonesomeBiscuit · 20/12/2011 07:32

Thanks for all the additional messages.

One thing that really resonated on reading the messages was omama's comment that he doesn't know how to put himself back to sleep. I was of course sort of aware of this already, but it was getting obscured by all the other thoughts going round my head. I had a moment of clarity on reading that message, when I realised that bringing him into our bed has made matters worse, in that while it was a useful tool at the time, it has confused him as to whether to expect to go back to sleep in his cot or expect us to get him - so no wonder he stands up and screams for us. I am therefore concentrating on settling him in his cot.

Had better nights the last two nights - first waking not till 1-2am and could be patted back to sleep in his cot within 10 minutes, but then he started waking again at 4.30, took half an hour to pat him back to sleep, and he then only slept another 45 minutes before waking at 5.30 and wouldn't go back to sleep after that (he was hungry, so I got him up and fed him).

The daytime sleep idea is interesting, so thanks for that omama and fen. He goes to nursery when I'm at work and only gets 1 lunchtime nap of about 1.5 hours, at weekends he tends to sleep for 2.5-3 hours. I do think he is tired but had it firmly lodged in my head that he shouldn't need more than 2 hours daytime sleep, so I hadn't thought of trying to get in a morning nap. My DH is convinced we should be cutting down his daytime sleep to improve nights, and I have been arguing against this!

Fen, the resetting idea does make sense. I had forgotten till I read your post that one series of early wakings was solved when we had to take him to casualty in the middle of the night and he was up 3 hours. He slept in till 7.30 like a dream for the next month!

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Bossybritches22 · 20/12/2011 07:39

Lonesome Just another thought. I was advised to put a top or jumper I'd worn somewhere in the cot (I tucked it under the sheet smoothly near her head) as the mummy smell often helped reassure.

Seemed to work for her/me!

SleepDeprivedGrumpyBum · 21/12/2011 12:48

Oh my goodness Lonesome are you me? do you have my ds? I could have written your post, only difference is that I've not night weaned because I'm too knackered to be awake any longer than about 5 minutes. I also work stupid hours, some days starting at 5.30am (so 4.30 am start) and some days finishing at 11pm (don't get home until nearly midnight and then will only get to stay in bed until 6am ish with DS. I'm so tired i could weep)

I've just posted about trying CC when we move house, but i've held off doing CC as i worry it wont work.

No advice to offer as such, just solidarity! Xmas Smile

lonesomeBiscuit · 21/12/2011 22:03

sleepdeprived I'm so sorry to hear that. It is so hard, isn't it, and your working hours sound dreadful, much worse than what I have to contend with. Doing those hours must be hard even without an external factor preventing you from sleeping.

Although (as my post makes clear) I don't have the answer, I hope that knowing there are others out there in similar boats helps you. It has helped me feel a lot better about the situation, in that all the people we know in RL have much better-sleeping babies, and my DH had started to question why our DS was so bad (and imply it must be my fault).

I know how hard it is to make any changes as I have been so afraid that if I change anything, it will lead to me having even less sleep. In fact, the night weaning hasn't been as hard as I feared, and at least it means that I feel we are making (small) progress. He does now settle in his cot in 5-10 minutes in the very early hours (as opposed to the 20-30 minutes which it used to take when I was feeding him), although after 4am he is still a nightmare to resettle. However, we weren't co-sleeping all night, only bringing him into our bed when he woke at 4.30/5, and I imagine that will make weaning harder (whether you try to wean him while co-sleeping or change him to his own cot at the same time). One thing that surprised me is that I genuinely believed he was hungry, which this was the reason why I kept on feeding him - but it is clear now it was (mostly) comfort.

I'm going to be away now for a few days so won't be able to respond to any further posts, but am really grateful for all the help and advice.

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