Cross-party inquiry into unwanted pregnancy: your views?

[RowanMumsnet]

Hello,

We've been asked by Conservative MP Amber Rudd to contribute to a cross-party inquiry into the factors underlying unwanted pregnancies in the UK, and ways in which the unwanted pregnancy rate might be brought down. (Other members of the Inquiry include Labour MP Sandra Osborne and LibDem MP Lorely Burt.)

The background information from the Inquiry states: 'Over the last decade, the age-standardised abortion rate has risen by 2.3 per cent. Beneath this statistic are some striking trends. For example, the abortion rate for women in the 30-34 age group has risen by around 10 per cent in the past three years, which is in stark contrast to other countries like New Zealand, where the rate has decreased by 5 per cent over the same period. Repeat abortions have also increased over the past decade, rising from 31 per cent in 2001 to 36 per cent in 2011. Although unwanted pregnancies in teenagers have been steadily declining over the past decade, the UK also remains home to the highest teenage pregnancy rate in Western Europe.'

The Inquiry is interested in hearing your views on the following:

1. The issue of unwanted pregnancy in the UK.
2. The figures suggest that there are increasing rates of abortions among some age groups in the UK, increasing rates of repeat abortions, and high levels of teenage pregnancy. What are the underlying reasons for these trends? And what role (if any) does government have in tackling them?
3. What lessons can be learned from previous attempts to tackle unwanted pregnancies?
4. Are there any measures the government should be implementing to tackle unwanted pregnancy?

Plus, of course, anything else you want to say.

Thanks,
MNHQ

I'd want a proper breakdown of the statistics being chucked around before I started wailing about the evilness of women daring to have sex and not then have babies.
For instance: are the statistics featuring controls/comparisons for termination due to health issues (whether of mother or foetus)? Or are they only having a bleat about abortion for 'social' (the woman's choice that she doesn't want to have a baby) reasons?
Is there reliable information on whether contraception is being used more/less or is harder to get?

Has there been yet another misinformed panic about the disobedience, selfishness and stupidity of pregnant women causing an increase in terminations? (There was one a few years back about how if you had ever had a drink of alcohol, your baby would be born headless and with tentacles instead of feet, causing a massive upsurge in terminations).

Basically abortion should be available to every woman, as early as wanted and as late as necessary. Anything other viewpoint has its roots either in superstition or in the idea that women are men's breeding animals.

I don't think they are failing to [use contraception]. Even when used correctly, contraception is not 100% reliable, so there will always be 'accidents'. I think the difference is that whereas 10 or 20 years ago couples would often think, 'it's ok, we can cope with one more', now the pressure of work, combined with the high cost of childcare and rent/mortgages leaves more and more people feeling that they just can't realistically do that

That & the fact that perhaps women are realising that just because they have an unwanted pregnancy, doesn't mean that they have to have the baby. I think when you are in your 30s you become aware of what you & your family need & want, and less worried about what society expects you to do. If that makes sense.

The whole argument is null without some hard facts behind it. we need economic data, social data. This really is very very poor research, if indeed this is what it it.

anecdotal therefore:

the teenage part of the question hasn't been discussed and i would like to address it.

IMO and Experience ( life and working with socially isolated/disadvantaged people) there are three factors

education - not just sex ed - but education in general
hope
culture

To be frank, the Conservatives are butchering the support mechanisms which allow severely disadvantaged children to access basic education in schools - because this requires support to the parents - and the Conservatives consider them feckless and workshy.

without support for the existing parents, some children don't get even a basic education

Schools are spending their time sorting out problems, support mechanisms and the like for families instead of educating children

and this is becuase our education system is like a funnel where you, or jamie oliver or anyone who wants to do anything with or to our children, can do it through this system

you are not letting children learn - the ones that get there. You are not letting teachers teach. they are becoming some kind of school/socialworkery/media bandwagony/multiagency place.

some wanker in whitehall probably showed another wanker in higher political office a chart and said the word 'streamlining' 'funneling' 'interagency co-operation' rubbish.

i digress
so those children from the most vulnerable families the most socially and economically disadvantaged........do not get hope and they don't get to dream.

These kids aren't stupid, at 13 they know already - that childhood imaginings of a fireman or some such is unreachable. they disconnect - why bother when your future for the next 55 years is minimum wage at the new asda down the road.

the kids who do dream, go to college, uni etc - if you actually did your own real research and got some graphs, i would wager that those with low educational achievement ergo - no hopes, no dreams were the most likley candidates to be pregnant or get someone pregnant as a teenager. now, not all of course .

at 16 you get out of that shithole you call a home ( the one the Labout and Conservative governments shat all over and didn't give enough support via services and intervention) someone loves you and you can have your own family.

There is a lot of naivity involved too - some schools do the crying doll thing

but then they cost money - so actually some do a fucking bag of flour.

why bother? really? a bag of flour.

there needs to be a change in prevailing societal culture.

All parents need parenting classes - we aren't given an instruction leaflet you know,

its not like a washing machine. and your target audience probably isn't going to read the mumsnet guide to rearing a boden baby fnar fnar. or similar.

jamie oliver ( god bless his little scooter) DID absolutely change britains ddietary habits

supermarkets got in on the thing, kids were saying " no mum i am not allowed a penguin bar in my lunch box" etc

and in societal terms, that happened so very very very very quickly.

You can - if you wanted to ( which Conservative govts dont really want to) change the societal culture.

by introducing some from pf parent support and education group (class) where dads and mums learn before birth about breastfeeding, great nutrition, how to handle a colicky baby, what to do when you thing you want to throw your baby out of the window, how to talk to your baby, how to set boundries for your toddler. that smacking isn't the best way, that smoking in front of children in your house is so 10 years ago. That as a parent, your job is to keep your child safe, not be a threat to them - that you sare allowed to have hope for yourself - still - that there are educational opportunities available to you still ....my god the list is endless.
and this should be on condition of receiving child benefit. thsi then could be your new social interagency wanky bolockses 'HUB' for professionals to work through and let the schools teach the kids.

and the parenting group/class lasts all the way up to teenagers and beyond - in 1 generation you can change a culture - if you want to

where this leads, prevailing dominant entertainment culture will follow ( as per jamie) you are re-educating a whole demographic - and more, there is advertising revenue in that for the media - things like towie might fade away and be replaced by something of substance. a whole society could change

also we are in the 21st century, why haven't we got the male pill/ injection yet? look into it.

i consider myself to be a non bury of head in sand type parent, before HPV injections at school - i paid for my daughter to have them. With daughters you can give them the pill. injection in arm or implant. job done as far as you possibly can.

as the parent of boys - i had to give them condoms and stress the importane of using it, take them to family planning clinic - walk them in so they got over initial embarassment of asking for free condoms - and take them to see the lovely nurse who shows you boy or girl how to put one on.

most parents dont do that for boys. - but short of being in the room with them, i can't make them put a condom on.

and it was absolutely my biggest fear that the boys would get a girl pregnant - as a parent i have really little control over this and an injection for boys that lasted 3 months would have been super.

I wonder if it has helped women make the choice to end a pregnancy because of the abortion pill? As it is no longer always necessary to have an op, perhaps more women can rethink their choice.

So really, they are researching this subject by coming and having a chit chat on Mumsnet? Seems a bit shonky to me.

Women have unwanted pregnancies either because a) they were taking a chance without contraception, b)contraceptive failure, c)rape or d)because their circumstances change. Surely the health authorities must research this stuff?

So are these factors rising? Are more women getting pregnant without planning to (a bad thing), or are more women who don't want to continue with a pregnancy able to access abortion (a good thing)?

How is the collective wisdom of MN supposed to know?

Contraception failure?
No method is 100% effective.
Let's be honest, most methods of contraception involve the woman pumping her body full of hormones and chemically altering her bodies natural cycle!
I have just had a coil fitted as a sort of last chance saloon...I cannot have the pill as I am a stroke risk, the depo injection and implant made me put on 2stone and have the the rage all the time, and I am allergic to latex.
We usedlatex free condoms for a while but it gets costly.
Dh booked in for a vasectomy but then childcare let us down so had to cancel the appt and I realised I needed to do something about my horrendous periods.
I am proud to live in a country where termination is free, and safe.
So many women all over the world do not have this option.
What was it germaine Greer said?
To force women into being mothers against their will is to treat them like a slave or farm animal?
Absolutely.
My dads cousin got pg in the 1950s.
She had a back street abortion and died, alone, on the kitchen floor in agony some hours later.
She was 17.
As to why we have the highest rate of teenage pg...lack of decent sex ed.
Take a leaf out o fate book of the Scandinavian countries (who have e lowest incidence of teenage pg and stds) it's not a coincidence!!

Agree with everything that has been said thus far - economic factors, contraceptive issues and the glamourising of sex and pregnancy to teenagers I think are all huge issues.

We have 2 young DC's, I work part time from home and DH has a high level job within a small up & coming company that pays above the national average. And yet we can't get a mortgage, are renting a house smaller than our needs because we can't afford anything else and by the third week of every month we are broke etc. If I fell pregnant again now we would have to seriously consider our options; not because we wouldn't want another baby, but because having another baby would seriously compromise the well-being of our existing DC's. This cannot be just our experience and going by previous posts on here, it isn't.

Contraception is a huge issue. Shortly after having DS2 I asked about having a coil fitted as hormonal contraception is not an option for me. I was told I could only go on a certain day to a clinic 8 miles away from where I live and appointments were only between 10 and 4. I don't drive, the place was a goof half a mile off the bus route, I had an EBF newborn and no childcare for DS1. The only option was for my DH to take time off work to take me there. And this was in the suburbs of one of the largest cities in the north west. It seems that contraception isn't a problem if you're happy to go onto hormonal types that can be easily prescribed by any GP with a prescription pad but if you want anything else you have to jump through hoops to get it.

Open any gossip rag or paper and there will be pictures of a pregnant "celeb" or someone showing off a newborn having had their figure spring back instantly and talking about how they'll go it alone (Chantelle I'm looking at you here). There's no mention of the fact that you are responsible for the child for the rest of your life. Programmes like Geordie Shore show young men and women doing nothing but going out, getting drunk and shagging anything that so much as looks in their direction. Not once is there any mention of contraception. Studies have shown the rates of teen pregnancy are lowest in countries that talk about sex with their children, be it in schools or at home. So what are programmes like these teaching our teenagers?!

In terms of teenage pregnancies this country has a strange view as to what it's ok to expose teenagers to. Everything from adverts to music videos to 7.00pm soaps are giving out messages that reinforce the fact that you have to be beautiful, look a certain way, behave in certain ways to be popular or desirable. Kids are constantly under pressure to conform and are left looking for reassurance of their worth and lack of self esteem. IMO these are all factors that lead to unprotected sex (too scared of disapproval if they say no/insist on contraception) and in turn pregnancies.

We need to take a close look at our society on a far wider level than just 'how can we stop teenage pregnancy' before we find a way of tackling this issue.

In terms of older women I think the reduction of stigma re: abortion has helped women in their 30's make these decisions, based on their choices for their own, and their existing children's, lifestyle and well being.

I agree with Himalaya re proper research but I am finding the info re travelling and finding appointments for coil fitting etc interesting.

Am a HCP.

On the repeat termination issue I am very concerned at the post abortion care ie clinics telling women 'see your GP' for contraception rather than doing it then and there. If you could get the depot on the day or be physically handed the pill or a supply of condoms it might make things easier. Some women will never get round to making that appointment and will become pregnant again.

On the coil issue, access is terrible here too - one clinic for a big city and only certain GPs do them. When I looked into training to fit coils I realised that I would have to be doing them frequently to be competent and keep up my skills. As only a few women a year in our practice were having coils it didn't make financial sense. I argued that if coils were available on the premises more women might go for them. Nexplanon take up is high but so is the removal rate when women don't like the side effects.

I also think (and hope) that some women are realising that some men are deadbeats and don't want the tie themselves to them for life and struggle while they walk away

We need tighter laws and checks on NRP paying child maintenance and not letting self employed dickheads play the system do they can drive a merc and pay £5 a month

Because in most cases it's all left to the woman to deal with so why put a child through that and why give a dickhead any power? Because even if they don't give a sit they can threaten to get access and demand their rights while not paying for even a pair of socks for a child

Like others here, I would like 3 children but will only be able to afford two. The costs of childcare are a huge burden.

I also think sex education in schools is responsible, as well as the availability of porn. There was an feature in the Sunday Times Magazine a few months back about the morning after pill, and how boys are pressurising young girls to have sex with no condoms 'like they do in porn' because the girls 'can always get the morning after pill the next day'. The article interviewed several young girls and it was clear that there were two factors at play:

1. Sex education at school encourages pupils to 'experiment' and 'have fun' but to be safe. All girls interviewed said they WISHED it had been said, never mind stressed, that sex is ideally part of a loving, long-term committed relationship and that's it's okay to hold off (never mind, desirable).

1. Porn. Young boys start to consume porn at a young age - and it is increasingly demeaning to women, viewing them as sex objects and nothing more. (not to mention the prevalence of violent porn in which rape and DV is common). The girls interviewed said that they felt pressure to dress and behave like porn stars. They were unaware that, as women, sex should be a pleasurable experience for them. Very, very sad.

Sorry, that should read '2' not '3'

Personally I don't feel a high abortion rate is so dreadful. It's preferable to more unwanted children. Ideally, of course, the pregnancies wouldn't happen.
I think teenagers have barely any access to free condoms, and they are very expensive, so I'd imagine that's a big issue.
As for people in their 30s, I think money must be a big issue. I have one child and could not afford another. I would have an abortion if I became pregnant.

'an increasing number of women [do] not successfully contracept'

What, are they doing it on their own?

I agree with a lot of things already posted, but would just add that when I became sexually active and for some years after, my partners and I were able to nip down to the Family Planning Clinic after school and work hours as needed for plenty of free condoms, experienced diaphragm fittings etc. Is that still the case?

If unwanted pregnancies / abortions are going up maybe that is because unwanted births are going down?

Has it been measured against that?

Maybe now that pg tests are more easily available, and much cheaper, and people are aware that there is the choice of a clinical abortion, and that there is less stigma, more women are confirming an unwanted pg early on and taking the choise to have a termination rather than going ahead and being trapped into unwilling, resentful motherhood?

I do think that more young people seem to be having sex earlier and more often, and that will just increase the chance of pregnancies overall, won't it? If girls start to have sex at 14 rather than 16 (say) then there are an additional 2 years in which pg could occur.

Successfully contracept? That's more grating than 'medalling' at the Olympics.

I have to say I am very disappointed with mn for the number of people claiming that young people are having sex younger. There is absolutely no evidence to show that is the case and as other people have said teenage pregnancy is decreasing.
Also the assumption that porn makes women more sexually active at a younger age is a very unsupported claim as shown by the reaction to recent paper produced on the impact if the secularisation of the media in young girls.
I do hope these daily mail views aren't used by the Tories to support any real legislation.
And I know I am going to get slammed but the average age on this thread does appear to be high. How bloody ok'd do you have to be to believe all the screeching about the sexualisation if 'young girls'?

Secularisation - sexualisation

Ermmm I'm only 27 but there is a difference from 10 years ago the amount of images on tv etc

Look at strictly Today. Did they need quite so many cut outs on the ladies clothes?

Ethelb is spot on though- we need to know what the figures are in what age group, and not make a knee-jerk pronouncement based on vague impressions. From what I understand, most abortions are in older age groups. To me, that says we are looking at the poor availability of contraception (and people have talked about its inaccesibility here, if it involves more than popping to the GP), and of economic hardship. This is a bigger part of the picture than teenage sex, I think. Frankly, I'd be pleased if more teenage girls chose termination over pregnancy, because it would mean they felt they had more of a future than some of them do.

Thanks super. I also think, though they are not saying it, the review the government are going is probably fuelled by the fact that while unwanted teenage pregnancy has fallen unwanted pregnancy has risen in older women.
Give your simplistic views on the impact of strictly come dancing all you want. But I doubt the government are looking for more since they were roundly slated for a report espousing all these silly ideas earlier this year.
I'm pleased they are looking at the poor sexual health being experienced by the over 35s though. As it is very clear that while ostrich like behaviour from people in those age groups is desired it is having an impact on everyone.