HELP ! how do i stop feeding to sleep..gently as possible

[hazhawken]

Hello,
My dd is now 9 months old and she breast feeds to sleep still, and (co-sleeping), wakes up on average every couple of hours or so to be fed to sleep. she can settle self to sleep in car and buggy so i know it's not the only way she can go to sleep.. but at home, she expects the breast for all naps and night sleeps (and all night wake ups..). i was fine with it until recently.. i remember at 4 and 5 months people saying that we need to be able to put her down awake.. but it's never been an easy thing to do... so never happened. And now i've had enough - want at least a bit of my life back.

SO, now i want to stop feeding her to sleep and would be SO grateful for any tips on how to do this (as gently as poss, though imagine some crying will be involved, so attached is DD to her boobs !). Ive tried the pantley gentle removal plan from the 'no cry sleep solution', but no real separation of feeding and sleep after doing this for at least 2 months. Don't really want to make her go cold turkey and do the leaving her to cry it out thing..
Have any of you out there used a particular method or found something that worked well for you ? all advice gratefully received

thank you !

We had this. We used a combo of rocking and a rhythmic pat as a sort of bridge. The pat became a crutch to use instead of the boob, although with a few months overlap, and by just over a year he'd be put-downable in his cot with a bit of patient nappy-patting. Self-settles beautifully now - just wish he'd stay asleep!

Hazhawken, are you intending to carry on co-sleeping with your DD? If so, how do you anticipate getting around the proximity of your boobs to her during the night? I'm in the same situation as you with 8 month old DS. I want to continue co-sleeping, but would like to be able to get him to sleep in a bed without feeding off (like you, he can also sleep in the buggy). I can imagine that I'll spend ages working on patting and shushing to sleep, only to sleepily hoik him on the breast in the night and ruin it all!

Incidently, we've never been able to put down drowsy but awake either. He has always jolted into upset alertness when we've tried it.

No help to offer I'm afraid. I'm in exactly the same position with 9 month old DD. She's waking every 45 mins for boob! I'm honestly considering CC at one min intervals.. or maybe PUPD. I can't see a way forward unless she learns to self-settle....or maybe I'll try rocking/patting (but this involves picking her up and even if she does fall asleep she'll wake as soon as she's placed down again!).

Still enjoy the co-sleeping too and worry that it will be too traumatic for her to be moved to a cot AND required to self-settle.

Nice (if that's the right word) to meet others in the same boat!

Hope to hear some more tips! :)

Hi there

we are in similar position with 4 month old DD- only thing I would add after reading NCSS is the pantley pull off method is all well and good, but the bit that surely will make the difference is the putting down not asleep- in the book she says to try laying down drowsey then patting/shusshhing, trying that 3 times and then if your DD gets tearful or upset to stop and feed to sleep. I guess the only way to make a big difference is to consistently try this method for every waking, and I think book says to tackle night time first... my DH is off work in 2 weeks so all things being well we were going to tackle this then, and for us the easiest thing is for me to feed DD, then DH take her and put her in cot. This is something I worry about- part of me has always thought she would grow out of this but starting to see this is not the case.

HOW ANNOYING I have been out tonight for a meal and FOR FIRST TIME EVER in her life, DD has gone to sleep upon an early waking without the boob and DH is very smug!! So he can definitely help out with this part.

Good to hear others experiences...

Not sure that you can not feed to sleep and co-sleep. Seems unfair to me. I must adnmit I fed all my babies to sleep but did not have the probelm of continual night waking. There were obviously some unsettled nights whereI would bring baby into bed and sleep while feeding but I returned them to their cot when they were asleep.

What about breastfeeding to sleep in the evening and then putting baby into a cot. Yopu could then try other measured for settling during the night rather than a breast feed. Mind you, if breastfeed gets you all back to sleep quicker, is it worth it?

i did dr jays night weaning but not till 22 months. even then i did a much gentler modified version.

i think explaining to them what is going to happen - ' we can't have boobie in the nightime, mummy will say ssshhh its night time and we will just cuddle etc etc. but may need to be older than 9 months

Watching this thread with interest as in exactly the same position with 16 month old. My plan is to feed to sleep as usual but then let DH deal with the night waking and co sleep while I sleep in the spare room. Will let you know how it goes.

thanks for all your messages - good to see i'm not the only one in this boat..

Mears - i used to feed DD to sleep and then put her in a cot - but then we'd have the problem that she'd wake as soon as i put her in cot so we'd pick up and put down or feed to sleep again.. so ended up co-sleeping as so much easier. but THEN she started waking up more regularly, so feeling more tired, and a bit stuck.

mummagumma - if i do try to stop feeding her to sleep, I was thinking of using a cot again, at least until we've got the sleep better. doesn't seem fair to have her boobs so close and be denied them. i think we;ll reintroduce the cot slowly - put in room then let her play in it and then sleep in it last.

scarlett 175 - thanks for reminder of NCSS put down pick up method when drowsy.. that seems more gentle than CC..

my aim with all this is for her to sleep longer periods than 2 hours at night, and for her to go to sleep (and stay asleep) more easily.. i've been thinking about starting with the day time naps - helping her to fall asleep without boob in daytime then deal with night times after that., so not suddenly all then nothing.

any more gentle suggestions or inspiring stories on this topic welcome

I found reducing the feeds by a minute a night helped loads. I picked a feed (e.g. first one to settle at night) and timed it teh first night. I think it was 20 mins. Then, each night, I knocked off 1 minute. By about 10 mins DS got a bit grizzly, and at about 6 mins had to do a bit of CC but it wasn't too bad and worked a treat as he was kind of used to not having a massive amount then anyway. It takes a while but is quite gentle- much more so than PU/PD, I found.

Hope this helps!

Hi Hazhawken

Just to add for the last 2 nights we have been trying to implement NCSS put down method, still feeding to drowsy/very sleepy then putting in cot, trying 3 times then if she gets too upset going back to feeding til in a coma :)

with mixed results but some improvements... Thursday put down at 8, woke at 10.30 dad shusshed back to sleep with no feed, woke at almost 1am, I gave small feed then straight back to cot (we used to have 1 hour feeds then wait for a deep sleep so this is big change) she woke ten mins later, i held her patted her back, then asleep til 5am, again quick feed then back down in cot. Last night was a bit dodgy but I think her reflux was bothering her, down at 9, woke at 2 for feed, then took an hour to resettle :(

She went down very early tonight, 7.30 so wait and see how it goes. This is a big change for us as previously we used to keep her downstairs with us on the boob until she was DEAD asleep- this could take ages whereas at the moment as soon as her eyelids get heavy I am taking her straight up and trying to put her down- and its not as disasterous as I thought it would be. I guess the difference with your situation is the co-sleeping... sometimes I bring DD in our bed if she wakes from 4/5am and she latches on and off like a limpet so would be much harder to even be aware of, let alone control... let us know how its going...

It's amazing how many of us are in the same boat but i'm so glad I'm not alone!

DS is 8 months old and is holding my boobs to ransom. He recently fell out of my bed when we were cosleeping so my mattress is now on the floor and we are co sleeping again. He did go into his cot for a few nights but he cried to the point of being sick because i wouldnt give him boob.

Let me know how you all get on. I had been feeding DS through the bars (i know its a great mental image!!) to get him to settle and for him to know it was ok to fall asleep in his cot so i'm thinking if I do this again and then after say 3 nights implement feeding with a transitional object then after 3 nights try and withdraw the boob or cut down the time he has it. How does that sound?

Who needs sleep techniques when you can just muddle through and do anything possible to get some sleep

what an adventure this getting to sleep is !

DD has really been holding my boobs to randsom too - a couple of nights ago she was on them all night pretty much and i was exhausted the next day. think it's at least partly cos she's got a big old cold and possibly a bit of separation anxiety.

i keep swinging between wanting to do some kind of sleep training out of desparation, and wanting to wait and not do anything becuase it hasn't felt rigth to really let her cry it out.. yesterday though felt like a bit of a breaking point.

but hooray, last night was better because i've made a couple of small changes and in the last 24 hours i got her back to sleep from half awake 3 times with no boob - yay !
-- i'm co-sleeping so i made sure that i stayed awake while feeding in the night and de-latched so i got more comfortable sleep for myself, and meant she wasn't on it the whole night.
-- when she wakes up until now i've always thought that she would wake up fully if i didnt feed her, but yesterday when she was waking up, i patted/rubbed her bottom and sang twinkle twinkle, and the next time i said a little phrase which i've been saying as she's been going to sleep (tip from no cry sleep solution) 'shh shh it's sleepy time' and it really did the trick - she just disappeared back to sleep. i was so excited that i couldn't get back to sleep !
so she had 4 hours with no boob from 3-7 am, aand it was all done gently. a vast improvement.

so i'm going to keep going with these two for now and if it stays bad /doesn't improve and i feel i can't handle it, we're going to try the Jay Gordon appraoch drjaygordon.com/attachment/sleeppattern.html when she's 12 months old (she's 10 months now) which we found on the web.if we can't wait that long, we'll have to think again - though day by day seems to be the way to take it.

anyone else having progress on sleep ?

I used this advice and it helped a lot. Basiaclly introduced loads of other sleep cues that didn't require my presence before I stopped feeding to sleep. I never feed them to sleep now. Still other problems sometimes... but that's a whole new story! :)

I've been feeling your pain!!!

My DD is 7mo and has co-slept since birth (in a side-car arrangement to our bed). I've just started putting her down instead of letting her use me as an all-night human dummy and am having to tolerate a little crying. But the crying so far hasn't been big style screaming and stress increasing, more intermittent protesting. After I've put her down for the night (at around 1900) I pop in the room from time to time and she stops instantly when I do, which suggests to me she's far from inconsolable (obviously before I join her in bed myself).

I found that doing ssh/pat, Pick Up/Put Down and Pantley Pull Off actually stresses her out more and results in far more hysterical crying than when I've left her (with a few very brief returns) to get through her frustration at wanting to suck something and settle herself to sleep.

It's only Day Two, but she's fallen asleep by 19.30 both nights - quicker and with less high-voltage crying than when I was trying the other "gentler" methods. [don't jinx it emoticon]

Last night she proceeded to self settle after each wake-up (a couple of which were more widely spaced than usual), each time with less complaining (although a fair bit of fidgeting). I lay and listened, but did nothing - poised to intervene if she sounded like she was getting distressed at any point, but she didn't. Previously I've put a hand on her tummy, or tried to stop her fidgeting or Ssshed her and actually, it's all made her worse and I've had to offer the boob = worse sleep for me.

The whole thing is actually proving less stressful to both me and DD to do it this way, it seems. I'll let you know how it goes!!

Good luck with your LO - it's not easy, is it?

Hi Haz,

I had the exact same problems when my DS was 9-12 months old. We did manage to get him to go down without bfing for his dad (I would bf downstairs straight after his bath, then get jamas on, have story and dh would take him upstairs and lie down with him) so at least I could go out sometimes. But spending almost every evening bouncing up and down the stairs to settle him, then finally giving up at 9ish and going to bed, was a total nightmare.

I also read NCSS and didn't find it overly helpful (did anyone actually keep a sleep diary? Please!!! I'd much rather spend the time, well, sleeping!)

DS carried on waking up through the night to be fed even after we had cut down bfing in the day to 1 or 2 times. In fact the first night he slept through properly was the night after I stopped breastfeeding entirely, when he was 14 months old. Prior to this he had always become really distressed if I denied him the boob at night, but by the time I stopped he was annoyed, but not distraught, at the change. We found "spooning" was a good tactic - I could give him a hug in bed without pushing my boobs in his face!

So I'm sorry I don't have an immediate solution! But the nighttime breastfeeding did come to a natural close, and I did gradually get my life back - eventually! DS has mostly slept in his own room since he was 2 (he's 2.9 now) but recently seems to be spending rather more time in "mummydaddybed", with DS2 imminent I'm worried it's going to be a little crowded!

I remember at 9 or 10 months feeling like DS would be utterly dependent on me forever. I was terrified that I'd never have a night out again, and that he would be traumatised by me going back to work. I did, and he wasn't. It will get easier!

Sorry just realised I didn't read your post from yesterday! Congratulations! Sounds like you are finding a way through.

Hope the success continues!