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Laptop - have £800 to spend - happy to spend less...

49 replies

Willow2 · 14/04/2005 23:17

Can any techy person out there recommend a good one? Don't need loads of gizmos just want speed and reliability - and good support for when things go wrong.

Conversely, are there any brands to avoid like the plague?

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GeorginaA · 14/04/2005 23:44

Hmm... we've found Dells to be good and fairly well priced. We like the inspiron range.

Do be wary though that when you add up all the bits you quite fancy on the spec that the price can creep up almost without you realising

Got a Dell Inspiron 6000 (I think? Dh specced it for me) arriving in the next week or so in fact

ScummyMummy · 14/04/2005 23:55

Are you going for a pc? If not the 12" apple ibook was £799 last time I looked and is really great- looks nice, does everything and apple support is v good.

hub2dee · 14/04/2005 23:58

Hi Willow2,

I'd second GeorginaA on Dell for a Windows laptop.

Have you considered buying an Apple laptop ? They play nicely in a Windows environment but look more beautiful and instead of Windows they run 'OS X' which, IMHO is infinitely better / prettier / more stable / easier to keep up to date and doesn't have viruses / spyware.

'iBooks' start at £700 for a 12" screen.

hub2dee · 15/04/2005 00:00

woops... it took me so long to compose that and I got side-tracked by the lovely Apple web site !

(£700 is correct as a starting price). They do edu discounts and are cheaper at Dixons at Heathrow if you're taking a flight (no VAT)...

oops · 15/04/2005 00:00

Message withdrawn

hub2dee · 15/04/2005 00:12

Sonys are lovely when they work. And they play very nicely with Sony desktops and camcorders etc. .. but when they need upgrading / reinstalling / interfacing with some non-Sony bits, things can start to get a tad pear shaped as Sony is quite big on proprietary drivers / more unusual chipsets etc. IMHO.

GeorginaA · 15/04/2005 08:31

Apples are lovely, but with a tight budget you get much more for your money with a Window's machine. I might recommend them for someone with a budget of around £1200-£1500 but not £800.

Sony Vaios again are very expensive for what you get.

We have Mesh main PCs and they can be quite good and extremely good value, but I think their customer service if there's a problem can be a little poor at times - it helps if immensely if you're a techy and know what you're talking about when dealing with them... so that may be a factor.

triceratops · 15/04/2005 08:42

We just bought (yesterday) an HP Compaq nx6110-360 for £399 plus vat. It has a large screen and a dvd writer and everything else you could need. I was absolutely shocked as I expected, like you, that I would have to pay £800 for a decent spec machine. Absolutely the best buy I have made in ages.

lou33 · 15/04/2005 08:56

we got a top spec sony vaio on ebay for £695

lou33 · 15/04/2005 08:56

or was it £650?

Willow2 · 15/04/2005 09:29

Hello again - yes, it's a laptop I'm after. I have a Dell pc but was told their laptops weren't as hot - discuss?? Apple are great but more expensive; I'm just wary of not being able to open stuff sent to me which I found was a problem ages ago - I suppose that's not really a problem now though, is it?

Lou - Buying a pc on ebay - buy now option from a reputable dealer or in an auction? Second hand? What if it all goes pear shaped?

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Willow2 · 15/04/2005 09:30

Also, if I wrote something on my PC how easy would it be to open same document on my apple - what would I have to do???

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hub2dee · 15/04/2005 09:35

Willow2 - can I ask if you have any particular requirements from this laptop ? E-mail / Web / Word mainly ? Will kids want to do gaming on it ? Wireless networking etc. ?

I disagree with GeorginaA on the low-end Apples not competing with Windows PCs. Yes, their processors will run slower, but life has moved beyond clock speed.

The Mac Mini is under £500 (add monitor / mouse / keyboard) and competes well with the 'cheap PC' models out there.

The Imac is an 'all in one' thin screen / computer so cuts down on desktop clutter and looks smart and begins at £900.

If a user wants to have a nice simple life, connecting a digital camera to upload images / printing them out, maybe an iPod for music whilst travelling, lots of e-mail and Web surfing, importing from a video camera and making little films of the family, I sincerely believe you will have an easier time doing that on an Apple.

I am not suggesting they share the 'universal compatibility' of a PC. PCs DO have more compatible accessories and more software titles - especially in the gaming segment - but I think these days people want to use their computers to achieve specific tasks: An address book so all the family numbers are in one place, a calendar to track birthdays / outings / work appointments, a Net browser that doesn't dose them up with pron and pop-ups and a little bit of stability so they don't spend their lives watching Windows reboot.

I will readilly acknowledge that XP is in a different league compared to its predecessors, but it's still 'more of the same' as far as I'm concerned.

hub2dee · 15/04/2005 09:40

Hi Willow2, the document incompatibility used to be a big issue years ago. Apple then built a new operating system called 'OS X' based on Linux so it's very well designed, stable, and secure.

They have spent the last few years making it really easy to use and very intuitive / elegant.

They smoothly open any documents sent to them with no fuss at all. Microsoft sell Office for Mac, and it reads all the same PowerPoint / Word / Excel spreadsheets. It handles pdfs like a dream.

You're welcome to CAT me a message and you can send me whatever files you work with and I'll let you know if I can open them or if there is a problem. I can also send you tiny Word / Excel / Powerpoint files to check you can open them on a PC.

They ARE a different kettle of fish. But I, for one, am jolly happy with it.

Do you live in London ?

Titania · 15/04/2005 09:47

I have the samsong XO5. Very lightweight laptop. Great cos means i can put it where little hands cant press the buttons!!! Am thinking of selling it and jacking in the internet! Cost me £999 last year and that was with 5 years all inclusive insurance included as well.

Willow2 · 15/04/2005 10:03

hub2dee - do you have shares in the company?

I want a laptop for work essentially - we have a pc on a tiny workstation in the spare room. It is not a good environment for working, there is barely enough space to balance my address book, let alone notes, files etc. So, plan is to decamp down to kitchen table each morning (which has pros and cons but that's another story) and get the house wirelessed up. Work means writing - so lots and lots of emails and surfing and, invariably, reference documents such as adobe pdf's powerpoint etc, sent through to me that I need to be able to get in to. I suppose the beauty of keeping the old pc is that I can always use that too - but am not sure if I am opening a can of worms if I go for an apple. I want my life to be simplified - I don't want to have a nervous breakdown every time I try to email my other computer some stuff. I also want to be able to surf and download stuff fast - so have been looking at the latest netgear wireless set up (either the rangemax or the WGT624 router) but realise that the laptop will have some say as to how fast life really is! Also, know that, if i go for an Apple, can just get an airport system for relatively little cost (hubby uses mac for work) and that I will be far less likely to get viruses on the machine. Then again, will all the virus software I currently have be incompatible? I know this sounds stupid - but does Apple have some sort of OUtlook Express system to manage numerous email accounts (including a hotmail one?). As is pretty clear, I don't know a huge amount about computers when you get down to the nitty gritty!

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GeorginaA · 15/04/2005 10:43

LOL Hub2Dee - I'm not just thinking about processor speed to be honest.

Easier to give an example maybe... Dh has been speccing both out quite carefully (his work uses macs and pcs) and has quite specific minimum requirements (although obviously minimum requirement on a mac is different due to different software etc). One of his main requirements is a large enough screen to be able to see. The apples start with a 12" screen which is just too small for what he does - plus he would need to upgrade memory etc. For similar usage needs for his work he needed to get a £1300 powerbook or he could spend just under £800 on a very nicely specced Dell notebook. A lot depends on what you need and what you are prepared to pay for - but still stand by like for like taking into consideration different architectures you're going to be spending more on the Apple.

hub2dee · 15/04/2005 10:51

Hi Willow: You do know the most important thing though: The computer is there for you to use as a tool.

Your primary need, it sounds like, is reliability (can't be faffing with downtime) and ease of use wrt communicating with others.

I also note you sound somewhat peed off with sluggish systems and you want something snappy. My guess is your old Windows box is driving you mental.

(No, I on't hold shares, however Apple has gone up something like 300% in the last couple of years. Damn, missed that trick. Apple users tend to be annoyingly evangelistic, as you can see - but that's only because they are so happy with their equipment and the ease of use of the OS).

If you spend a lot of time on the machine, I would recommend the largest screen size you can afford as that will make more difference to your life than processor speed. If you play mainly with text you don't need to go crazy on RAM, but more is definitely merrier. I am about to take my laptop from 512MB to 1GB (for about £45) as I hope to be getting a digital SLR (which throws out bigger files) and maybe a camcorder when baby comes.

You are definitely right in thinking of going with a laptop. You can use it in whichever room looks least hellish, and you'll have no wires trailing everywhere (except the power lead)... If you get an extra power adaptor at the same time, you can have one upstairs and one downstairs and you will always think 'what a clever person I am.'

Getting your house wireless is DEFINITELY going to make you even more smug. It very much changes the utility of your laptop and means you can simply run away from mess / noise / distractions and continue working wherever. It also means guests / colleagues turning up with laptops can be on the Net within about 30 seconds of knocking at your door.

Apple sells a wireless gateway thingy called the Airport Express. If you plug a cheapo ADSL router into it, it will give you a wireless home at 54Mbps, PLUS a printer port (so you can wirelessly print PLUS an audio output so that you could connect it to a HiFi and select music from iTunes on your laptop but listen to it on proper speakers instead of the little ones onboard the laptop.

If you think doing all that sounds v. complicated you are wrong. You will be able to 'rip' a CD of music onto your laptop with about 15 seconds of instruction. iTunes is very easy. There are also admin utilities to talk to the Airport Express so that is also easy to setup. If you want to go down this route, you should check / read up about router compatibility to make sure whatever you buy will work with your Airport Express.

Incidentally, the network speed in your house is not really the bottleneck when dealing with incoming / outgoing documents / powerpoint shows etc. In my house, my network is only 11Mbps and it is PLENTY fast enough for SERIOUS use. No, the bottleneck is in the size of your ADSL pipe (say 512kbps / 1 Meg / 2 Meg connection) and the sluggishness of the PC / laptop opening /closing Word / Toggling to PowerPoint, searching archived e-mail etc. etc.

I am glad your family has some Mac exposure through dh at work. If he gets to use it I'm sure he'll tell you that after the initial 'running in' period where you need to learn how stuff works in a 'Mac world' their systems are a joy to use.

Microsoft make Entourage for Mac which I think is Outlook Express (with contacts / diary built in). I just use Apple's Mail / Address Book / Calendar app so cannot tell you how it performs. I pick up hotmail through a Web browser but there are some sneaky httpmail plugins you can use to read your messages in your ordinary mail app instead of online but I've found them somewhat unreliable.

Hope that answered some of your questions. If you live in London there's a lovely big Apple store with gleaming gems of fantasticness in Regent Street.

Verbal diarrhea or what ?

hub2dee · 15/04/2005 11:03

Hi GeorginaA, so glad we are being civil and you are LOLing instead of ... computers, eh...

I understand your dh's example, and I take your point. As Dell etc. sell MANY more boxes and have MANY more competitors than Apple (who, in their space, essentially have none), the Dell will work out cheaper. They buy more screens / processors / plastic etc. and will be able to buy components more cheaply....

BUT.... as I have shown, you CAN get cheap Apples.

Yes, they might not be as fast etc. but they will put in a stellar performance for the very large bulk of 'normal' use. (E-mail / Web / Word / piccies etc.)

FWIW, I think it is worth spending a bit more (if you have the cash) for a product which looks nicer, is more stable, and gets you out of the Microsoft experience, which I have found, churns my stomach till I weep.

GeorginaA · 15/04/2005 11:20

Hehe ... plus, can I confess... [whispers] I'm a gamer.... shhh

I can see us getting a mac at some point and I do take your point about it depends on usage.

I just shudder at the thought of a 12" screen

Oh, also meant to say willow, seeing as hub2dee is being a great Apple rep and I'm being a great Dell rep - Dell have an outlet store (accessed through the front page of their site) where laptops are available more cheaply that were built but not sold for some reason (customer changed their mind) or were sent back and have been fully refurbished. If you're not wedded to a particular spec you can get some very nice deals there.

I believe Apple have a similar outlet deal thingie going but for some bizarre reason they're only open one day a week for a specific time (Wednesday springs to mind for some reason, but could be wrong on that). I assume they have details on their website.

What I would suggest doing is visiting somewhere like PC World and playing around with all the different laptops to see what features you'd like (dh is very particular on the style of laptop keyboard for example - as he uses the numeric keypad a lot), have a go at the Apple interface etc. Just DON'T buy from PC World - vastly overpriced and aftersales aren't particularly hot ime - good shop for small peripherals that you don't want to wait for mail order but not for for main PCs.

Willow2 · 15/04/2005 11:28

So I have just had a nice chat with a nice lady at Apple in Ireland.

If I was to throw caution to the wind and scream, "Oh let me have a 15" combo powerbook - and while I'm at it I'll join the NUJ and get 10% off" would I then be screaming because I couldn't access my hotmail accounts except via hotmail directly? Cos that would be a major pain in the arse.

Also, airport express thingy - why would I need a router as well? Apple have just told me that, as long as the printer was compatible, it would work of the thingy too. Apparently so will my pc as long as I buy the necessary card.

Also - can you set up a printer so that it can be accessed by both a pc and an apple (not simultaneously - but could someone print from the pc and then, two minutes later, someone print from the powerbook?) Or would we have to buy another printer at more cost?

OP posts:
Willow2 · 15/04/2005 11:29

by the way, thank you for all your help so far!

OP posts:
hub2dee · 15/04/2005 11:34

Georgeyporgey - your secret is safe with me ... I knew there must be some reason for you being fond of PCs because, ya know, otherwise I thought you were quite a sensible poster

LOL.

I've NEVER been into gaming. I just don't get it. My interest usually dwindles after 30 seconds / one life and I go off and sulk.

Yes, Apple do have a discount store on Wednesdays. It must be open only one day a week because they have fewer cancelled orders ? Or maybe they have fewer returns ? Hey G ? LOL.

Willow: If you or a friend ever go to the States, Apples (as well as so many other things) tend to be cheaper over there. The power adaptors on laptops are universal voltage and you can still type a pound sign instead of $ by pressing [OPTION 3].

They also do edu pricing which can knock 5% - 15% off your order. I think you can get it if your kids are at school / if you order through a teacher friend etc.

If you do visit shops to check out the interface, it would be only fair to point out that you've probably been using Windows for 5+ years and the Apple interface will look and feel different to what you know. The Apple shop in London host seminars in their rather plush theatre / auditorium space for the growing number of 'PC switchers' or those new to their Mac who want to learn how to get more out of it...

hub2dee · 15/04/2005 11:56

Hi Willow, wow... you're a woman of action, eg...

Glad that the Apple lady was helpful.

The 15 inch PB is FANTASTIC. I have the 17 because I'm on a puter all day, but it is somewhat large compared to little 12 inch thingies. The widescreen aspect of the 15 inch PB is divine.

Ref: hotmail. Web access works. Access via a 'mail plug in' in Apple's mail app I know works, but it is some independent programmer's efforts.

The situation might be different for Entourage as it comes from MS. I will try this morning for you. No promises.

Hey: isn't it time you got a PROPER e-mail provider ????

Hotmail does scuk somewhat

I'll bore you about 'dot mac' later today. Apple has a great Web site BTW loads of info...

Airport Express: Yes you need a router. It is not a router. It is wireless gateway.

Yes, PC will work cos your house will have an ORDINARY WiFi network (albeit nice and fast, if your PC card supports 54MBps, which the newer ones do)..

A shared printer can be accessed by PC / Mac - it is a shared network resource, but this kind of thing always depends on seinsible drivers, up-to-date OSes, networks being correctly set up, supported printers etc. so I couldn't in all honesty, give you a 100% guarantee.

Post your printer model, and I'll contemplate.

hub2dee · 15/04/2005 12:30

Just been playing with Entourage. 10 second setup - you literally just enter your e-mail address [email protected] for example, your password, and the thing has gone off and is downloading a couple of thousand messages as we speak. All seems to be in order, with sub-folders captured / read / not read flags set correctly, attachments available etc.

Yeah... the hotmail plug in looks fine.

If you're used to Outlook Express / Outlook (puke yuck pukey pukey) you'll be fine with Entourage.

Here's Microsoft's web stuff on their extensive line of Mac products . You'll see Entourage down there...