PUPD, CC or something else...?

[explodingbosoms]

Right, we've pretty much decided to wean our breastfed 7mo off her remaining night feed. I know there have been a thousand threads on this, but I'd really appreciate input on which is the best method.

She currently has a dream feed and then wakes for another feed any time between 2am and 4am. I've been holding off feeding her until 3am recently.

My instinct is to go for PUPD as I'm a bit of a wuss and might get stressed out by CC. But if it's going to be more effective, I'm willing to give CC a go.

I would love to read success stories of whatever method you used to cut out night wakings/feeds.

(Though if you've been successful, I suppose it's unlikely you'll be hanging round the Sleep section on Mumsnet!)

Many thanks in advance

I've had success with patting DS the instant he wakes (we sort-of co-sleep), or picking him up, bouncing him till drowsy again, putting him down and repeating.

But at 8 months he still needs ast least one night feed around 3-4am, and one around 10pm if he needs some comfort due to teething / upset stomach.

According to the sleep books it's normal for babies to still need a night feed until 9-12 months.

CC is really designed for babies who can't settle themselves when they go to sleep and can't get themselves back off when they wake from each sleep cycle - ie babies who are waking every 1.5 / 2 hours during the night. If she's sleeping for longer than this at a time, it's unlikely to help you much. Even with CC, a baby who needs a feed will still wake for it.

Ah thanks. It's all so confusing!

She is usually able to self settle at bedtime and at times throughout the evening and night. Normally sleeps 3-4 hours at a stretch (did go for 8 hours once upon a time but those days are long gone!)

So it seems controlled crying is not for us.

Any other thoughts anyone?

I would stop the dream feed first. Leave it a few weeks and then do PUPD. I've used PUPD with huge success, worked fast and with little crying HTH

Would you not want to just wait for her not to need or want it? I wouldn't be keen on cc.

Then again I would love my eight month old to only wake once! (other problems, sleep bf association)

cargirl, I had wondered about that.

marshabrady, the problem is I don't know how to tell if she really does need or want it. She never exactly gulps it down. And often she'll wake up earlier in the night and we can settle her back to sleep. But after a certain time (3am) I'll offer the boob. It's like I'm initiating it and I'd like to at least try to stop. Trouble is, she's never really had obvious hunger signs so I don't know how to "read" her.

We've had periods where her sleep has gone mad, and I've longed for her to go back to one night waking, so I feel your pain!

sorry, cargirl, didn't finish sentence. I had wondered about dropping dream feed first. But worried it'll mean she wakes for two feeds.

Good to know that PUPD worked for you.

I dropped the dream feed and it made no difference so at least I could go to bed earlier I also think it helped them stop associating having a full tummy with sleeping IYSWIM

Do you offer the dream feed or does she wake for it? Can you try leaving her to see if she wants the dream feed and see what happens to the 3am feed after a few nights? Perhaps your DH can try and resettle her instead.

My DS is 11 months and needs at least one night feed, two if he's not eaten properly in the day (that is between 6am-6am). I never did a dream feed! Typically he'll wake between 10 and 1am for one feed.

You said you offer boob after 3am - can I ask why? What happens if you leave her? Sometimes DS wakes up and mutters/moans a bit, but I only go to him if he sounds upset. Usually he can put himself back to sleep after about 20 mins of this!

Just as an aside - DS is fed to sleep for most nights at the moment and he can still self settle in the night.

Igglybuff (sleep guru! I recognise your name from other threads where you have been very helpful), sometimes she wakes for the dream feed, usually we pick her up from sleeping.

The reason I offer boob after 3am is because I have been working on the assumption she's woken for a feed, and I'm trying to push it later and later. But yes, I'm not entirely convinced she actually does want a feed. It's just v tricky to settle her without one and I don't know how to do it!

I tend to go in soon after she starts whingeing as I think if it escalates she'll be harder to settle. Maybe I should try leaving her a bit.

Last night was tiring. Fast asleep from 6.30pm, woke briefly and resettled herself a couple of times in evening. Sound asleep when I picked her up for dream feed at 11pm. V good, I thought!

But then she woke at 2am (nb she goes for 4 hours between feeds in day). I offered her a feed as she is teething and has upset tummy so has been losing a lot of fluid, er, out of her bum. She was not interested. Changed yet another dirty nappy. Gave calpol for sore teeth. Still did not settle. Eventually fed (half-heartedly) at 3am. Was not really screaming throughout any of this but sort of "eh-eh-EH-EH" crying.

Then she was up at 5.40am for the day. JOY!

Obviously the teething/tummy trouble is not the norm. But it's quite common for her to be up from 2am to 3am until I feed her. I need techniques for settling her in other ways! At nap time I go in and out reassuring her if she needs it, or rub her back if she's crying. These techniques don't seem so effective at night.

Sorry for long post.

exploding - not a guru, more far too much time spent on mumsnet and reading lots to help get DS on the road to decent sleep

2-3am seems to be a prime time for babies to wake up and be harder to settle - as this time of night they're in a lighter sleep. My DS has recently got over the worse of a horrible tummy bug and would be awake for up to 90 mins from 2am. Usually with bad wind. Best I could do was sit him facing outwards on my lap and rub his tummy gently which seemed to help.

How do you try and resettle without feeding? Do you pick her up and rock or leave her in the cot and pat? With DS, what works is having his head on one shoulder, rocking and patting his bum rhythmically whilst sshhing or saying time to sleep in a dead pan voice (!).

I have noticed that DS is more likely to wake up at 3am ish if he's not eaten properly in the day - so make sure your DD is properly established on solids with two protein portions a day (although they have to be properly balanced out with carbs - too much protein can make babies unsettled). I think babies need roughly 50g or a day. DS didn't get properly into solids until about 9 months. So have a look at your day schedule and try and make sure she's getting enough food. You might need to increase the frequency from 4 to 3 hours.

Thanks Igglybuff. We usually try to resettle by patting/stroking, without actually picking her up. Sometimes it works, sometimes not. Though in desperation I rocked her to sleep for her nap this morning (going against all the advice in the books!) and she went off fine.

Last night I skipped the dream feed, and she slept from 7pm to 12.35am, then woke again at 4.35am. I fed her both times, as awful teething is putting her off her solids in the day so I think it's best to feed her when she wakes in the night for the next couple of nights. Having said that, she was not interested in her morning feed at 7.15.

I'm not sure whether to skip the dream feed again tonight. She's so unsettled at the moment, I just don't know what to do. What do you think?

She's just woken up from yet another 40 minute nap... groan.

My Ds will be 6 months later this week.

After speaking to his dietician (he was prem which is why we have a dietician) she told me that he did not need to be fed at night, so I tried PU/PD - I started in the day last Monday. By Friday he was sleeping through to 5.30 having been waking at 1 ish 3.30, 5.30. On Saturday I tried PU/PD at 5.30 and he slept a further 2 hours (I only had to pick up 3 or 4 times) following night was very disturbed but still did Pu/PD about 3/4 times 3/4 times a night. Last night he slept until 7.15 am. I am still doing a dreamfeed. Again on the advice of his dietician.

I am sure this wont last but I found PU/PD very easy no stress and little crying, and I finally I have a routine in the daytime too.

He has always been very easy to settle though

Thanks hilda

My dd has always been fairly easy to settle during the day and at bedtime, but not really during the night.

We had a better night last night. Down at 7pm, dream feed at 10pm, then she woke for a feed at 3.45am and slept until 6.20am.

Not what I hoped to be doing at 7mo but a good night by recent standards!

Her naps yesterday were utterly crap so I was surprised. Honestly sometimes I think there's no rhyme or reason to any of this!

We've now had a further 2 nights where he's slept thrpugh to 7/7.15 although still had a dreamfeed, wish I'd tried PU/PD sooner now!

Wow that's brilliant hilda. V tempted to try PUPD....

I'm tired.