new 'new parents in bereaved families' / 'unconventional families' topic?

[dreamylady]

Hello - Since joining MN about 6 months ago I have been looking for threads relating to unconventional family set ups - I'm not sure where ours or others like us fit and wonder what the interest would be in starting one up.

I have been with my partner, a widower, for two years and we have a 4 yr old child who's first mum died when DD was still a baby - we now all think of me as her mum, not stepmum, (which to me implies the existence of another mum somewhere.)

Should there be a topic for new parents joining bereaved families (not very catchy!) or casting the net wider a more general 'unconventional families' topic? Other families may have different stories, eg 'kinship adoption' where not formal adoption but the child is living with aunts and uncles etc. Or even others like surrogates / IVF where child is not genetically of both parents (if there are even two.

There is a bereavement topic on widowers in relationships but most of the issues families like ours might face are about 'becoming a parent' (in an unusual way) and 'parenting' (in unusual and sometimes quite isolating circumstances) so the thread would best fit in one of those.

My own wish specifically is to find other mums /dads, especially mums, in a situation like mine, negotiating their way through the particular joys and challenges of this kind of family set up.

I'm really interested in advice/views from MNers as to:

should there be a topic?
what kinds of families should it include?
what should it be called? (unconventional / non genetic / nuclear free /patchwork families...add your suggestions!)
where should it go? (what main section - either parenting or becoming a parent i think)

Wouldn't this make you more isolated though?

How about starting a thread rather than have a topic? Like the Bar in chat or Gest. Diabetes threads in health.

Hope you are able to dive in to topics rather than lurk.

Where are my manners? Welcome to Mumsnet!

dreamylady

I am not in your position and therefore dont know how you feel so forgive me if this is totally the wrong thing to say

I would have thought the very fact your dd sees you as mum would re-assure you that you dont have different issues to the rest of us in terms of parenting/families iyswim

of course not being in your position I may be missing the point. If I am please ignore me

wow two replies already!

thanks Margo - have thought of just starting a thread, but where was the problem - any suggestions? or maybe you mean just do as an when by 'issue'?

frasersmummy Yes to an extent i do SWYM and I don't want to isolate myself - but I already do feel a bit isolated - OK some egs

telling new people about our situation (its hard not to whenever you meet another parent, innocent conversations about maternity leave, are you having another, how long have you lived where you are all lead down the path to 'dd's first mum died when she was x months old' - bit of a conversation stopper at kids parties!) People have actually seemed to avoid me afterwards.

managing relationship with MIL who had a big part in looking after DD and is very (a bit too) attached to her

manging dd's seperation anxiety (only surfacing now as she's begun to call me mummy)

wondering AIBU when i get affronted that despite knowing the situation i'm referred to as stepmum (Think I am being a bit unreasonable but also hope its not inexcusable)

general lack of peer group / introduction to being a parent from not being involved in antenatal / post natal / coffe mornings / NCT groups / having any contact with the whole bringing a baby into the world process so kind of feeling on the outside. Probably similar in some ways to adopters but they have support networks and when i've tentatively approached not been exactly encouraged to get involved - don't think they see me as one of them

feeling like i haven't shared that birth rite of passage like most other mums so not quite 'one of you'

etc (sorry there is good stuff too which i promise i would share as well when i get my thread going!!)

dreamylady, I (personally) think MN has gone topic mad, the (very small and suppressed) hippie in me, wants to just say "cant we all just get along!" but realistically I understand what you mean. The problem is there are so many infinite different types of families you run the risk of being in a topic populated by one. But I dont know. Really, I dont care as I just want everyone happy So would of course want you to have a place you can talk.

I just wanted to say though I really feel for your situation. I can imagine you feel rightly defensive and possessive of your DD, from one Mother to another it would kill me if I had to be forever proving my claim to DS. You are your daughters Mother. Of course she has an honoured Mother to remember with love but for her short life it has been you. And that deserves respect, just as adopted parents deserve respect.

Reading your post I was struck by the enormous amount of situations you will run into these problems. Can you legally adopt your daughter, so you are no more her stepmother than any adoptive mother would be? Just trying to think of some solutions for you, I can see how hard it must be, you must be forever treading a line of respect to the deceased Mother and asserting your own rights and protecting your DD.

Well there you go, probably no help my post, but I just want you to know I feel for you, and I for one have all the same respect for you as a Mother as I would any other Mother.

drawtheline, what a great post, thank you so much for your thoughtful words - dp and i have talked about adoption and i'm sure we'll get round to it soon! It will certainly help in official situations (though i tend to brazen that out anyway now) but not in 'real life' IYSWIM.

You're right i don't want to be on here posting to myself - just want to see whos out there i suppose.

if nothing else i feel more confident about being part of MN now! and getting some ideas about how to use it better...

Drawtheline I also meant to say specifically that your affirmation of my 'motherness' made me well up - it meant more to me than I would have predicted and I think its because it comes 'from one mother to another' so thank you so much for that.

dreamylady.. I see exactly where you are coming from now .. missed the point a bit thr first time sorry..

From a completely different perspective I know what you mean about telling other mums your story. My first little boy was stillborn at 39.5 weeks. I now have a 4 yr old ds so the difficulty for me is the whole.. oh is he your only one or will you have any more etc

I dont really have any useful tips for you except to say that people do tend to say things without thinking ..usually they dont mean to hurt.. theye just havent been in your circumstance

Even if you dont get a whole section to post on I hope you can find support in the more general sections of the site

Sounds like you are a great mum .. having missed the sodding awful wonderful life affirming experience of giving birth doesnt make you less of a mum .. dont let anyone tell you it does.

dreamylady I am glad I could help you at least feel better in some way. I think, there will always be Mums who dont include you. But there are also Mums who dont include me, and I daresay most of us. If they are like that, move on. If I met you and heard your story I would not exclude you by any means. I think the school gates can be a very lonely place. My DS is only in preschool but I feel such an outcast taking him there, and the weird thing is, I cant work out why. There is definitely an in, and an out. Sometimes I envy the other Mothers their apparent normalcy, but then if I were not the loon I surely am I wouldnt have such an interesting life and a delightfully quirky DS. So while I dont get included in Mummy chats as much as I would like, I do get my DS talking about music and ideas and books that he wouldnt otherwise know.

(disclaimer) I am not boasting by any means. I dont look down on the mums in the "in" crowd. But I try to be friendly and get in there and somehow there is a door closed, so I have to just go, ok, and see the great things in my life that are unique to our family. And think their loss.

Can you think of a blanket line you can use in these situations that will inform, put down objections, and state your love for your DD all in one go? And then just recite it til you are sick of the sound of it? Like "DD's birth Mother died shortly after her birth and I am the Mother she has known and been raised by" or even bugger it I dont know you are in such a pickle arent you because you dont want to be dismissive of your DD's birth Mother's memory. I was going to say treat it as you would an adopted child and just offer no explanation at all, THIS IS MY DD. No one else's business. But you cant really do that in your situation can you.

I would say certainly if someone calls you stepmum correct them without hesitation. Just say, I am the only Mother DD has known and there is no "step" in our relationship. Dont be shy. Say it kindly with a smile on your face and people will take it in.

If you want to talk more outside MN you can email me at senatorvass at gmail dot com

I waffle

thanks frasersmummy, you and drawtheline have made me feel much better about this and more open to giving it a go in other threads to see what happens. suppose i need to get to know my way round MN better so i know best places to post.

Frasersmummy I'm so sorry to hear your story, something similar happened to a friend of ours and it was really really hard. It kind of puts my awkward moments into perspective - i struggle with people feeling sorry for me but with my story the reactions are more for my dd so its not so intense really. There is also a bit of what seems almost flinching - a primeval / superstitious fear of being near us - my dp thinks its just shock because people can't help imagine it happening to them and some of them want to avoid being reminded of it.

drawtheline you have so nailed it about the isolation from the 'in' crowd - i suppose lots of people feel a bit on the outside of something, especially the ones of us who are a bit different to start with (or think we are ) I have always been proud of the things we do a bit differently and to be honest get a bit of a buzz from going against the grain slightly and challenging convention - so the flipside of being so 'interesting' is that to some people you are just wierd or intimidating.

I have kind of started using a script along the lines of 'dd's first mum died when she was x months, her dad and i got together a year or so later and i have been her mum ever since'. It still hard to say matter of factly and calmly because of waiting for the response, but i suppose I'll get better with practise. Gladly I don't have much conflict about talking positively about her first mum because we were friends but this makes it even weirder for some people. oh i mean more interesting (!)...

thanks again for your support and I may well get back to you for some much needed solidarity at some point. I'm off to RL now for some quality time in front of the telly with dp (he deserves some solidarity too i think!)

night all

dreamylady - just wanted to say thanks for starting this thread - even if it doesn't get its own topic, you've started something here clearly!

I so identified with most of what you say, as my husband died when I was 5m pg with our first child, and we were living abroad.

It was very hard coming back to the UK, meeting up with other mums in the park, having the conversations about where you live, why you've just moved, what your husband does, will I have any more children etc ... all very normal questions but horrendous to answer when your life isn't "normal".

This doesn't answer the question about whether we need a whole new topic but just wanted to say that you're not alone in facing these problems and I'd be happy to chat about it more.

Fatsuma - I am at the thought of having to deal with something like that, terrible in any circumstance, but you living abroad presumably a long way from close friends and family, and then having to get yourself home and start all over again?!

How old is your dc now? Is life more normal yet?

(sorry for timelag, have had mum visiting this weekend)

I think an "unconventional families" topic might be a nice umbrella name for lots of types of families that have separate boards right now, but none of them get much traffic (thinking gay parents, single parents, step-parenting, bereaved parents... must be others).

hmm interesting idea - the MN admin could maybe look at that - tho maybe all those topics will say nooooooooo!

Sounds like a few people could be interested but mostly the advice is to stay with the mainstream and maybe start a specific chat thread..(at least maybe for now until people start to come out of the woodwork.)

Last call, shall I take myself off to _chat then?

Thanks for the lovely messages and for making me feel more normal