New feature: suggested thread titles when posting

[KatyMumsnet]

Hi all,

We’ve made a small change to the thread-creation page that you might notice.

When you start a new thread, you may now see a suggested title based on what you’ve written in your post.

The aim is simply to make posting a bit easier. In user research, quite a few people told us that thinking of a title can feel like a small blocker when they just want to get their question or situation posted. The suggestion is there to help with that - you can use it, edit it, or ignore it entirely and write your own as usual.

Clear titles also make it easier for other users to understand what a thread is about and find discussions later on.

Just to be clear:

• It’s only a suggestion, not something you have to use
• You can change it or delete it completely
• Your post content is not changed in any way

We’re flagging it here so people know what it is if they spot it.

As always, if you have feedback about how it works in practice, we’d love to hear it.

Exactly. This is using AI for AI's sake, and actually making something worse.

Just because something exists doesn't mean you have to use it, though from what I hear from my friends, the pressure from companies to make all their employees use it, is ubiquitous. Which given the environmental aspect, is appalling.

There's a current thread about hospital visiting where the title bears little relation to the dilemma. The OP is getting a lot of flack for using a misleading title and has said that she used the title suggested by MN/AI and didn't realise she could use her own instead.

I've also seen a lot of thread titles recently that are almost longer than the actual OP. Are they "suggested" too? If so, they can fuck off.

I'm not impressed at all with this move @KatyMumsnet

It's pointless and infantilising.

I can write my own titles, thank you very much, and they're much, much better than the shitey ones suggested by AI.

Banal and bland. No, thank you.

Maybe if MN really want to offer this option there should be a ‘Do you want AI to suggest a title?’ option that the user has to tick Yes to before it comes up.

The thing is, even if a human-created title is bad, that in itself tells you something about the OP before you’ve even opened the thread. It’s part of the adventure of reading posts here.

It's pointless and infantilising

Absolutely that. And the comment in this thread from MNHQ confirms that they actually think that writing a title is 'too hard' for many of us.

MNHQ:
Clear titles also make it easier for other users to understand what a thread is about and find discussions later on.

Well since AI's 'suggestions' are making titles less clear, I suggest you dump it.

Are you doing anything to offset the environmental impact of using (pointless and unnecessary) generative AI?

I'd also suggest getting rid of this feature. So many OPs are getting complained at for misleading or wrong titles when it turns out they've used the AI one.

There are also some very weird titles like Ma & Mrs that could only be mistakes.

Well, I didn’t vote for it ( Monty Python)

Nobody wants this, Mumsnet, and it is patently not working - the suggested thread titles are misleading at best and nonsensical at worst. Why on earth spend time and money introducing this completely unnecessary feature instead of something truly useful like, say, the facility to quote part of a post rather than the whole thing?

Is this what you intended, @MNHQ?

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/education/5511258-mrs?utm_campaign=thread&utm_medium=app_share

I have also started to wonder whether intentionally or as a by product it is an attempt to make threads seem just a bit of chat.

I am not familiar with all the different areas but there is no doubt some threads are quite "robust" in terms of comments.

Not that I am saying MN should support shouty Red Top over the top gotcha style, but really silly to try and dumb down what some threads are about to some sort of polite chit chat at a neighbourhood event.

It is these threads that are (surely?) the USP of MN?

When this is happening at the same time as rumours of money needed to be invested in MN if not actual sale, just adds a sense of why is this being done now.

Why not just allow a thread title to be edited by whoever started it.

Why can this only be done via MNHQ?

Why not add a spell checker?

And ...

Is the issue of how to title a thread really the most pressing concern?

Why on earth spend time and money introducing this completely unnecessary feature instead of something truly useful like, say, the facility to quote part of a post rather than the whole thing?

YES!!!

The latter is desperately needed, and would actually improve things. The AI titles feature is unnecessary and detracts from the experience.

Why on earth spend time and money introducing this completely unnecessary feature instead of something truly useful like, say, the facility to quote part of a post rather than the whole thing?

I'm assuming the buyers want more AI involvement.

There's no other reason to do something that is clearly unhelpful for useers

Just want to say I do empathise with those who worry how to title a thread. I have titled threads thinking this is clear, but nearly always (and not always the OP title) the first response will be from someone who has some strange take on it and posts something that then derails. (This is why I cant understand why an OP cant edit their own title.)

But do think anyone nervous about posting should feel they can just say something like "Have been wondering about xxxxx". Or "any thoughts on xxxx"

This captures in a nutshell the shittiness of AI. If we can't do something without zero mental effort, like put two seconds of thought into summarising our thoughts on an anonymous forum, we don't even have to think about trying to develop those skills. Simply give up and outsource even the tiniest flex of cognitive muscle to a robot which, kindly giving us a taste of our own future, cannot think. And what's going to drive away the traffic more, a couple of poor sods not being to come up with a title, or MN becoming gradually non-human? So it begins 😵

I do sort of sympathise with that, but was accepting that some may have had a bad education experience, and not been confident in writing things. This is not unusual.

Added to which many on MN are shall we say quite fiesty!

So if the first response to a thread is a bit over the top, and judgemental that could be it for some.

What comes easily for some, doesn't mean it does for anyone.

And its rare that the first response is, Hi OP not quite sure what point or aspect you are concerned about, can you exand? Thanks

As opposed to a high octane I have never heard such rubbish, what makes you think that.

Am happy to put my hand up and say I have done both.

But otherwise dont think AI is a good idea, and certainly think, as said early, should go back to original form for starting a thread ie
Title
OP
and then have a tick box asking would you like AI to create a header for you.

I do sort of sympathise with that, but was accepting that some may have had a bad education experience, and not been confident in writing things. This is not unusual.

Nobody will ever improve those skills unless they try though. Life should be a learning experience.

Are we really happy to just let the bots take over?

We shouldn't be.

No of course not.

But for more than a few on MN it is a sort of life line, a chance to (hopefully) find and empathetic group to interact with.

And I have no worries about helping them get a voice on what is quite an assertive lot of posters.

As an example I shared an article on FWR about an Haredi who realised or began to suspect she was lesbian. And felt unable to talk about this to anyone in her community.

Apparently she posted on MN and got a lot of support.

Would hate to think that someone like her, in a difficult and painful situation would be put off from asking for support because of nervousness or insecurity about how to frame her situation.

Just to repeat, I think the create a thread page should go back to how it was, and just have underneath a question about do you want help with creating a title for your thread.

Then those of us who are "old hands" can just carry on being confident we will get it right (although is anyone can pick a fault in a sentence "old hands" on MN can) and those less sure can get support.

It is worth remembering that whatever other problems MN forums may have, in terms of it being a resource for women is probably not matched.

And if it doesn't interfere with any of us posting, why would you want to further disadvantage someone who may be is really unsure and nervous.

Anyone who can create a whole OP, can create a title @IwantToRetire . It's certainly not a barrier worth replacing with inaccurate AI slop.

Also it's very damaging to less confident posters to find their thread taken over by posters berating them for their title, as has happened to several posters who had more worrying problems that they needed support with.

I personally hate it, but I'm gritting my teeth because I know that I often get so irritated by other people's inadequate titles - They just say "Help" or "I'm worried."
So it's probably a good thing.
What does bother me, though, is the title moving to the bottom, which completely contrary to how it posts. I suppose you'll tell me that it has to be after the text, so that the machinery can suggest a title. But need it be?