'Sleep training' - not working!

[fifitot]

Apologise in advance if anyone sick of my moaning as am on tons of sleep threads. However am very desperate.

DS is nearly 7m and I return to work in 12 days time! He sleeps in his cot in our room and currently wakes every 3 hours and wants a feed. Not sure if this is comfort or hunger but at his age I suspect the former as he is currently weaning slowly onto food and also BFs during day.

Naps well during day - 3 naps, put into cot without a feed and sleeps well, the longest is about 1.5 hours. Has a good bedtime routine of bath, BF and put into cot usually half awake at 7. However from 10 that is when all goes to pot. Wakes every 2-3 hours but the worst of it is, doesn't settle well after a feed and thrashes around crying and I have to settle him in his cot by holding his arms down! (Wish I'd swaddled him - too late now.)

I have not had a good night's sleep for the whole of his life so far and am on my knees. The thought of returning to work like this terrifies me.

Have tried pat/shush and also cc to some extent but the improvements don't stick iyswim. He goes off to sleep after a bit but at the next waking does it all again - crying up to 2 hours. Have kept this up for a few days but there is no long term change.

Not sure what to do? Can he really be hungry and need a full BF at 10, 1, 4 and 6? Can I reasonably cut one or two out or will I have to just cut all out in case he gets confused.

Please please post anything useful. Thanks.

What about rocking fifi? We've managed to get dc3 to drop the 10.30pm feed by rocking her in the cot. Sometimes it seems pointless but after 5 or 10 mins of rocking she becomes stiller,puts her little arms down and goes to sleep.And somehow dropping the 10ish feed has made her sleep better.

Not sure our cot would rock but I will try Loo. I had DS weighed today and he has dropped a centile, through not taking enough solids I am told. It's not a huge problem but worried now that is genuinely hungry during night. Trouble is if he is full of milk he won't eat food!

I think I may have to do all or nothing with him as selecting feeds to drop seems to be confusing to him I think - but who knows!

I will get DH to offer a bottle tonight at 10 wakening and see where we go from here.

Thankyou so much everyone - really appreciate that you post as it helps keep me sane!

Fifi - DD2 had dropped a line too, she is teething, started crawling today and has had a cold!!! In the last few days we have taken to giving DD her dinner at 4pm then letting her feed endlessly until about 6 then at 6.30 just before we go up to bed she has a bowl of yogurt with fruit puree (I make her a biggish bowl) and feed her until she refuses any more then we do bath and bed routine and she feeds both sides in the dark in her room. We brought bed forward to 7/7.15 (as we found with DD1 that the more tired she was at bedtime the less she sept at night)I feed her until she unlatches one side then sit her up wriggle her so she wakes enough to realise she wants more food, about then offer the second side until she is sleeping and put her in bed. I woke with a huge fright last night at 3am as she still hadn't woken up and lay there like a lemon until 4 when she stirred so I fed her before she was properly awake and put her back down and she woke at 6.45. I am taking it asa 1 off and not planning (although am praying) on it happening again.

Thanks - similar stories make me feel better!

HI Missalien, thanks for that. I think I may try it. He currently sleeps with me but does need to get into his cot especially as he will be crawling soon, so I may do exactly what you did. Would you repeat the same thing when he wakes up and again at nap times? Do you think it's a bit harsh to do this and transfer him to the cot at the same time? Thanks again, I do need to do something. I counted the wakings again last night and he's still waking 15 times per night :-(

oh! Fifitot, I wouldn't worry about dropping a centile on the weight chart. My baby did too a while ago, however I spoke to a nutritionist who said that the weight charts are based on bottle-fed babies and the normal profile for bf babies is to drop a centile on this chart! So my HV was worrying me for no reason!! This may not be the same for you but I felt much better when I was told this! Hope this is reassuring :-)

Thanks but think the new ones are based on BF babies. Still.........he's not lost weight just gained more slowly which at this point is probably normal - I hope!

Pickles dont worry just go for it. Could be some long nights but they sleep better and will be happier babies ive definitely noticed a difference. I didnt say a word, just settled him, the shh ing distracted his crying eventually as did the gentle patting , I didnt leave his side pm I would not say it was controlled crying which I dont like the sound of, and I live in a flat with a teen too we all need our sleep! Because you are there patting him as soon as he cries it settles them quicker I think. Its been four nights and it worked the first.

missalien, I think I will do it. So you imagine that he will wake as frequently as normal at first and that I/we should repeat the process each time throughout the night?? I'm really not looking forward to it but your way is MUCH kinder in my mind so we're happier trying it. Hopefully I'll be posting with a success story soon.....????

I reached the end of my tether, I felt like it was going to be him doing the crying or me! They need sleep. They like sleep. And their cots . He will feel so much better as will you. The first part is hard cut just do not give up as you will have to start from scratch . Gentle soothing patting til he is finally deeply asleep. Its harder at the first bit but just keep telling yourself not to give in. Get a comfy position resting on the cot! I did 1230 am until 2 am then again at half five for forty five mins. Then that was it! He has been up twice or three times at night for nearly ten months and was breast fed for seven. You ideally want him down seven until seven and they can do it they do not need to snack all night! Look forward to hearing how you get on best of luck! I am still waking a lot at night as I am still in that sleep pattern myself! Need someone to shh pat me! Be brave and patient and determined! Good luck. Sorry for the hi jack !

Thanks Missalien. Fingers crossed THanks for all the advice. Yeah, sorry Fifitot too, am desperate as well! Good luck to you too.

Our cot doesn't rock but we rock it anyway fifi we just grab the side and rock away. You do need to tighten up the screws once in a while though!
DC3 has probably started to gain weight less quickly too but I'm avoiding the hv until she's eating better (things are improving but slowly and I don't want any melodramatic hv advice like offering cheesy wotsits (seriously a hv suggested chocolate buttons and wotsits as good finger food for dc1) ). I have noticed that if dc3 only bfeeds 2x in the night she eats solids better in the day but I'm not going to starve her into submission yet.

Hi, just to feed back that we tried missalien's suggestion (stroking to sleep) and it's working. We went from 15 to 3 night wakings in one night!!We're now down to just 2! Amazing! It's quite hard for the first night as ds was awake, crying for a long time each time he woke. So he woke very tired and unhappy the next morning with red puffy eyes and a scratched face (if you try it cut baby's nails first!). However, he went back to sleep far quicker the next night and woke much happier in the morning. The best thing is dp can get ds to sleep far quicker than I can. I would definitely recommend this technique. THanks missalien.