Fancy telling MNHQ what you think about the parties' childcare proposals?

[RowanMumsnet]

Afternoon all

You may have seen over the past couple of days that Labour and the Conservatives have made manifesto commitments on childcare in England, Wales and NI, in addition to the current 15 free hours per week for 3-4yos (and some 2yos), and the tax-free childcare scheme that will come online this autumn.

Labour has promised 25 hours per week of free childcare for working parents of 3-4yos and guaranteed wraparound childcare in primaries 8am-6pm, 'underpinned' by new National Primary Childcare Service - a not-for-profit organisation promoting the voluntary and charitable delivery of extracurricular activities.

The Conservatives have promised 30 hours per week of free childcare for working parents of 3-4yos.

The LibDem manifesto hasn't been launched yet, but it's expected to promise something along the lines of 15 hours a week for all two-year-olds (at the moment, only 40% of 2yos qualify for it) and 20 hours for all three and four-year-olds, plus 15 hours a week for all children of working parents aged between 9 months and two years. (Check against delivery, as the journos say - the LibDem manifesto will be launched tomorrow.)

The Green Party promises a 'free but voluntary universal early education and childcare service for all children from birth until compulsory education age, which we would raise to 7 years'.

UKIP don't seem to have any specific childcare proposals at the moment (but do please let us know if you know differently!)

As ever we'd welcome the input of Scottish MNers if you'd like to tell us how the Scottish government's free childcare offer is working out for you.

So what do you think of the policy offers? Are they good enough? Are the funding promises convincing? Would they make it easier for you and/or your partner to work, if that's what you'd like to do? Will they make it easier on your wallet? Do they go far enough, or too far? Are there big gaps in provision?

Would any of this sway your vote?

We're all ears.

Thanks
MNHQ

I don't see how the country can afford 30 hrs pw free childcare tbh. have they published figures to go with the policy?

I like the idea of the wrap around care but I am sceptical that there are sufficient organisations in the country waiting to provide free activities for every child of working parents.

These policies wouldn't help me as my dc are older but I suspect, if they worked properly, they would help others.

It is the green party that's most interesting though, raising compulsory school age to 7? Well I think that could be fantastic for children but how are they going to make the education system work with that?

I agree with other comments. All the major parties need to get their house in order as to whether they are funding childcare or early years education. If it's childcare, it needs to be year round. If it is early years education, it may make sense that it is term time, but the issue of access for children of 'hard working families' needs to be addressed.

They also need to stop funding it at derisory rates. It is all very well saying that they will fund 25/30 hours of childcare. But the rate paid to providers varies drastically and, in some areas, is incredibly low. Our council sets the local rate almost £1 an hour lower than the going rate for a childminder. I know many who suck it up when the children turn 4 and take a £1 per hour pay cut for 15 hours. Would they be able to do that for 25 or 30 hours? I doubt it. You would end up with fewer and fewer private providers offering the free hours. Or you get the situation that other posters have flagged, where nurseries (who have more ability to do so) 'fix' their changes so that they don't lose out.

I suspect that these policies win votes from people planning families rather than those presently 'in the system'. As someone heavily involved in the finances of a community playgroup, my DH is pretty fed up already at me yelling at the tv when these policies come on.

I work full time Peachy.

Free hours are a brilliant sound bite but in practical terms they don't really help working parents. I had to pay my childminder for the hours my children were at preschool because she couldn't fill their space while they were there. I couldn't use my free hours with her, because there is a shortfall and childminders end up out of pocket if they accept the government-funded places.

In my opinion, the voucher scheme as it is, is fine. It's great, in fact. Its only fault is it's a bit random to be only allowed to claim £243, and self-employed people can't benefit from it. Why the parties can't just extend that scheme so we can claim more before tax, and make it a tax-deductible expense for self-employed workers is beyond me. It's simple, it works, and it's flexible - we can use it to pay nursery/childminders/after-school club/nannies/whatever.

If its education and not free childcare why can I use my 15 hours for my 4 year old with my childminder?

It's really sad that none of the parties have discussed things like transferring the tax allowance for non-working parents to their partners, or giving the money spent on childcare directly to parents to care for their own children.

It's really sad that all the parties view children and their parents as units of the economy rather than people. And that the only way the state will support you to stay home is if you kick out your children's father and go on benefits.

I don't think any parties are offering the wraparound childcare for free? Just ensuring it's actually available for all who need it.

It's the not paying the providers that has really got my goat from Labour! Either you fund children's services properly or they don't work properly. It is that simple.

LePetitmarseillais I thought you were judging parents who worked whereas you are actually just criticising parents who work but choose a different child care option to you. I've come across some terrible child-minders who kids hated going to with good reason, as I said before different options work for different families and quality of lots of different types of provision varies widely. My kids' after school club has use of the playing fields and they've been out playing football and cricket until pick up time today, they've got x boxes and craft areas and mostly it's popular with the kids because they get to spend time with their friends.

Sorry but school fields are disappearing.You like yours which is great however keeping kids who have already done a long day even longer in poor facilities when many simply need a break because a few are lucky enough to enjoy it and have great facilities isn't right.

Where is the money going to come from to provide green spaces for kids to play in,decent facilities built on schools many of which could barely squeeze a kitchen in after the last mad Condem vote buying idea?

Wigfield - because childminders follow the early years curriculum. Nannies don't so you can't.

If it is childcare - why term time?

Where school facilities are poor that needs addressing whether or not there is after school provision on site, our after school club is in the hall no extra space needed.

57% tax in Sweden! Wow, they're going to start chasing me soon for some money as I paid nowhere near that amount during the ten years I worked there!

And no, telling someone to "google it" does not count as giving a source.

It is quite clear what your agenda is LePetit....

I like the idea of the wrap around care but I am sceptical that there are sufficient organisations in the country waiting to provide free activities for every child of working parents.

Labour haven't promised FREE wraparound care though, have they?

No agenda,just disagreeing with you.

Peachy a school hall for hundreds of children does not good childcare make. It takes a lot more than that and the fact is it won't be ideal for many kids.

And yes schools should be sorted first but they're not so piling more pressure onto buildings already under immense pressure is not a particularly good thing.

Free childcare for younger children appeals the most to me, we can barely afford things at the moment with one 1yo, it'll be even harder with 2.

However isn't it most important to focus on those people for whom work doesn't pay and subsidise their childcare? As opposed to a blanket '30 hours for all'? Much as it is the more free childcare the better for me personally we don't need 30 hours to get by and make work pay.

When it the proposed change to 30hrs actually take place ? Is this mentioned anywhere ? What about all those nurseries who only run half days ?

Labour haven't said it would be free for parents, but they explicitly said the purpose of the new body is to recruit 'volunteers'. A massive insult to all the wonderful organisations providing sports and arts education and activities, to be expected to now do so for free. It cheeses me off immensely. All the parties have a total lack of will to put their money where their ideas are. This is Labour recycling the 'big society' thing. News flash - even people who work in such fripperies as the arts and sport, and childcare and education for that matter - have families and mortgages and bills to pay. Providing wraparound care will only work if it's actually funded properly.

That is from the horse's mouth by the way, not a newspaper rehash.

I haven't used my full 15 hours with my dc. Partly because we were able to arrange our work around childcare but also because I didn't want to and even if I did the local provision wasn't there for what we'd have needed.
The biggest problems with these plans seems to be term time only provision and capacity. Are there non profit organisations out there to do this? On that scale?

Thanks penguin, I think it's clever wording - everyone knows the majority of working parents will see it as free childcare (whether it's meant to be or not, free or more affordable childcare is what's needed if parents are to keep working and contributing to tax). My childminder is fantastic but I don't expect her to educate my child anymore than I would and do at home. I chose her for her childcare credentials as I would a nursery for a child so young - particularly aged 2.

Have you contacted Plaid Cymru to see what their policy is - otherwise I can't comment really.

By "free" places the parties mean they will partly subsidise childcare at a level lower than most nurseries provide the care for. It will result in most nurseries lowering costs and therefore quality, or pulling out the whole system, leading to a two tier sector of cheap/poor quality childcare for lower income parents, and good quality unfunded childcare for higher income parents.

Nurseries are fucked.

Wizard Yes of course all of these are focused on childcare so people can work/pay tax, they're not coming up with these policies out of the goodness of their hearts! The only exception is probably the Green Party.

I agree with Green policy to make school age older.

Agree with PP re: it would be good to see alternatives to simply pushing really long days.

I would like to have seen businesses incentivised to offer more part-time or school hours jobs, this would certainly get more parents into work. Currently little incentive, bar the ability to recruit talented, hard working women easily...

I currently put my DS in nursery 10 hours a day (part time) as it's the only way I can keep my job. I'm very lucky to have it part time at all.

But many aren't paying tax. Many second working parents are only working part time or paid low wages.

Glad the main parties are all at least acknowledging that childcare is a problem and trying to make improvements but it's discouraging to hear so many MNers saying the "free" hours don't actually come free or provide much help due to how they work.

I don't have dc yet but am intending in the near future and when I heard the Conservative 30 hours proposal I thought great, as I've calculated childcare for one child would cost me about a grand a month which will be very tough to cover even though I have a good salary. So 30 hours free would reduce it by a big chunk. However I think it needs to be all year round not just term time and have more flexibility re the times of day if the aim is to help people who are working. I would prefer to get the value in tax free childcare vouchers which could be used on any childcare of choice, whether it's a nursery, childminder or nanny but I do still think it's a good thing to increase the hours though.

Labour, as above re extra hours, and the wrap around care sounds quite handy as obviously the school drop offs and pick ups don't fit in with a working day. This would probably be a big practical help.

Lib dem, I really like that they would want to offer some free hours from 9 months rather than from 2 or 3 years. I never understand why free hours only come later as obviously childcare costs kick in as soon as you return from mat leave and are a huge burden. This will be really helpful for mothers going back to work (obviously with the proviso as above that the hours need to be properly made available by the nurseries for free and at convenient times). If implemented correctly so that you actually see the benefit of your childcare bill going down by 15 hours a week from 9 months up to school entry this would be my favourite of the proposals. Labour and conservatives versions still leave you struggling for a couple of years before you get any help.

Green, this is obviously just nonsense. How are they going to pay for it?