How to stop rocking to sleep/extend naps - 16 week old

[Galapasnickle]

I would be grateful for any ideas on how to stop rocking our 16 week old DD to sleep and get her to go to sleep on her own. Also, how to extend catnaps into proper length naps? I am feeling a bit overwhelmed by the amount of advice out there (Baby Whisperer, No Cry Sleep Solution etc). And she is getting a lot heavier and my back is about to give in...

For the first 12 weeks of her life I was stuck to the sofa as she would nap on me after feeding and would wake up immediately if we put her in the moses basket or pram (although she would sleep in the basket at night). If she woke in the night, I would feed her and then it would typically take between 1.15 and 2 hrs each time to get her back to sleep (a combination of rocking and feeding). She was also quite colicky/windy in the evenings with lots of crying.

We are now able to get her to nap sometimes during the day (not on me!) by swaddling her and rocking/bouncing her to sleep (feeding to sleep seems to work less and less). The rocking can take anything from 5 mins to 30 mins (usually with a fair amount of loud crying) and she will then typically nap for 45 mins and wake up cranky. She occasionally naps for longer (2hrs or so) but I can't see any pattern as to when this is (although it is usually only in the morning). At night (and when she wakes in the night) we do a combination of feeding and rocking (and it still typically takes an hour and a half to get her back to sleep). Though once asleep we are very lucky as she can go for long periods at night.

She is a fantastic baby but so much happier (understandably!) when she is well rested. She generally feeds well and is gaining weight. She was born 2 weeks' late (I was induced and had a C section). She doesn't sleep easily in the pram or car (health visitors don't seem to be able to believe this!) although will sometimes drop off after 10 mins + of high powered screaming (and then wakes up after 30 minutes or if the motion stops). We often end up having screaming meltdowns when out and about which I think is down to overtiredness.

Any ideas/experience in weaning the rocking/extending naps/encouraging sleeping in prams much appreciated!

Hello all,
I ended up ordering that cocoon thingy last night, trying anything really as it is really driving me crazy. Last night he slept at 8:30 gave him a dream feed at 11:30 (he never woke up) then he was up at 2 for a feed (or I thought he needed one) and he was up again at 5, by which time I was fed up and brought him in our bed and he fell asleep till 7. He was first in my arms but then managed to free my arm and he still slept on his side sniffing my pillow.
This morning then it wasn't pleasant basicly until now, 11:30 he's done two major screams first before falling asleep briefly at 8:30am (took me 20 minutes to settle him) only to nap for a good 15minutes!!! ... then took me half an hour to settle him from 10 to 10:30 when he slept until about 11:10 - so just for 40 minutes max. Now, i gave up brought him downstairs and he is kicking on the bouncy chair with the occasional yawn but i needed a cup of tea and to eat something. I wish someone can see into the future to tell me there is an end to the screaming before sleeping thing ...

Yesterday i went out briefly and he went into a screaming mode after he fell asleep in my arms where i was and then when i put him in the pram he woke up. I don't know what people thought (maybe I shouldn't care -but you do really.. or I do) he was screaming his head off, thought not to pick him up and cuddle him in the pram first... but that didn't work, so picked him up... finally he settled, not to sleep though...
I do hope today is a better day... good luck all of you, at least we're not alone.
xx A

HOw is everyone getting on?

I think the screaming has gone down for us (it is still there but for shorter periods) but the naps and times seem to be all out of routine. naps are never very long (1 hr max) so that seems to upset everything.

and last night ds was up for two hours in the middle of the night and wouldn't settle - i'm blaming the heat!

Tell me about it - we were up between 1 and 3.30, no idea why it took so long (she has always taken ages to settle but that might be a new record). The last few days it has taken a long time to settle her in the evening and I usually end up feeding her to sleep although sometimes that doesn't seem to work either...

Naps are going a bit better though - she goes to sleep a lot quicker in the cot and some naps are over an hour. Yesterday we had three naps - 2hrs, 40 mins and 1hr 40 - which was amazing, although it all went downhill at bedtime. Don't know if she is napping better because getting such rubbish amount of sleep at night! Also at night the new settling technique (holding arms and sshing) doesn't work for some reason (maybe she's overtired).

By the way, I'm still posting on the babywhisperer site (the props section) in case that has any helpful tips for people.

Am988, did the cocoon thing help at all? Fififrog, how's it going with you?

Hi Galapasnickle & Fififrog,

Funnily enough, on monday my ds was also awake at that time between 1:30 and 3:30! He napped great yesterday, with naps of 1.5 hr and then nearly 3hrs - but the night was rubbish again. He also napped in the pram as I was out which was amazing. The night wasn't good at all - & i seem always to be half awake as i hear him move about kicking and trying to sleep! When I try to settle him he is just kicking away as hard as he can - he seems so full of energy there's no way i could get him to sleep. I did all the right things (or i think i did - obviously there's something i'm still missing), i.e. gave him bath at 7... even a little massage, i BF him at 8 i thought he'd sleep right away - but I was so WRONG. As soon as i put him into his cot he was wide awake ready to go. He finally went down at 9:30... but was up again at 10:30 and 11:30 and 1:15 when I fed him again... then he was up close to 4am and I was so fed up by that time that i brought him into bed with me (yes i know it was very wrong & i completely gave in but i needed sleep badly). Fed him this morning at 6, he went to sleep from 6:30 and 7:30 up properly at 8 and now still awake at 09:30...

I got the cocoon thing yesterday - but I have not rinsed it yet (will do it today) also I got the 1 tog and i think it is a bit too warm for these hot nights but it seems it is getting cooler now.

Anyways good to know I'm not on my own - will check out the babywhisperer site.

Can I join in? DS is 8 weeks and takes good hour of sh pat to go over at night. During the day it's 45 fight for tops 45 nap. Find it hard to stick to long term consistent plan as DD is 2.3 and I can't leave her to fight him down during the day. Sigh.

Can I join in too?

Same story over here - DS (16 weeks) went mental during the super hot weather and took days to get back to normal. Now we are back to 40 min naps with 10 mins of screaming before he'll go down.

We just stand in the same spot and pat his back / sssh in his ear until he falls asleep and then plop him down in his cot when he is properly conked out. I know it can't continue like this though (he's getting heavy and the screaming is disturbing the neighbours!).

The thing that I don't get is that he seems to hate going to sleep. It doesn't seem to matter how early I try to put him to sleep, as soon as we go to that spot and start patting him on the back, he starts to scream.

I know - mine is the same, you would think she hated going to sleep too, although she is so much happier after it. My favourite things that people say to me at the moment are: 1. just put her in the cot if she is tired (babies will sleep anywhere) and 2. if she won't go to sleep, maybe she's not tired.

Sorry - know that's not helpful, just ranting! DH just trying to get her to sleep as I've given up...

Sorry to hear things haven't improved for anyone :(

It is so frustrating that no matter how hard you try to get the right moment they still cry, isn't it? It is definitely taking less long these days on a good day, but so unreliable. Don't want to try putting her in the cot to nap til I don't have to fight the tears. At night I am reducing the amount of holding after she falls asleep, which is going well but unfortunately she's not sleeping well just now. One thing gets better, simething else gets worse...

hi my DS is 9 weeks so a bit younger than yours but similar patterns with mainly sleeping on me/DH, resisting sleep etc. gala is the gym ball helping? DH uses it along with a dummy but i haven't got the patience/knack! he finds if ds has already cried for a bit first (with cuddles + reassurance) he doesn't have to bounce for nearly so long!

i think one of the main reasons he wakes back up is the startle reflex - he's always whacking himself in the face!
wondered if anyone's tried the ergo cocoon to any success? also do you think the 3-12 month would be ok for a 2-month old or could he slip inside itg? he's 10lb so not a big 9 week old.

tbh i tend to feed him to sleep as it's easier/more guaranteed but do you guys think the sooner i try to change that, the better or does it make no difference when you face the music and try to wean them into better habits??

sorry all lower case one handed!

hope things start to pick up for you all, am988 read your last post about all those night wakings and totally sympathised, sounded rotten.

Not that I do it myself, but I wouldn't worry about feeding to sleep at 9 weeks, plenty of folk I know are still doing it at 4-5 months. I think you'll be fine as your husband can soothe your son you know that he can go to sleep without being fed.

my ds was like that when he was few months, use to have to scream to go to sleep not pleasent! i brought a white noise cd, made sure he was well fed put him in his cot put the cd on full blast and he falls asleep peacfully at last! he too use to cat nap 40 mins max, but since using white noise has really helped get atleast 1 and half hour naps, hope this helps

Hi Looby, we've not actually used the gym ball in the end as we are managing to get her to sleep by sshing and holding hands/hand on side of face in cot for most day time sleeps now, so my knees are slowly recovering!! A friend used a gym ball for rocking her baby to sleep though and said it was fantastic.

Can't seem to manage it for nighttime sleeps though so still feeding to sleep... And she's almost 20 weeks so you are doing really well.

On the Cocoon, it has worked really well for us, even with her arms out. She's 15lb and the 3-12 month bag looks quite tight, but I think it is supposed to, otherwise it won't work. Hard to imagine how a 12 month old would fit in it.

Glad to see the posts and once again I'm not on my own...

Happy to report that nights put downs are getting better (I need to touch wood here), but naps it is hit and miss, sometimes it is so easy it is unbelievable, at other times it is just impossible. It didn't help that we were away for a few days, where we were he slept ok.. still the usual ritual of crying (which occasionally escaltates to a scream) in the pram, but coming back home it is back to square 1 with naps. yesterday the only naps he had were in my arms our bed, and once in the pram whilst for a walk.

Today no naps at all... after an hour of trying to put him to sleep - sleeping for 10 minutes than up again, crying.. screaming, down for 5 minutes.. etc, I now gave up, he's up kicking on the gym! I m thinking eventually he will get tired to fall asleep... he can't stay awake for ever right?

Hope you ladies are all keeping the patience and smiling :-)

Good work on the nights and hope the daytime gets better soon. We're the opposite! You can't have it all, I guess.

We've just moved her to her own room, so will have another go at cracking the night put downs soon when am less tired. Last night she only woke up twice (hurray!) so hopefully things are improving...

galapas how did it go in her room? ds is taking less time to settle to sleep... but we have at least one major scream to sleep per day!

It's going ok so far... She only woke up twice last night, once at 9.50pm (took 20 mins to feed and put back down - she fell asleep feeding - this is a record for us!) and then at 2.10am (although 1.5 hrs to go back to sleep :() and woke up for day at 7am. Naps today also good - 1.5 hrs this morning then 45 mins at lunchtime, both not too long to settle and she ended up sucking her thumb to sleep. Just gone for third nap and different story though - think we are like you with at least one major scream per day. Also think I left her too long before nap, as had only had 45 mins earlier. Bet she wakes up any minute so am seizing opportunity to have some lunch!!

Things still not perfect by long way, but so much better than when I started posting, I just can't believe it. Shows there is hope for even the most hopeless case!

Oh no, woken up!

OK, spoke too soon (again!). Last two nights she has taken four hours to settle for the night - crazy mix of feeding, rocking and soothing in cot. Took her to doctors today just in case but all is fine (and she was smiling at doctor, typical).

How's everyone else doing? Better I hope!!

We had the same rocking prob until 4.5 months. Did PUPD for two days and she screamed every time we put her down again! In the end we let her grizzle for ten mins (angry shouting not screaming or crying) and she fell asleep. We've now given her comforter which also helps her self soothe etc.

Good luck and stick with it. I am so pleased we've stopped the rocking as my friend still rocks her 3 year old every night!

Hello, it did get better, the screaming every time he is tired generally stopped - only occasionally I have to put him to sleep with screaming (having said that today he did scream to sleep this morning).

He is starting to get used to it I guess. For the nights it is my husband who puts him to sleep.. every time - and it seems to work. As for naps, I try - but I don't fight him too much, he eventually falls asleep when he is ready, although not always for long (could be 40minutes). It just seems that the less I struggle and worry about it the better...

Galapasnickle.......You have described my baby perfectly!!!! No one can believe she won't settle in her pram / car seat etc. Rocking is the only way I can get her to sleep. I'm so glad it's not just me and know exactly how you're feeling!!!!

Don't worry Cockle, you're def not alone, judging from this thread and others I've read on Mumsnet! How old is your little one? My DD is now 23 weeks and things have improved for me lots since I started posting so don't give up hope.

Since the crazed four hour stints at the beginning of last week, things have looked up and she seems to be settling quicker, touch wood, without rocking (good as she is too heavy for me now!). I always speak too soon though, so let's see... We are completely dependent on the dummy too and the health visitor says I prob need to get rid of it as she can't replace it on her own (i.e. can't go to sleep independently). I think we are a way off this though and at the moment is the least of my worries.

Starting food at weekend so hopefully that will help with sleep too!

Hello All,

It is true what galapas said, when you are in it you will never believe that it will get better. This thread has helped as at least you feel that you are not on your own and you are doing nothing wrong. MY DS is much better now, of course i do get the odd 'bad one' as we call it (which includes screaming, arching back, kicking, pulling my hair etc..) but generally it is fine and he is falling asleep on his own in the push chair - and the bed. hope i'm not speaking too soon as welll...

What helped for me to stop rocking is the Pick UP Put down method - and to shisshh and tap his back - we're cutting down on that now - the important thing is to be there for your baby - ... don't worry although it seems like forever it will get better, DS is now nearly 22 weeks..

take care all,
xx A

Just after some advice regarding cuddling to sleep. DD is 5 months old and is a great sleeper with the exception of teething. However, the only way she will fall asleep to begin with is being cuddled. Does anyone have any tips/tricks on getting her to fall asleep in her cot rather than in my arms. She has been formula fed from birth and had slept through the night from 5/6 weeks.

TIA