Tedious skiing novice thread alert....

[elliott]

Want to go on first skiing trip as a family next year - ds's will be 6 and 4. I've never been on a skiing holiday and I don't knwo where to start! Some questions:

1. Easiest flight destination is Geneva - resort recommendations please?

1. Should we go for package or independent booking? What company I haven't done downhill skiiing before, dh has done a little. I am wondering about whether to get private lessons for myself and ds's together but haven't a clue how to go about it! Alternative is ski school for them I guess but what about me?

1. Might be good to have some childcare available, but not essential. what kind of accommodation and food options are there - would be nice not to have to cook, and also we don't want to share a room with ds's.

Sorry these are kind of dull and basic questions - suppose the most useful would be some recommentations of good companies so I can browse some brochures!

Try Ski Esprit. Brilliant for families and our friends use them every year. They have a website & brochure. Good Luck!

Another vote for Esprit. We have been with virtually every company, and independently, and this was the easiest - they take care of all the hassle. Sadly my DC are now at the upper end of the age scale (no cut-off, just that it is mainly parents with smaller children - about the age of yours!) Any of their resorts would be okay for the kids so would choose according to whcih is best for your ability.

As your kids are no longer babies I would avoid the Mark Warner type hotels like the plague !!

We just went to one and it was full of screaming babies - and harldy any older kids - my dd is 6 now- and it was so hot - they said they had to keep it hot for the babies !!!

Nothing against babies of course - just that when you don't have one you don't really want to hear other peoples 24/7 !

Next time we will be looking for a chalet with chalet maid. Someone told me to look at a website called ChilliPowder - haven't looked yet though.

Lessons wise I'd put the ds's in half-day ski school, they would be together most likely. And either do a few days ski school yourself or get some provate lessons. Once you have decided on destination ask on here as there are loads of skiers who know good instructors all over the place !

Thoroughly recommend www.kinderhotels.com Cheaper than the SkiEsprit/MarkWarner style and far higher quality product, including full time childcare (and ski lessons), all inclusive meals, children can have own bedroom. Disadvantage: not all staff will speak English, not so many other English holidaymakers. Really fantastic value for money.

OK, thanks for the responses - so you don't think it would be feasible for us all to learn together? i thought it might be more flexible than doing ski school and then something for me - and after all, I'm about the same level as them!

elliot - even if you are the same standard adults & children tend to be in seperate classes. Kinderhotels (we stayed at one 2 weeks ago) are great but if you have never skied before I suggest booking with a UK based specialist.

Good point re using a UK based specialist - anyone recommend a good one for skiing virgins? I was thinking about private lessons with an instructor for all of us -is that a mad idea? Completely unaffordable?

Children learn in a different way to adults, so no, it isn't feasible for you all to learn together. For one thing, their ski are much shorter and they have amuch lower centre of gravity!

At 4, your ds2 would probably be in a "tinies" ski class - only 2 hours, as it is tiring for them. Your 6 year old is on the cusp - he can either go in to the tinies class or can go into the standard kiddies ski class, which is usually c.4 hours. Depends on how strong/fit/mature he is - and also on the local resort.

Try to get an English ski school if you are in France, rather than using ESF (Ecole de Ski doe France). Many of thier instrucotrs still haven't got up to speed with the new tecniques that modern skis require, plus thier classes can be very large. Magic in Motion in the Three Valleys are good but expensive (but you get what you pay for).

If you are ski virgins, I owuld recommend that you go on a pacakge. Ski Esprit have a good reputation. Also try Neilson. Look at the recommendations on here as well - I think it is SKiFamille who get a very good write up.

Thanks, that's helpful. But at this rate I can see myself opting for a quiet read or shop while the boys are at ski school

Hard to predict what ds1 will be most suited for - its nearly a year away. I am anticipating that he will be technically well suited to it (he's been riding a bike since he was 4 and seems to have natural balance) but he is small and a little young to enjoy 'lessons' - he hates his swimming lesson. But, in a year's time he might well be able to cope.

we have used skibeat . Cheaper than esprit/MW but good. Have childcare (British nannies) and are all chalets which I personally think works best with children. They are only france though so you wouldn't be able to fly to geneva but they do go to some good beginner resorts.

If you go to a chalet or a hotel with childcare that does pick-ups, then you too will be able to go into ski school! They do beginner classes for grown-ups too, you kow!

In fact my dh only started skiing when he was 34 - althugh it didn't click that year, within a few years, I had created a monster and skiingin is now our compulsory annual holiday!

If you child is mall, then that actually helps with learning to ski. The taller, lanky ones can have more problems, according to our ski instructor friends.

What about trying some dry slope lessons before you go ? We went with new skiers this year and they had taken some lessons before we went and it made a vast difference to the speed the children progressed at. The mum took private lessons after a few days group as it was confiendence she lacked and it made a vast difference. ds3 is going to start lessons once he is 3 so he will have had a couple of months on a dry slope before we ski next year. I've heard good things about Powder Byrne, but know it is expensive. We book independently, but go to North america so no language problems.

Like your DS mine don't like classes, they accept them as the lesser evil than not skiing. Would recommend English speaking instructors - the best we had were in Niederau Austria (not a bad transfer from Innsbruck - similar flight time to Geneva), the worst were ESF in Morzine.

Thanks for the further tips - will have to check out where we can get to, must fly from Newcastle which will limit us a bit - but I'm sure they go somewhere to france!

Many of the package holidays tracvle to French resorts from Geneva, so don't worry. In fact, I think of all the times I have flown with a package - and I've always skied in France - I have only once flown in to Chambery and the rest of the time it was Geneva.

I know it won't be popular, but can I put in a plug for Scotland - the ski industry is really suffering from the media perception of climate change, with the result that everyone believes there is never any ski-ing in Scotland. In fact there is ski-ing at 5 resorts from November to April (and last year there was ski-ing on midsummer's day), with fantastic tuition.

The other benefit is that you are not 'stuck' in a resort, there are loads of activities to do if the weather/snow isn't great, and it's cheap! We go every year and I love it. And the mantra goes 'if you can ski in Scotland, you can ski anywhere'.

And there are no queues - straight onto the lifts!

OK Tortoiseshell, tell me more!

Another vote for Esprit.

Also as a beginner I would recommend a group lesson for you rather than a private one. You will get worn out in a private laesson as you will ski non-stop.

In a group there is a bit mre standing around to wait for others to do their bit. Believe me this ma sound boring/rubbish but you will be glad of it.

I found I learnt more in a group leson as even when its not your turn - you learn a lot from watching other beginners. You get less disheartened as well, everyone else is falling over - not just you.

Sorry elliott, only just got back.

We usually go to Aviemore, ski-ing at Cairngorm, which is great for beginners, has a nice funicular up the mountain, is very 'consumer friendly'. Plus Aviemore as a centre is lovely - there is a steam train, plenty of wildlife parks, stuff for kids. some pics here of a good day in Scotland!

When Scotland is good, it's fantastic. The problem is that it isn't totally reliable, it's wise to book not too far ahead, as the snow CAN let you down. Also, it can be bitterly cold.

Good times to go - February half term is often good for snow, but we find it a bit too cold for the children, and it is a little busier on the slopes.

Easter week - usually end March, beginning April. This is my preferred time for going - you often get 'lambing' storms, dumping lots of 'spring' snow (nice for ski-ing - not too icy,but firm) round now. It's that bit warmer, the weather is less stormy (winds sometimes hit 190 mph on Cairngorm) and everything activity wise is up and running.

There are loads of places to stay in Aviemore - we usually stay here but there is a myriad of choice - loads of hotels.

Don't know about childcare I'm afraid - we take a grandparent!

It all depends what you want - I am a big supporter of Scotland, as have been there 29 years out of the last 30 (only missed last year because was about to have ds2!), but I know it's not some people's cup of tea. Have a look round the winterhighland site linked to above - have a look at pictures, reports, see what you think. Scottish ski tuition is the best in the world, and the ski industry really needs supporting at the moment. People just don't believe there is ski-ing there unless there's snow in their back gardens, and the industry is suffering badly.

24thJunelastyear and April last year

The tragic thing about those photos from April last year is that there should have been hundreds of skiers enjoying the snow, but because of our biased hysterical media, hardly anyone went up there. I couldn't understand why when I was getting so much more tired than when I was little or a teenager, and it's not just lack of fitness, when I was a child you would wait 10-20 mins for a lift, now you ski straight on, and the slopes are really quiet.

EVERYONE, GO SKI-ING IN SCOTLAND!!!!!

I've only used ski-esprit once and they weren't that great - they were ok but the chalet was a bit tired and worn at the edges, they were expensive (hence I wasn't expecting a tired chalet) and basically the people in charge were simply too young. having said that their concept of having "snow rangers" to take kids to lessons and pick them up is great - as a non ski-er you might not realise just how significant that is - when you're ski-ing and you've got your own lessons it's very difficult to do that yourself. It's not like picking them up from activities at home. - you've got heaps of clobber, boots that are a slag to walk in (so have they) and you'll be half way up a mountain having gone up 3 or 4 lifts to a really good blue run to practice on and they'll be at the bottom. As others have said learning together just wouldn;t work - kids will spend their first week on tinsy nursery slopes and maybe the odd proper run - their patience and stamina is in much shorter supply than adults. hence the 2 hour lessons. (often their fear and nerves are also in short supply but you'll probably have to wait til holiday no. 2 to fully appreciate that .) ski-esprit do snow club in teh afternoon - a mix of indoor nad outdoor activities.

I've also been with ski-beat - they seemed better organised - chalet was lovely and I was more impressed with and confident in their nannies - but (at least when we went with them 2 years ago) they don't do the snow ranger thing and they don;t do a "club" like thing - if your kids are having ski-lessons you take them in the morning then you have one of their nannies to pick them up - and she'll be "your" nanny for the week - on the one hand that's great but on the other hand the kids do really the ski esprit approach because they meet new friends and it's labelled a "club".

Someone said you can't use ski-beat if you want to fly to geneva because ski-beat are only in France - not necc true as geneva is the nearest flight destiniation for several french resorts.

I would certainly recommend using a package - there's an awful lot to sort out otherwise - including transfer, equipment hire, booking lessons, ski-passes, child-care - you'll have loads of questions about how it all works and I wouldn;t try do it yourself first time round.

i would also say that child care is essential. you simply won;t have time to learn yourselves without it - you'll have about 90 minutes max sk-ing a day - you won;t be able to ski together - you really can;t take novice children with you if you;re a novice - so you'll have the length of their lesson minus some mucking about time (you'll be stunned by how much of that there is) it's an awful lot of money to spend for not a lot of ski-ing.

I absolutely whole-heartedly recommend it btw. learning is hard but it's so worth it.

Thanks hatswoman, loads of good info there.
Tortoiseshell - Scotland is interesting for me because we could just about do it for a weekend from Newcastle - probably something to think about once we can actually ski!
DH can already btw - not particularly well, but at least he isn't a complete beginner.
Do you think it would be more fun for me to learn something different like snowboarding?
I've sent off for brochures from esprit, skibeat and skifamille, so I may come back with more questions....
Thanks again

The advantage of you learning to snowboard (and it pains me to say this, as a committed skier) is that it is (apparently) quicker to learn and also it would mean that if your kids later decide that they want to snowbaord, at least you know how to and can help them.

Of course, skiing is much better!

Ds (6 and has just had his third week skiing) is expressing a desire to snowboard. We'll be able to put him off for a few years, until he is more ready to go out independently, but we may need to take a few lessons ourselves to support him.

I learnt to ski first as did DP although now we are both into our snowboarding(at 36 an 37). This year is the first year we will take DC, DS1 5 and DS2 3. In fact we are going this Sunday. DS1 is booked into ski school and DS2 in a creche with snow garden, so he'll have the opportunity to ski as well. We found as snowboarders, snowboarding is actually harder to learn, you have to go with the pain for about 3 days. falling over on knees and bum and pushing up again will happen numerous, too many times to mention. After a good 3/4 days of sticking with it you show be up and off, then that's it. Skiing was far easier to learn, (two planks, two feet), however far more technical, 4 edges compared to only 2. So for this reason, and also balance, DC will ski to start. We are going to Montgenevre in France, although flying into Turin, 1.5 hr transfer. we have a little apartment, DC will have their own room. Hope some of this helps.

Thanks TwirlyN - are you going with a company?